735 pumpkin balls

[littlejack]

Can anyone share their experiences with loading and accuracy in a rifled barrel?
I'm sure theres information in the archives, but im giving some of ya a chance to shine on their success.
Regards

[megasupermagnum]

You can use 1 3/8 oz lead shot data. I have not played with these as much this year. I have two loads I like, both in a Federal gold medal hull and Fed 209A primer. 18 gr Unique for about 1000 fps and 32 gr Bluedot I think was up around 1375 fps. For wads I use an X12X gas seal, a stack of nitro cards (I think it was 4), a scoop of PSB buffer (any buffer will do), then finally the .735" ball I tumble lubed. In my Ultra Slug Hunter, both shoots around 1 1/2" at 50 yards, 4"-5" at 100 yards, which is about as good of accuracy as I have ever got with anything.

[littlejack]

Thank you sir.
That's good shootin.
That's what I was lookin for. Right now, I have Remington Gun Club (green) and Winchester AA hulls. I think I may have a punch for the wads, as I'm not home until Sunday evening.
I've been playing with the Lyman 525 for a few years, but haven't had a consistent load that shoots me well enough. I have heard that some have had good results with the bore size balls. I've played around quite a bit with the 678 balls in wads, but again not satisfied with the results. I've read many posts from members that have hit their perfect recipe. So, I'm hoping to have better results with the big boy.
I do have a rifled barrel, but right now, I have a 20" Imp. Cyl. mounted. Oh by the way, is the Imp. Cyl. to small to shoot the 735 ball through?

[dsh1106]

I've loaded and shot about 150 rounds of .735 round ball.
This shooting was using my Browning A-Bolt slug gun with a 4-12 power scope
avg - 5/8" at 50-75 yards, 1-1/2" at 100 yards.
Longbow was nice enough to share this load data with me.
- 2 3/4" Fiocchi hull
- Winchester 209 primer
- 36 TO 38 grs. Blue Dot (limited by recoil) ****I started at 34 grains and settled at 36.5 grains *****
- X12X gas seal
- 1/2" hard card wad
- 1 x 0.125" nitro card
- .735" RB
- Roll Crimp

Scott

[littlejack]

Oh Lord, that's gotta hurt.
I've shot heavy doses of BD under the Lyman 525. Yes, they jarred my fillings a little.
Those are outstanding groups. Thank you for passing on the recipe Scott.

[too many things]

make sure the 735 will not be TOO big in a rifled bore i found in a rem 870 690 was snug
NO shot cup. if you dont have card stuff cut the peddles off 30gr of Blue dot is all i want .

[megasupermagnum]

Size is not critical for a full bore ball. As long as it is over bore, or if rifled, groove diameter. They seem to work just fine from about .002" over size, and I've gone as big as .012" oversize. .005" is about ideal. An IC choke will not be a problem at all. In my Ithaca Mag 10, I bought a "cylinder" choke from Brileys, but it is a mismarked improved cylinder. No issues at all, accuracy is the same with or without choke in that gun. Yes, you can go very heavy on the Bluedot if you want. My own load is 32 grains, I've gone up to 40. There comes a point you simply can't shoot them effectively due to recoil. If you think the Lyman was bad, well get these 600 grain balls going near the same speed, you feel it.

One way you can try is simply trim the petals off of a lead shot wad, and use this in place of the gas seal/hard card wad stack. I do this in 20 gauge with a 20S1 wad, and again a scoop of buffer to adjust the height for proper crimping. The buffer serves both an easy adjustment, as well as support for the ball. I've come to like buffer the best, some run only hard cards, some even put an upside down powder cup from a wad. I've tried felt wads, but they don't seem to do as good of a job.

[missionary5155]

OH gooodie we a-gonna go stop some marauding Datsuns !!!

135 grains of 2F through a double 12 gauge 30 inch barrels and your RB (WW) will go through 1 inch of steel plate. Range scrap will go through 8 inches of oak log.

[dsh1106]

Just a word of caution, I was using lead sled when I was shooting all but 15 or 20 of the 150 rounds.
The gun is capable of shooting those groups, but at 36.5 grains I'm only good for about 6 shots after that I get a little flinchy....
Scott

[littlejack]

Mike, we sent all the "marauding Datsuns" back to Peru. Lol Figured you needed more targets to shoot at. That 735 ball of WW's going through 1" of steel plate, is amazing. Back in our younger years, my brother and I worked in the steel shops here in Eugene Oregon. We would set steel plates against a stump at 85 yards and shoot at them with our 25-06's. We loaded 57 grains of H-4831 under a Hornady 100 grain SP. We could shoot completely through a 5/8"
T-1 plate. On a 3/4" T-1 plate, it would almost shoot through and leave a big nipple protruding out the back about 1/2" to 5/8". Pretty amazing.
Scott, I was pondering what would be the best salve to rub on my bruises when I finally get to shooting. To soon to worry about that yet. First get the mould, then cast, then load, Then shoot. Right now, working on retrieving the mould.
Thanks to all y'all for your expierienced information. Very much appreciated.

[longbow]

I took my load data from Prevision Rifle's Pile Driver slug load data. The Pile Driver was 610 grs. and Precision Rifle used up to 44 grs. of Blue Dot under that slug at a pressure of 12,500 PSI which seemed kinda high to me. The load data was a bit vague in that it said to use any new straight walled hull and primer of your choice then a wad column I forget and a full bore Pile Driver Keith style slug.

I figured with the 0.735" RB at about 575 grs. and starting load of 36 grs. of BD it would be a safe load and so it was in both my smoothbores and a borrowed rifled gun.

I got best groups using a plastic gas seal then hard card wads with a nitro card wad under the ball and roll crimp. That same load gave me 2" groups at 50 yards from rifled gun (Remington 870) and I'm sure it would have done better had I not had a long shooting session with accumulated recoil induced punchiness before I got to the rifled gun.

Recovered RB's showed a nice smooth "belt" around the equator from smoothbore and quite even crisp rifling from the Remington 870.

As for load data I settled on, 36 to 38 grs. of BD was about all the recoil I wanted. I'd say that 44 grs. of BD per Precision Rifle's info is a bit too much and high pressure under their slug but would likely be safe under the RB especially if cast from WW which is somewhat lighter than soft lead.

The 0.735" RB is oversize but there is little meat at the equator so they swage to bore quite easily. You can check yourself but using a brass rod to drive one through your barrel. It really doesn't take much to get them going.

I only shot about 15 rounds through the rifled gun so am no expert on accuracy there.

If you load the RB over a plastic wad with petals cut off put at least one .125" nitro card wad under the RB or the wad will try to wrap around it and likely fail the gas seal or tear under the ball. A small scoop of COW under the ball is also good.

Longbow

[littlejack]

Thank you Longbow. Your expierienced trials and load data is great information. That gives me another option to have for my load development, along with the other members R&D. Everyone's development and information is very much appreciated.
Thank you all.
Regards

[littlejack]

I received my .735 RB mould yesterday. It was an ebay auction item. At 62.50 to my door, I thought I did purty good on the purchase. So this morning after I emptied my Lee pot of handgun alloy, I filled it back up with pure lead. I did put a couple ounces of my bullet alloy with tin, to help the lead fill out in the mould. After getting the lead hot, and dropping four or five balls to finish heating up the mould, things really went well. I dropped 65 balls that all looked like twins. They came out beautiful, and I'm pretty picky about my cast projectiles. So I figure I dropped enough balls to pay for the mould concidering what they cost to buy. The balls averaaged 591 grains +/- .5.
Diameter averaged .733 to .734 depending on where its measured. So, I'm very pleased so far. Been scrounging around in my piles to gather items needed. I have some BlueDot, so probably going to start between 30 -35 grains. I'm not much on heavy recoil. I have two wads, the WAA12 White, for the tapered Rem. Gun Club hulls, and the Helix Cusion Driver #18 for the Win. straight wall.
Thank you all again for your sharing of knowledge. I will be using your tried and true suggestions.

[centershot]

littlejack, the AA12 wad is the factory wad in those WW AA target hulls you're using, you can use them in both the Gun Club's and the AA's. Also, I'm pretty sure the AA hulls are tapered, not straight, someone correct me if I'm wrong about that please.

[garrisonjoe]

Yes, the Win AA hulls are tapered wall hulls, and can easily use wads suited for either Winchester or Remington loading.

[littlejack]

So today, I checked to see which of the three hulls that I have would be the best fit for the .733 ball. It never dawned on me that the ball might not fit in a hull "at all".
First was the Rem. Gun Club. It would not go down in the case, without a great amount of pressure, which left a big bulge on the outside around the equator of the ball. Wall thickness average was .034.
In the Win. AA hull, the ball fit easier than the Gun Club, but still to much pressure to force it in. Wall thickness average was .029.
Lastly, was the Win. Super-X hull.
The ball just dropped in under it own weight. I'm guessing about .002 clearance. Wall thickness averaged .025. So, it looks like the Win. Super-X hull is it.
Now, I have to decide on the trimmed wads, or powder seals and spacer wads. etc, etc.
Getting closer.

[longbow]

So far my 0.735" RB loads have all been in Fiocchi hulls and no problem there.

Not sure about Remington Gun Club but I think they are a tapered like the Win AA. Best to use straight walled hulls.

Longbow

[garrisonjoe]

Remington Gun Club - I think they are a tapered like the Win AA

Yes they are.

[GBertolet]

40 gr of Blue Dot, with a .737 RB ( that's what they drop out a from my Lyman .735 mold ), works for me in my rifled NEF Slug Hunter. 600 gr RB @ 1300 fps, and 10 dead deer. I can go to a heavier charge, but what's the point. All of my shots so far, are 75 yards or less, and I had one deer shot lengthwise, with complete penetration. The 10 + pounds of weight of the Slug Hunter, does mitigate the heavy recoil somewhat. I have used both 2 3/4 and 3" hulls with this load, and am using the 3" now, as the wad heights stack up better for me. I bought a bag of 100 3" primed hulls from Ballistic Products for about $12, and just use the new hulls for hunting loads. I think they are Fiocchi. I do roll crimp all rounds.

[littlejack]

So, before starting to load up the big lead balls, I drove one down the rifled bore of my 870. Lands and grooves around the equator looked good. Sharp and prominent.
So last weekend, I loaded up a few rounds in the Win. Super-X hulls. I started my powder charge at 32 grains of BD. I used the Helix Cushion Driver wad for straight wall hulls, with the spacers under the ball and petals cut off below the equator. This wad has a short section of cushion, so I added four .045 cards for the spacers. Dropped a lubed ball in and a 6 star crimp.
Shooting at 30 yards, I wasn't shooting for group, even though the first ball hit 1" from dead center, and the second just next to it. Recoil was not bad, and no pressure signs.
Sight were blurry with my 70 year old eyes.
Next trip, I will have a scope mounted and shoot for group.
I made an error when I first checked my hulls, to find out which one/ones the ball would fit properly.
(The ball will not fit in the Rem. Gun Club hull).
I stated that the ball wouldn't fit the WAA hull either. I was using a cut off hull where the walls were thicker. (I keep many different makes of hulls cut to different lengths, and split down the middle, to check comparisons of hulls in the book).
After checking the ball fit in its seated position, I found that the WAA hull would accept the ball.
I bumped the BD powder charge to 35 grains. Yesterday, I found some Rem. RP12 wads that I forgot that I had. These wads are referenced in the Lyman 4th Edition with a
1 3/8 oz load. I cut the petals off flush with the bottom of the cup, and added three .045 cards for spacers. I'll get back with the range results.