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Thread: The Land of Nod and the origin of the different Races

  1. #21
    Boolit Buddy Snow ninja's Avatar
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    This is my problem with this part of the forum, and I've stated it before several times. They don't want a "discussion" unless it 100% aligns with what they already believe. As Don said, they don't take into account that we're all on our own spiritual journey, and some of us are still trying to find our way. Just because we ask a question that may be different than your view on things, doesn’t mean that we are trolling. I have questions, and if you can’t answer them without just saying I’m being ignorant and trolling, then maybe you need to look at why you can’t answer them. As I said before, blind faith does not work for me. It seems that to be included in this group discussion, you need to be on rung 67 of the holier than thou ladder.
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  2. #22
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    You can not begin a thread by telling a lie.
    You can not intelligently discuss a subject if you are not familiar with it.
    You can not own a thread and not expect others to comment, especially when you start with a lie and are unfamiliar with the subject matter.
    This thread, and others like it, do not advance knowledge or the forum, since starting from a place of nowhere will end up nowhere.
    Your purpose is not to learn, it is to be a provocateur. However, it would seem that others agree with your approach---so, enjoy.

  3. #23
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    This thread has explained a lot to me. I now see how a baseball umpire can call someone out when to my eyes and ears they clearly beat the ball to the base. This is a way of saying that I disagree with what the OP has put forward as facts after reading the same verses I have.
    [The Montana Gianni] Front sight and squeeze

  4. #24
    Boolit Master
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    Snow, do you really think Christians demand everyone else agree on every jot and tittle? Not at all! Truth is, we strongly disagree on a lot of jots and tittles but we all agree on essential Christian principles; if we don't hold to crucial doctrines as truth we can't rightly call ourselves Christian can we?!

    I'll use different paths to illustrate why we don't/won't take wildly divergent views of Biblical truths seriously. You probably know a lot of people truly believe the world is flat; many believe man has not been to the moon; many believe life on earth is going to burn to a crisp if we don't quite driving autos and heating our homes but none of that is true, it's nonsense. So, those of us who know otherwise simply cannot honestly pretend to "respect" known wrong views; nope, that just ain't gonna happen.

    Christians can (and usually do) respect mistaken individuals in person but we don't/can't respect their wrong "beliefs" and it's unfair of them to expect us to do differently; please understand, this Christian stuff is serious.

    To the offended others I say we are living in different worlds because their "make believe" spiritual games have no serious place in reality. A big problem the mistaken often fall into is assuming anyone who disagrees with them is, ipso facto, some kind of "hater" and that's also dumm.

  5. #25
    Boolit Master


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    So I have been watching some youtubes, their premise is that there was an advanced race here before the current race, whether they looked like us or just somewhat resembled us I don't know. Of course those so inclined lean aliens, but I tend to lean human, just more advanced, or at the most, a different evolutionary branch of human. But a bunch of unexplained tech has been used to build structures that our current tech would have problems with, even today, and it is under structures built by subsequent civilizations which is not as refined as that which it is built upon. This type of evidence is seen across the globe, Egypt, Asia, South America etc, and similar enough that it would make you think they had some sort of communication with each other.

    So what does this have to do with the bible you say?, well, IMO, many of the stories that they were written by a people that did their best to explain what was passed down to them orally and what they may have experienced themselves. So Eden, Land of Nod, heck even Atlantis may have existed well before the surviving peoples learned to write again.
    "Freedom is the sure possession of those alone who have the courage to defend it."
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  6. #26
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Der Gebirgsjager View Post
    That's odd... I think my bible says that the different races descended from the children of Noah, and is pretty specific about which children were the fathers of which races. But-- you have to read that far to find it.

    Everyone who wasn't on the ark drowned. So whatever Cain did was of no consequence.
    I know that maybe you believe God can do the impossible and I do too but is seems unlikely that God created enough water to submerge the mountain peaks all over the world. The great flood did not kill everyone who was not on the Ark.

    Where did the water go when the flood receded?

    Tim
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  7. #27
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    Perplexing? The Bible is a spiritual book, it's not a science or history of the world book so there's a lot of things it doesn't address. Do you think man's questions of the origins of races and young vs. old earth are vital spiritual issues?
    Anything that cast doubt about the accuracy of the Bibles is a vital spiritual issue.

    Tim
    Words are weapons sharper than knives - INXS

    The pen is mightier than the sword - Edward Bulwer-Lytton

    The tongue is mightier than the blade - Euripides

  8. #28
    Boolit Master flyingmonkey35's Avatar
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    Where did the water go when the flood receded?

    Tim[/QUOTE]


    I don't want to hijack this thread. So I will give you a thought on that one.

    What if it's just a story that was told about animal merchant priest named Noah that was on a boat that got swept out to sea in a great storm.

    And after land fall his family eventually broke off and separated.

    Thus a legend was born


    Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

  9. #29
    Boolit Master
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    What if it all true, but it's lost to us because WE can't explain it? What if the earth was a very different place before the flood of Noah and things we think of as normal today where abnormal prior to the flood? What if, what if, what if, what if, what if, what if, what if, and on and on.

  10. #30
    Boolit Grand Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by dtknowles View Post
    Anything that cast doubt about the accuracy of the Bibles is a vital spiritual issue.

    Tim
    Tim,
    You have gone to the core of what upsets many people...and that is the inerrancy of the Bible. If one part is not "true", then what other parts may not be "true". It is what kept me an atheist for many decades.

    I now have faith in God but that does not require me to accept every verse in the Bible as 100% correct. Many who believe in the inerrancy of the Bible wind up doing handstands to justify their position and the most common rationalization is that we do not know what we do not know. They use that thinking to dismiss what we do know.

    Should we accept Genesis as 100% fact? I cannot.
    Should we accept slavery as acceptable and honor our masters? I cannot.
    Should we accept the authority of a government even if it unjust or evil? I cannot.
    And so on and so on.

    Even scholars disagree on the meaning of parts of the Bible. Are they stupid or just ignorant? If highly intelligent people who believe in God disagree, what does that tell us? The United Methodist church has been torn apart by the issue of gays and I know people on both sides of the issue who honor the Lord. We have over a thousand Christian denominations...why...if the Bible is so pure and simple.

    Those who say they know the Word, know it within their frame of reference. They may ignore, or worse rationalize, what does not make sense. And there is nothing wrong with that if it brings them closer to God. God has given us a way to salvation that does not require we understand everything in the Bible. That works for me.

    If I had to believe in every word written (literally) in Genesis, I would still be an atheist. I cannot believe the universe was not created in six 24 hours days....but that is irrelevant to having faith in God.
    Don Verna


  11. #31
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by dverna View Post
    Even scholars disagree on the meaning of parts of the Bible. Are they stupid or just ignorant? If highly intelligent people who believe in God disagree, what does that tell us?
    "Scholars" are people, they can be just as silly and/or dishonest as anyone else. Just because some people study scripture as literature doesn't make them Christian, nor do many such egg-heads have much common sense.

    Many highly intelligent people have the same social and professional (ego) pursuits as the rest of us and some of them love to drag red herring distractions across the trail to make themselves seem smarter than they are.

    The United Methodist church has been torn apart by the issue of gays and I know people on both sides of the issue who honor the Lord.
    I know some of those people too; remember that not all Christians are sweet nor are all non-believers jerks.

    The UMC as it exists today is, like our government education system, dominated by ultra-liberal social scientist non-believers. They are largely driven by what they want (and demand) to be true no matter how much scripture says otherwise.

    It's true that there are quite a few Biblical topics that are less than clear. Thus, we may honestly vary about what they mean but homosexuality is not one of them. Some folk are Biblically ignorant and many folk just lie but there is no way for anyone who knows what he's talking about to honestly say the Bible is less than totally clear on that topic.

    We have over a thousand Christian denominations...why...if the Bible is so pure and simple.
    That "over a thousand Christian denominations" is an oft mentioned figure but it's just another of the egg-head's lies. To get to that level requires that every independent or non-aligned congregation is another denomination; that's not true and the people who proclaim it know they're lying.
    Last edited by 1hole; 08-01-2020 at 10:16 AM.

  12. #32
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by dverna View Post
    Tim,
    You have gone to the core of what upsets many people...and that is the inerrancy of the Bible. If one part is not "true", then what other parts may not be "true". It is what kept me an atheist for many decades.

    I now have faith in God but that does not require me to accept every verse in the Bible as 100% correct. Many who believe in the inerrancy of the Bible wind up doing handstands to justify their position and the most common rationalization is that we do not know what we do not know. They use that thinking to dismiss what we do know.

    Should we accept Genesis as 100% fact? I cannot.
    Should we accept slavery as acceptable and honor our masters? I cannot.
    Should we accept the authority of a government even if it unjust or evil? I cannot.
    And so on and so on.

    Even scholars disagree on the meaning of parts of the Bible. Are they stupid or just ignorant? If highly intelligent people who believe in God disagree, what does that tell us? The United Methodist church has been torn apart by the issue of gays and I know people on both sides of the issue who honor the Lord. We have over a thousand Christian denominations...why...if the Bible is so pure and simple.

    Those who say they know the Word, know it within their frame of reference. They may ignore, or worse rationalize, what does not make sense. And there is nothing wrong with that if it brings them closer to God. God has given us a way to salvation that does not require we understand everything in the Bible. That works for me.

    If I had to believe in every word written (literally) in Genesis, I would still be an atheist. I cannot believe the universe was not created in six 24 hours days....but that is irrelevant to having faith in God.
    Yes, much of the Bibles are irrelevant in regards to having faith in God. Even 1Hole points that out. You can believe in and have faith in God even if there were no Bibles.

    I have a problem with people using the Bibles as a weapon, cherry picking and misinterpreting passages to condemn or justify social behaviors they like or dislike. Another problem I have with not so much the Bibles but again cherry picking passages so that they believe that they don't have to live like Jesus but only believe in Jesus to be saved. They believe that Jesus will defend them to God because they love and believe in Jesus.

    If they truly love Jesus then they would do more to help the poor and do less to oppress the marginalized and disadvantaged people of the world.

    "In one provocative parable, Jesus says that when he comes in all his glory and sits on his throne before all the nations, “he will separate the people one from another as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats” (Matthew 25:32 NIV). The sheep are honored for caring for Jesus in his time of need."

    Confused, they ask Jesus when they cared for him. His response is a powerful picture of Jesus’ profound concern for the poor:

    “‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me’” (Matthew 25:40 NIV).
    These least of brothers are not the people who don't really need your help, these are the people who have been down trodden and oppressed. Helping and being nice to privileged people does not count. You have to help the people who are really suffering.

    As recipients of his judgment, the goats are equally confused—when did they see the Lord and not care for him?

    “Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me” (Matthew 25:45 NIV).

    Jesus equated serving or neglecting the poor with serving or neglecting God. When you vote or donate to charity or perform acts of community service do you focus your efforts on helping and serving the poor. If you don't then you are neglecting Jesus and God. When you vote do you vote to help the poor or do you vote to help yourself. How does your church spend your charity. How much goes to keeping the church you go to running and how much goes to help the poor. Why do you think the Jewish Church of Israel was so afraid of Jesus. It was because the Church was all about itself and not about helping the poor only the rich who contributed to the Church.

    I have been reminded here very many times that I cannot be save by good works only by a love of Jesus. Jesus is telling you that if you don't do good works in his name you will not be saved.

    I don't believe that Jesus is the Christ and I don't think he rose from the dead but I love the character that is Jesus and do good works in his name. No I don't think Jesus will be beside God's throne in heaven but I do believe that the afterlife will be filled with people who really love Jesus. God does not sit on a throne and heaven is not like most people imagine (read the thread about fishing in heaven).

    Tim
    Words are weapons sharper than knives - INXS

    The pen is mightier than the sword - Edward Bulwer-Lytton

    The tongue is mightier than the blade - Euripides

  13. #33
    Boolit Master
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    You miss the point of "loving/believing" in Jesus as the single focus of salvation; lip service doesn't get it but neither does doing good things to earn an entry ticket into heaven get it. Those who TRULY put their trust in Jesus gets a fully pre-paid entry ticket, and they alone.

    Your very common flaw is presuming those who profess with their lips but not their lives. Those who's lives have been changed - spiritually born again - as new creatures in life will then do good things because of the spiritual change.

    All of the "do and don't" check lists we sweat about so much simply show us how far we have been changed by the indwelling Holy Spirit. No meaningful change in our life (heart) means no real change in our spirit and that's the end of it.

    What awaits us in Heaven? The eternal heaven will be on a rebuilt earth with rebuilt humans having many of the same pleasures and pursuits we have now, including white horse riding. That's all we are told so that's all we can know for sure.

    There may or may not be fishing or hang gliding in heaven but it's certain we won't be sitting around on clouds playing harps.
    Last edited by 1hole; 08-01-2020 at 10:48 AM.

  14. #34
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    You miss the point of "loving/believing" in Jesus as the single focus of salvation; lip service doesn't get it but neither does doing good things to earn an entry ticket into heaven get it. Those who TRULY put their trust in Jesus gets a fully pre-paid entry ticket, and they alone.

    Your very common flaw is presuming those who profess with their lips but not their lives. Those who's lives have been changed - spiritually born again - as new creatures in life will then do good things because of the spiritual change.

    All of the "do and don't" check lists we sweat about so much simply show us how far we have been changed by the indwelling Holy Spirit. No meaningful change in our life (heart) means no real change in our spirit and that's the end of it.

    What awaits us in Heaven? The eternal heaven will be on a rebuilt earth with rebuilt humans having many of the same pleasures and pursuits we have now, including white horse riding. That's all we are told so that's all we can know for sure.

    There may or may not be fishing or hang gliding in heaven but it's certain we won't be sitting around on clouds playing harps.
    I think this may be one of the rare posts in which we agree.

    Tim
    Words are weapons sharper than knives - INXS

    The pen is mightier than the sword - Edward Bulwer-Lytton

    The tongue is mightier than the blade - Euripides

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Der Gebirgsjager View Post
    You can not begin a thread by telling a lie.
    You can not intelligently discuss a subject if you are not familiar with it.
    You can not own a thread and not expect others to comment, especially when you start with a lie and are unfamiliar with the subject matter.
    This thread, and others like it, do not advance knowledge or the forum, since starting from a place of nowhere will end up nowhere.
    Your purpose is not to learn, it is to be a provocateur. However, it would seem that others agree with your approach---so, enjoy.
    So now you are calling me a liar, eh?
    Back it up.
    Where's the lie?
    I gave nothing but my opinions on the two topics presented.

  16. #36
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by MT Gianni View Post
    This thread has explained a lot to me. I now see how a baseball umpire can call someone out when to my eyes and ears they clearly beat the ball to the base. This is a way of saying that I disagree with what the OP has put forward as facts after reading the same verses I have.
    You are misrespresenting what I wrote.

    What did I put forward as fact?
    Reread Post #1.
    What I wrote were my opinions.

    Also....
    The Land of Nod and the origin of the different Races.
    What's your thoughts or opinions on those topics?

  17. #37
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omega View Post
    So I have been watching some youtubes, their premise is that there was an advanced race here before the current race, whether they looked like us or just somewhat resembled us I don't know. Of course those so inclined lean aliens, but I tend to lean human, just more advanced, or at the most, a different evolutionary branch of human. But a bunch of unexplained tech has been used to build structures that our current tech would have problems with, even today, and it is under structures built by subsequent civilizations which is not as refined as that which it is built upon. This type of evidence is seen across the globe, Egypt, Asia, South America etc, and similar enough that it would make you think they had some sort of communication with each other.

    So what does this have to do with the bible you say?, well, IMO, many of the stories that they were written by a people that did their best to explain what was passed down to them orally and what they may have experienced themselves. So Eden, Land of Nod, heck even Atlantis may have existed well before the surviving peoples learned to write again.
    I've seen several episodes on the program Ancient Aliens that shows ancient ruins that have engineers, etc., puzzled on how it was accomplished. Especially some of the cut stone designs that look like a modern day laser beam was used. Also, moving those enormous boulders is mind boggling how it could have been done by people of that time.
    The story of Atlantis and it's advanced civilization is also suspect for some of that stuff.
    Then, the alien intervention with man on earth could also be a part of that.

    Someone posted about aliens seeding the planet with the different races.
    Maybe so, I don't know.

    If there was a more advanced civilization on Earth before us, then I would expect to see some documentation left by them. Not on papyrus but on a more modern medium.
    But, none found to my knowledge so the mystery continues.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    If you take this story as being a historical fact:

    It was early in the history of man's creation. Abel had no children at this point. Cain and Abel were most likely the same age as the Bible suggests they were twins. Therefore, Cain probably had no children at this point either.

    Cain's complaint that other people would kill him looked to the future when the earth would be more populated and he had become notorious for his crime. Some might want justice.

    Placing a name on where Cain went (i.e., The Land of Nod) could have been for the original audience of Genesis who knew where that place was or had heard of it (the area was antediluvian, of course). The word "Nod" means to wander. So this area could have been named for Cain's wanderings. On the other hand, it might not have been a physical location at all, just a playful term (e.g., think of someone in La La Land).
    What a great post! I agree 100%.

  19. #39
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    What a great post! I agree 100%.
    LOL!

    What's your thinking on who Cain married when he went to the Land of Nod.
    Descendant of Adam and Eve?...or?

  20. #40
    Boolit Master


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    Quote Originally Posted by Rizzo View Post
    LOL!

    What's your thinking on who Cain married when he went to the Land of Nod.
    Descendant of Adam and Eve?...or?
    If you take the story as being a historical fact, Cain would have had to marry his sister or other close relative. Genesis says he had descendants.

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