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Thread: Glock is coming out with the Gen 5 .40 S&W versions this Fall.

  1. #21
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    So to recap...

    We started with a thread about Glock introducing a Gen 5 chambered in 40 S&W,
    Then we took the extremely predicable turn to Glock vs. any other handgun on the planet.
    Then we went down the 1911 path (pretty much obligatory)
    And we are now at the required 9mm vs. 45 ACP caliber war..............

    So I guess the next step is to talk about the incredibly important differences between domestic manufacturers of trucks followed by preferences in BBQ styles.

  2. #22
    Boolit Buddy KVO's Avatar
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    To contribute something of substance to the topic...

    The Gen 5 frame notably deletes one of the locking block pins which was originally added to cope with additional stresses imparted by the .40S&W. It will be interesting to see if these will be reinstated for the .40 gen5 models or if some other (or any?) change is implemented.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by KVO View Post
    To contribute something of substance to the topic...

    The Gen 5 frame notably deletes one of the locking block pins which was originally added to cope with additional stresses imparted by the .40S&W. It will be interesting to see if these will be reinstated for the .40 gen5 models or if some other (or any?) change is implemented.
    Word is that the .40 S&W versions will have a 2mm thicker slide and frame to compensate. Which of course means a whole new slew of holsters required for the new models.
    "Luck don't live out here. Wolves don't kill the unlucky deer; they kill the weak ones..." Jeremy Renner in Wind River

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Idaho45guy View Post
    Word is that the .40 S&W versions will have a 2mm thicker slide and frame to compensate. Which of course means a whole new slew of holsters required for the new models.
    If that is true, it will kill it IMHO. Smarter to stay with the older versions.
    Don Verna


  5. #25
    Boolit Master pmer's Avatar
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    I thought the 40 SW was dead...too knarly for 9mm shooters.
    Oh great, another thread that makes me spend money.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmer View Post
    I thought the 40 SW was dead...too knarly for 9mm shooters.
    Most people will shoot the 9mm better because most people are not shooters and most people are recoil averse. When I went to the FrontSight 4 day course I took my G22 but had a Lone Wolf 9mm barrel in it as well as the proper 9mm mags.

    I did it for two reasons. First we had to use factory ammunition and there was a significant difference in cost between 9mm and .40. Second, I wanted to score in the top 3% to get the "Distinguished" Cert....which I did. Even though I shoot quite a bit, the 9mm gives me faster recovery so better scores.

    In real life, or death, the .40 is a better round IMHO. My fiancé cannot handle it well, as the recoil is a bit much for her, so she is better with another caliber. A lot of LEO's have seen the same thing and moved back to the 9mm. Having more women enter law enforcement has had consequences.

    But that is good news for those who like the .40. Good guns are becoming available as the lemmings rush to the 9mm.

    I would never buy a 9mm Glock. Better to get a .40 and add a $100 barrel and a few mags to shoot cheap 9mm.
    Don Verna


  7. #27
    Boolit Master pmer's Avatar
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    That was tongue in cheek for me. I bet it would be hard to find that occasion where a 9mm would fail and a .40 would pass, both with good ammo.

    I have a M&P 2.0 in 40 S&W and a 155 JHP load thats easy shooting and the 175 grain, Lyman 401043 if I want to kick it up a notch. It also feeds the NOE 403200 good. But these come out kinda big for the Smith&Wesson especially after powder coating.
    Last edited by pmer; 07-07-2020 at 08:43 AM.
    Oh great, another thread that makes me spend money.

  8. #28
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    Agree with Lloyd, in all my years teaching marksmanship (military and LE) I never found anyone [man, woman or child (old enough to be shooting)] that couldn't shoot a M1911 45 ACP with service level ammunition effectively with proper instruction. Once they got past the fear instilled by BS, myth and misguided information of the "horrible recoil" they were quite able to shoot the 45 ACP without any problems. ALL of the female LEOs who were given small framed 38s "they could handle" much preferred the M1911 45 ACPs, especially my Combat Commander. After minimal training they all "qualified" with higher scores than they ever had with the small framed 38s.
    Larry Gibson

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  9. #29
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    Another 40 caliber Luddite here, my main carry piece being an M and P 2.0 3.6 in 40.

    Like the size, find it shootable at speed, take comfort in the power/efficiency and large expanded diameter of the HP’s I fire from the piece. Magazines are cheaper than the 9mm iterations due to lower demand.

    All good for me. Glad to be able to roll how I want rather than in lockstep with the masses. Definitely doing me.

  10. #30
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    Lloyd, you have stated the obvious. A more powerful pistol caliber is always a better performer. I never bought into the rationale that "with proper bullets the 9mm performs as well as the .40". Put those same designed bullets in the .40 and it will still have an edge.

    The "gun experts" get paid to push stuff to increase sales. The wholesale move from 9mm to the .40 was silly when it happened. And now the move back to 9mm is just as silly. It's not like LEO's shoot a 1000's rounds a year to qualify and they will save any money.

    And I do not buy into the recoil issue for ladies and "men" who cannot shoot the .40. It would have been cheaper to have an LEO .40 loading with the same recoil as the 9mm. That would have given LEO's a choice of what to use in one platform. My Glock uses the same recoil spring whether I shoot 9mm or .40. They already make reduced recoil shotgun loads for LEO use.
    Don Verna


  11. #31
    Boolit Grand Master FergusonTO35's Avatar
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    I think the .40 is a sweet cartridge for boolits. I feed my Glock 22 (pieced together from used parts) the Lee 401-175-TC over 4.3 grains Bullseye for an accurate and easy to shoot 920 fps. If you can't kill something with that then you need a rifle or shotgun.
    Currently casting and loading: .32 Auto, .380 Auto, .38 Special, 9X19, .357 Magnum, .257 Roberts, 6.5 Creedmoor, .30 WCF, .308 WCF, .45-70.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    Glocks are fine guns for those that like them. I owned a Glock 17 I got on a great deal about 15 years back. I have zero idea as to what Generation it was. I shot a few rounds through it for a function check more than anything. It was then regulated to it's intended purpose, a truck gun. Later, I found the Springfield XD-45 Tactical much more to my liking and it took the Glocks place. Adios Mr. 17.

    What has amazed me about Glock the company. It seems many people would be highly interested in a single stack, full sized .45 Auto that utilizes an 8 round magazine and perhaps a thumb or grip safety. But that's just my thoughts when it comes to a Glock.


    Murphy
    I think you are describing the 220 Sig. Single stack with 8 round mags. No safety but with double action single action it might not be needed. The Glock just dreams about a trigger like the single action trigger that the Sig has.

  13. #33
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    My 1911 came with a crisp trigger with great reset and almost no creep, but heavy at 5.5 lbs for a target pistol. No problem. With my Glocks, it's a $20 part and ten minutes installing it and polishing a couple of spots.

    With the 1911, it's sending it to a gunsmith for months and spending half the price of a Glock.
    "Luck don't live out here. Wolves don't kill the unlucky deer; they kill the weak ones..." Jeremy Renner in Wind River

  14. #34
    Boolit Master Drm50's Avatar
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    Let’s face it, Glocks are gut busters and that’s the only use for them other than playing games. They have no or little use for field or serious target. Glocks are strictly a tool, along with all the other plastic pistols. For me I’ll stick with my rusty old 1911s and Brn HPs. I sometimes go a whole week without getting in a gunfight, so they serve me well.

    I have never thought to much about recoil of handguns. I have shot magnum pistols as a kid and don’t consider 44mg as severe recoil. Bigger they get noticeable and some Contenders are nasty with Rifle cartridges. In my experience, unless the person is very interested in shooting the 1911 is the hardest one for them to master. Caliber aside.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by dverna View Post
    Lloyd, you have stated the obvious. A more powerful pistol caliber is always a better performer. I never bought into the rationale that "with proper bullets the 9mm performs as well as the .40". Put those same designed bullets in the .40 and it will still have an edge.

    The "gun experts" get paid to push stuff to increase sales. The wholesale move from 9mm to the .40 was silly when it happened. And now the move back to 9mm is just as silly. It's not like LEO's shoot a 1000's rounds a year to qualify and they will save any money.

    And I do not buy into the recoil issue for ladies and "men" who cannot shoot the .40. It would have been cheaper to have an LEO .40 loading with the same recoil as the 9mm. That would have given LEO's a choice of what to use in one platform. My Glock uses the same recoil spring whether I shoot 9mm or .40. They already make reduced recoil shotgun loads for LEO use.
    I think agencies are always looking for an excuse to buy new toys more than anything else. The fact that Glock gives them prices nobody else can match seals the deal.
    Currently casting and loading: .32 Auto, .380 Auto, .38 Special, 9X19, .357 Magnum, .257 Roberts, 6.5 Creedmoor, .30 WCF, .308 WCF, .45-70.

  16. #36
    Boolit Grand Master FergusonTO35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drm50 View Post
    I sometimes go a whole week without getting in a gunfight, so they serve me well.
    Dude, do you live on a desert island or something?
    Currently casting and loading: .32 Auto, .380 Auto, .38 Special, 9X19, .357 Magnum, .257 Roberts, 6.5 Creedmoor, .30 WCF, .308 WCF, .45-70.

  17. #37
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    It's like deciding which is better; Ford or Chevy. They both work. If you like apples, go with apples. If you like oranges, go with oranges.

  18. #38
    Boolit Grand Master FergusonTO35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petrol & Powder View Post
    So to recap...

    We started with a thread about Glock introducing a Gen 5 chambered in 40 S&W,
    Then we took the extremely predicable turn to Glock vs. any other handgun on the planet.
    Then we went down the 1911 path (pretty much obligatory)
    And we are now at the required 9mm vs. 45 ACP caliber war..............

    So I guess the next step is to talk about the incredibly important differences between domestic manufacturers of trucks followed by preferences in BBQ styles.
    Actually, we will be trying to decide whether the 5.56 NATO is the greatest military cartridge ever or a deathtrap for our troops.
    Currently casting and loading: .32 Auto, .380 Auto, .38 Special, 9X19, .357 Magnum, .257 Roberts, 6.5 Creedmoor, .30 WCF, .308 WCF, .45-70.

  19. #39
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    I feel compelled to add my .02 to this discussion.

    The .40 S&W is a wonderful cartridge which has been deemed Obsolete by gun writers who get paid to write thing to bolster sales, so that the decision to convert back to 9MM is more reasonable, when anyone with a brain knows that it is only about Ammo Cost!

    i have been a Defense Contractor for the last 30 years. I bid on contracts frequently. whomever posts the lowest bid gets the contract and usually if they out bid me it is because they are offering an inferior product to what I am bidding on and so far it hasn't made one IOTA of difference. APPLES Vs Oranges who ever offers the cheapest Fruit wins!

    I recently got out bid on a Contract that should have been worth @$58K it was for 1 ton Ingersol-Rand Chain hoists that are specially modified for loading the RAM Missiles into the Launcher. (see pic) Last time they were bought directly from IR they went for $7800 + each!

    I was quoted $795 From IR for the same Unmodified Chain Hoists which then had to be completely Disassembled, Painted, Reassembled with a new clutch, which IR is pretty proud of, and newly plated chains, and then load tested. I bid $5800 ea which was @$2000 less than IR got for them not 1 year ago, but lost the Contract to a Tool Distributor who bid them at $735 ea!!! Which was $60 less than I could have bought them for before they were modded!

    When I complained to the buyer, he sent the whole thing up to a "Technical Specialist " who determined that the cheap outfits product was OK. If someone drops a $Million RAM/Sidewinder Missile on the deck and it goes off, it will kill about 10 people, but cost for a stupid tool matters more!

    I have Rebuilt every single one of these Chain Hoists in the Fleet over the last 20 years, and they were all rebuilt to a Specification Drawing,,, which included all the changes I included in my bid which I sent to the buyer. The ones they bought had no changes made to them and they were sent out to the Fleet like that anyway.

    The units supplied to the Navy were not modified in any way and even though I made it perfectly clear that what they bought was not acceptable to the NAVY, they bought them anyway. F me!

    So if you don't think it's all about cost you are severely mis-informed. And now they have a Computer running that whole show and it is really all about cost now, as it won't let anything thru that even has cost of living increases added to stuff that hasn't been bought for 10 years!

    Life sucks right now as they aren't buying anything.

    Randy
    Last edited by W.R.Buchanan; 07-13-2020 at 06:03 PM.
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
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  20. #40
    Boolit Grand Master
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    Yes.

    If 40 was as cheap as nine all the complaints about unmanageable recoil would miraculously disappear, I think. And the larger expanded bullet diameter implying a larger permanent wound cavity and the increase in power would also be deemed worth it.

    Money does matter most of all.

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