25-45 Sharps and Win 296

[OutHuntn84]

About to be loading 25-45 Sharps and was not very impressed with any of the published data out there. So I booted up my computer with Quickloads and started playing with powders to see which one suited my fancy. Ultimately I ended up with Winchester 296, which is near the same or is the same or entirely different that H110, depending who you ask, but I am not interested in that discussion. It seems to be very suitable powder for this cartridge to reach the velocity I want and not have to compress the charge to get there.

Does anyone have a working knowledge of using 296 in rifle cartridges? I know it is predominately a magnum and 410 powder, but by QL data it appears to be right up my alley. Thoughts?

[rintinglen]

What pressure are you looking at? 296/H-110 work best at pressures >25,000 < 50000 psi. I would think you'd be better served with H-335, WW-748, AA2230 or one of the newer .223 powders. As I under stand it, it is essentially a modern AR version round that is basically a ballistic equivalent of the 250-3000, only running at 52,000 psi rather than 45,000 psi. It doesn't sound like a good candidate for a cast boolit, but should make a great jacketed deer cartridge. I'll be watching this one with interest.

[OutHuntn84]

Thanks for the input!
I want to be running around the 50-55k psi and 3000fps out of a 20" barrel. Theoretically, QL says, with 296 I can push a 75gr V max just over 3,000 fps in that pressure range and still only use around 90% of the available capacity. Which should give me enough wiggle room to find the right "node". So that is the dream / theory. Just need to make sure there aren't any blind spots i am missing before I go buy powder.

The powders you mentioned are great powders and I was really hoping 748 or AA2230 were going to be the winners, but alas even compressed they top out not far beyond 2500 fps. What I found as I went through powders was if they did not over pressure around 2500 fps they would require a compressed load to achieve 2700 fps.

[RU shooter]

Witha rifle length gas system you may have a issue being that's a rather fast powder to be used in this application. Just my own thoughts but 4198 or RE7 would be better suited

[OutHuntn84]

Running a rifle length tube w/adjustable gas block. With the burn rates of 296 and H110 being so similar i didn't even consider it as a possible problem. Thanks for bringing it to mind though!!!

I cant' remember the data but I tried 4198 and RE7 and they both fell short of what I need. Which was disappointing because I have 2#s of 4198 and no pet load to put it to use. Guess I will have to get another gun for that powder lol.

[RoyEllis]

For whatever it's worth, here's my notes on some 25/45 load work-ups

25x45 loads


100 gr Speer SPBT (16-inch barrel)

25.5gr W748 = 2350 fps
26.0gr W748 = 2411 fps
26.5gr W748 = 2435 fps
27.0gr W748 = 2475 fps
27.5gr W748 = 2510 fps
28.5gr W748 = 2548 fps

100 gr Speer SPBT (16 inch 1:10 twist barrel)

23.0gr H4895 = 2294 fps
23.5gr H4895 = 2336 fps
24.0gr H4895 = 2350 fps
24.5gr H4895 = 2400 fps
25.0gr H4895 = 2463 fps
25.5gr H4895 = 2505 fps

75 gr Hornaday V-Max (16 inch 1:10 twist barrel

25.5gr H4895 = 2560 fps
26.0gr H4895 = 2600 fps
26.5gr H4895 = 2678 fps
27.0gr H4895 = 2728 fps
27.5gr H4895 = 2803 fps

75 gr Hornaday V-Max (16-inch barrel)
for starting load reduce powder charge by 5%
21.9gr IMR4227 = 3020 fps
Primers were round and brass look good.

87 gr Speer TNT (16-inch barrel)
for starting load reduce powder charge by 5%
21.9gr IMR4227 = 2840 fps
Primers just starting to flatten edges and brass look good. For my rifle, I would reduce this load by 0.2 to 0.5gr for general use.

IMR4198 Speer 87g Hot-Cor Spitzer SP
Load =vel (fps)
20.0 2495
20.5 2531
21.0 2585
21.5 2663
22.0 2704

Hodgdon H335, Speer 100 gr SPBT (16 inch 1:10 twist barrel)
Charge
wt.(g)-------vel. (fps)
24.8---------2460
25.7---------2560
25.9---------2581
26.1---------2604
26.5---------2624

75g Hornaday VMAX seated to 2.255 COL. (16 inch 1:10 twist barrel)
Charge Reloader-7
wt.(g)–––vel. (fps)
25.0––––2890
25.5––––2940
26.0––––3000
26.5––––3016––-velocity curve flattening out...Over Max load??
27.0––––3079 OVER MAX

100 gr Speer SPBT (16 inch 1:10 twist barrel) seated to 2.255 COL. (16 inch 1:10 twist barrel)
Charge Hodgdon Benchmark
wt.(g)–––vel. (fps)
23.8––––2364
24.5––––2411
25.1––––2494 small velocity deviation +/- 5 fps for 3 shot string
25.5––––2518 small velocity deviation +/- 2 fps for 3 shot string

[cwlongshot]

I have been shootingbthis one for a couple years now and I like it.

My powders of Choice are as follows. AA2200, AR Comp, Bench Mark and H335. Many others will work and may prove better for YOU but for me a Hornady 110 FTX and a worked up charge of 2200 hits 2650 fps. I have ELD-X 110 inbound and will work up with that. Its nearly 100 better BC will ad nearly 100 yards to my 1000 fpe.

Accuracy?? I defy anyone to do better. My 20" Sharps HB will shoot 3/8 MOA ALL DAY its a 1/2 MOA gun.

Its only hot a few deer under its belt but that's on me as I dont take it all the time.

CW

[OutHuntn84]

RoyEllis - That information just saved me 6 months of R&D. Thank you so much for taking the time to share that info!!!

[OutHuntn84]

cwlongshot - Thanks for the info, I will definitely have to look at those powders when I go to develop a hunting load. My lady love and I just built a matching pair both with the 20" sharps barrels. I havent shot mine more than a test fire, but she is already stacking dime sized groups at 100 yards with hers. So needless to say I am impressed with it.

[kenton]

It seems like Hodgdon's CFE Black might be in the right range.

[cwlongshot]

Awesome man enjoy!! Mine is a 20" stainless Sharps HB as well.

CW

[skeettx]

Who has been chambering these rifles for y'all?

I have been thinking of making up a 25-45 Sharps on a Rem 700 action

Reloading dies are where??

Mike

[richhodg66]

Who has been chambering these rifles for y'all?

I have been thinking of making up a 25-45 Sharps on a Rem 700 action

Reloading dies are where??

Mike

I looked into this thinking I'd get an MGM barrel made for a Contender. I hunt small game with cast in centerfires and figured that a .25 bore size is about perfect, this could easily be a .25-20 with limitless brass.

Le makes the dies as a standard item. While I like Lee dies for straight walled things, I was never fond of them for bottle necks. Maybe other manufacturers do too, but I know I found the Lees very commonly.

[OutHuntn84]

Who has been chambering these rifles for y'all?

I have been thinking of making up a 25-45 Sharps on a Rem 700 action

Reloading dies are where??

Mike

I got my barrel from Sharps Rifle Company. They produce AR barrels in 16, 18, and 20".
I use Lee dies, but if I recall correctly there are a few others making dies now too.

[cwlongshot]

Who has been chambering these rifles for y'all?

I have been thinking of making up a 25-45 Sharps on a Rem 700 action

Reloading dies are where??

Mike

Mine is a Factory H-bar Barrel 20".

I would check with your smith first. Then places like 4-D reamer rental. I have used them many times with out issue. If your smith does any kind of this work, they will have a supplier.

A Bolt action 25/45 will almaot equal a 257 bob with lighter bullets and judicious loading!! In a AR I find Factory on the warm side. I bought some 75g that I could not shoot! Was too hot. So I broke it down a d re laoded with factory components and a lil left over powder for the lawn.

Im not a LEE die fan. I have RCBS dies. I was lucky and found a "used" set. Comes with a case forming die too!

CW