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Thread: 40 Rimmed for a small martini

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy blackbahart's Avatar
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    40 Rimmed for a small martini

    so a couple of weeks ago I was looking at a 10 mm /16 twist barrel blank and thought that it would be a different small Martini project .
    Run some 41 rem mag brass through a set of 40sw/10mm and they sized down quite easily and made up a couple of dummies

    It just fits into the because I can category as the brass being 41 mag and be easier to load for with out sizing ,but a rimmed 40 on a martini seems intriguing during this quiet time

  2. #2
    Boolit Grand Master

    Wayne Smith's Avatar
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    38-40 would be the original but I'm assuming you are looking for a stronger case. I wanted a rimmed .25 and went 25 Krag AI in an Encore barrel.
    Wayne the Shrink

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  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    Sounds like a really cool project

  4. #4
    Boolit Buddy blackbahart's Avatar
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    the 38-40 base is .465 and the 40SW base is 424 ,and the shank on a martini is 750 threaded and .040 extra chamber wall seems moot but it is more and the case is sturdier with the sized down 41mag for project

  5. #5
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    I went about it a different way. The 10x25mm Rimmed is formed in one pass from Starline .44 Russian, resulting in a 0.970-0.975” case, ready to use, no trimming or reaming necessary. This does away with the common issues of paper-thin, fragile .38-40 cases and having to deal with excess free airspace in the case, causing poor ballistic uniformity when loading smokeless powder. The 10x25 cartridge has a powder capacity similar to the 10mm Auto and provides uniform ballistics with low velocity loads approximating the .41 Long Colt. Full case-capacity charges of 4227 drive a 250-grain bullet over 1000 fps from a 5-inch revolver and over 1300 fps from a 2-inch rifle.

    The shoulder angle is 6 degrees, 48 minutes Basic, the same as the .38-40 Winchester. Case body diameter is .454" at the shoulder, the same as the .38-40 and .457" at the base, and the same as the .44 Special. Case capacity is 22 grs. Goex 3Fg, 4.5 grs. of Trail Boss or 16 grs. of IMR4227.

    Attachment 263644Attachment 263641Attachment 263642Attachment 263643Attachment 263645Attachment 263646Attachment 263647

    “DougGuy” in North Carolina can make dies by cutting down and honing out .38-40 Lee dies on his Sunnen hone. Doug’s price two years ago to modify a set of LEE .38-40 dies I supplied was $150. You would need to contact him for a current quote. The die alteration process is as follows:

    1) FL sizer and seater are both cut off by 0.4" and a new thread relief is turned.

    2) Neck portion of the sizer is honed to .420" diameter to produce a correct bullet fit.

    3) Neck portion of the seater is honed to .429" diameter and ball seat is honed to .402" to provide necessary clearance.

    Manson identifies the reamer as .40/.44 Special Short 1-inch Harris Rev1-6-18. The chamber has a .429” neck diameter, and a .402” diameter cylindrical ball seat 0.10” long with 6 degrees, Basic forcing cone for rifle use. It can also be used to do revolver cylinders, using a .4015 diameter chucking reamer from McMaster-Carr to line bore the cylinder throats. John Taylor, who did my gunsmithing work also has the die reamer and can make dies along with doing your rifle and/or revolver.

    Typical ballistics:_____________________Ruger 5"_________________Rook Rifle 22"

    Accurate 40-182H, 5 grains Bullseye______986 fps, 8 Sd_____________1085 fps, 12 Sd

    Accurate 40-220H, 3.5 grains Bullseye____740 fps, 10 Sd_____________825 fps, 11 Sd

    Accurate 40-220H, 4 grains Bullseye______830 fps, 18 Sd_____________903 fps, 14 Sd

    Accurate 40-220H, 4.5 grains Bullseye_____881 fps, 19 Sd____________970 fps, 24 Sd

    Accurate 40-220H, 5 grains Bullseye______963 fps, 5 Sd_____________1062 fps, 16 Sd

    Accurate 40-252H, 3.5 grains Bullseye____711 fps, 12 Sd_____________783 fps, 7 Sd

    Accurate 40-252H, 16 grains IMR4227___1084 fps, 18 Sd_____________1340 fps, 21 Sd
    Last edited by Outpost75; 06-15-2020 at 03:57 PM.
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  6. #6
    Boolit Master
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    A small size Martini (cadet) has a 3/4" barrel tenon,IMHO too small for a case of larger diameter than .375"............If you want a Martini for larger cases ,get a Martini Enfield.

  7. #7
    Boolit Buddy blackbahart's Avatar
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    seen a few pics of a 45 acp done on the small cadet with rimless extractor by an Ozzy smith Swan? and those cases run 460 ish
    he recuts the receiver to accept larger threads for such projects
    Last edited by blackbahart; 06-16-2020 at 03:03 AM. Reason: left out info

  8. #8
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    A small size Martini (cadet) has a 3/4" barrel tenon,IMHO too small for a case of larger diameter than .375"............If you want a Martini for larger cases ,get a Martini Enfield.
    When Bob Snapp did Cadet Martinis he rethreaded the receiver to a one-inch, 20 TPI thread which works fine for up to .44-40, .45 Colt and even .44 Magnum if you bush the firing pin.
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  9. #9
    Boolit Buddy
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    A Cadet receiver only measures 1.00 wide, how would you thread it for a 1-20 TPI?

  10. #10
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beshears View Post
    A Cadet receiver only measures 1.00 wide, how would you thread it for a 1-20 TPI?
    You are right, couldn't have been. Aging memory is a dangerous thing, must not have been a cadet, but maybe one of the .22 LR actions.
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  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy blackbahart's Avatar
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    well its done now ,but for the final finishing on the martini .Loaded up 40 rounds using quick load to 20k psi ,test fired and all ejected easily and going to test on paper after scope is in place
    Click image for larger version. 

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
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