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Thread: Does anyone anneal 45-70 brass?

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    Does anyone anneal 45-70 brass?

    I have not in the past, but I want my brass to last a long time...
    WWG1WGA

  2. #2
    Boolit Buddy Tazlaw's Avatar
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    Following this thread. I plan to anneal but have not yet.
    Just knowing enough to do it, is not enough to do it right! -Taz

  3. #3
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    Yes. I started with the socket and torch method and graduated to the Vertex Annealer. What was your question? Will the cases last longer (more than likely). Will the loads be more consistent (depends on your loads and how many times the brass has been fired and resized). Is it a repeatable process (depends on how you do it and keeping notes).

    I just threw a few questions up there and they may not have been any you would have asked. In truth I didn't get real consistent results until I bought the machine and kept notes for caliber and brand of brass. Tempilaq was my friend here. I could tell a difference between say Lapua and Hornady brass using Tempilaq.

    Now 45/70 brass can be over annealed quicker than 308 in my experience so it can be a good way to ruin brass too. There's lots of video's and threads on different ways to do it, but a machine makes it easy and consistent for me, but the electronic one's are $$$. It seems I've used the words consistent and repeatable several times already...

    I've had the machine for probably 5-6 years and have used it for 357 Magnum to 300 Jarrett. I don't use it all the time, but I wouldn't be without it. Yes you will see better numbers on the chronograph and on target assuming the rifle/load and shooter are good enough. I don't anneal to make my brass last longer, but to have consistent neck tension regardless of the gun.

    Just my opinion and experience with my guns...
    Last edited by DHDeal; 05-27-2020 at 04:38 AM.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master corbinace's Avatar
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    Thank you DHDeal, for the great tutorial.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    I've never annealed any 45/70 brass and I have some I've been handloading since 1974!

  6. #6
    Boolit Master Nobade's Avatar
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    I do after 4 or 5 firings, when it starts to not seal at the mouth. This is with black powder exclusively.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nobade View Post
    I do after 4 or 5 firings, when it starts to not seal at the mouth. This is with black powder exclusively.
    What he said. You will NEVER need to anneal 45-70 brass for any other purpose. Without a bottle neck it's just not necessary.

  8. #8
    Boolit Buddy
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    I donít anneal any straight wall cartridge.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  9. #9
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    I anneal if I see a split case mouth show up.
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  10. #10
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    Starline recommends annealing their 45-70 brass so I did the last 100 cases I bought from them but, honestly, haven't detected any difference in loading from any of my other Starline cases.

    Bill
    "I'm not often right but I've never been wrong."

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  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraschenbirn View Post
    Starline recommends annealing their 45-70 brass so I did the last 100 cases I bought from them but, honestly, haven't detected any difference in loading from any of my other Starline cases.

    Bill
    They do for some specific cases I believe. Mainly the BPCR cases. It doesn't take long on the Vertex and it's repeatable as long as you have the dwell time figured out.

    I should say, as I believe has been mentioned, that the flame length (the innner flame from the torch is what I keep an eye on) and torch tip distance from the case are important to the process. Over annealed brass is toast and under annealed brass is just no better than unannealed brass. It's a tight rope, but not hard as long as you have your notes or plenty of Tempilaq.

    Consistency again...

  12. #12
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    I'm real gentle on the flare & crimp.

    I've never annealed them, and haven't had any split yet either.
    I figure the primer pockets will loosen up before I need to anneal.
    Last edited by Winger Ed.; 05-27-2020 at 04:03 PM.
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  13. #13
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    I would suggest to go with the KISS method, pick 50 or 100 cases. Record how many times you have fired out of them and look for problems along the way. If you donít run into problems after a normal amount of loading and you have good accuracy then why bother dropping big money or big time on annealing brass if the gain is negligible. I load 300AAC and I havenít messed with annealing, my cases have 10 loadings on them shooting subs and accuracy is more than good enough that I wonít bother with the expensive machinery for it. If you have the equipment on hand already go for it and test a batch, if not I would see how it plays out without annealing first.
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  14. #14
    Boolit Buddy Win94ae's Avatar
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    Every 7th firing. Like all my other rifle brass.

  15. #15
    Boolit Buddy Win94ae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sutherpride59 View Post
    have 10 loadings on them shooting subs
    I have hundreds of shots on my rifle brass, shooting max pressure loads.

    Annealing is the most inexpensive part of my reloading.

  16. #16
    Boolit Grand Master

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    My BPCR brass ( 38-44 40- 65 45-70 45-90 44-40) all get annealed every 3rd firing. I use a lead pot filled with sand. maintains a fine temp and depth. Time is set by the totation around the ring removing and inserting cases.

    I find I get more consistent neck tension, longer case life, and better seal Cases dont always harden the same sizing and firing them. Annealing them with a good set up brings them all back to the same.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    I don't know how many firings my brass has. I have a few hundred Starline cases that are probably in the 3-5 firing range and a freind of mine gave me nearly 1000 or so cases that are old and I've shot those a few times...

    Generally, I am shooting pretty high power rounds and I abuse my case mouths because I do flare a quite a bit because I generally size to .460 and then I also crimp heavily.

    I do trim these cases because they do grow a little bit between firings and I like all my cases to be exactly the same length when loading.

    I guess I'll watch the thread a bit and do a little more reasearch.
    WWG1WGA

  18. #18
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by sukivel View Post
    I don’t anneal any straight wall cartridge.


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    Let it be noted that the 45-70 isn't really a straight walled case. That's why there's no carbide dies for it and why it also grows slightly after firing....minute, but it will get longer and need trimmed over time. I still don't anneal though since I've never had a case mouth split....yet. Some of my cases have been fired quite a few times.

  19. #19
    Boolit Buddy
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    As mentioned above, Starline recommends for 45-70 BP. I did it for the first time this year and have noted a much cleaner action in my sharps rifle.

    For smokeless, I would be hesitant.

    Also, if you use an AMP, the “standard” recommended code for Starline makes the necks a little too soft IMO. I used Aztec to analyze and it wasn’t nearly as soft but shoots good. So, if you do anneal for smokeless, don’t use the standard setting on AMP.

  20. #20
    Boolit Master waco's Avatar
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    Here is how I do it.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHa30N9kQKY&t=3s
    This is what works for me. YMMV.
    The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.
    Proverbs 1:7

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check