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Thread: M die or Powder Funnel for 308 and 300blk?

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy
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    Oct 2014
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    M die or Powder Funnel for 308 and 300blk?

    I was going through a bunch of Dillon 650 caliber conversions so I could process some 308. I bought a used 650 and a bunch of conversion kits and spare parts 2 years ago.....just now getting to using the 308 stuff. Of course pieces look missing. It is hard to keep track of all the little parts for each caliber for a 650 especially if, like me, I try to use bits from each caliber instead of buying $95 converstion kits for each when it might just be a shell plate etc.

    That said.....I have the AK powder funnel which will work with 300blk and I think I have the powder funnel for 308. Great for when I load FMJ but not for cast.

    Dillon has a $25 30cal powder funnel that will work with 300blk. Not sure if it will work with 308 for cast bullets.

    Unitek has a $50 powder funnel BUT it works with any 30 cal round. It has adapters to span 300blk to 30-06.

    OR...I can get M dies. If I got M dies I'd have to either make it a 2 step process (size, decap, trim - then M die, prime, powder, seat) or a 1 step process and remove the powder check.

    Any benefits of the M die over a powder funnel?

  2. #2
    Boolit Master Burnt Fingers's Avatar
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    I use the NOE expanders.

    The AK funnel is the correct funnel for the 300 Blackout.

    http://thegunwiki.com/apps/calconversion/ This is a great help

    https://dillonprecision.com/docs/cal...sion_Chart.pdf

    So is this one.
    NRA Benefactor.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    Well, a powder thru die is a good funnel; the M die is not a funnel.

    Lyman's M dies (and their clones) are the best expander-bellers on the market, they're great for both jacketed and cast bullets.

  4. #4
    Boolit Buddy GWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by psychbiker View Post
    Any benefits of the M die over a powder funnel?
    Depends on whether the powder funnel has a single-step sizer on the bottom or a two-step sizer.

    The point to an M die is to size a 1/16" deep step on the brass to the size of the bullet....so the bullet will drop that 1/16" into the case and no further, so that the seating die can seat the bullet the rest of the way with ample bullet to case friction. Why do you want the bullet to go in the 1/16? So that it won't tip off axis in the seating die and create less than concentrically straight seating especially on a progressive merry-go-round.

    Rick from Mr. Bullet Feeder came up with a replacement funnel for Dillons with the same 1/16" "M" style step, so that (pistol) bullets could be fed from the bullet feeder without tipping and causing bullets to go in less than perfect.....for pistol.

    RCBS added powder measure funnels for the Uniflows with the two step system as well for Pro 2000's, again for pistol. But most recently (since they had 7 stations on the new press to play with) came up with a rifle bullet feeder system that included their own 2 step neck expander like an M die.

    The question is.....is there any reason to go the funnel way or the die way to get the same thing. The answer is.....depends on how many stations you have to play with, and whether you are loading pistol or rifle. A powder measure funnel that expands a case neck is merely a way to save a station .....the "M" style step is an improvement for both......especially if you use a progressive with a bullet feeder and you hate to crank reeaal slow!

    I really like the new RCBS rifle tube feeders I bought in .223 and .308....with their "M" style neck expander dies......but then I have 7 stations.

    The following video is just a test....a single bullet in the tube fed to a .223 case....it sticks them pretty good....1/16" deep ready for the swing around the merry-go-round to the seater.

    Last edited by GWS; 05-23-2020 at 12:00 AM.

  5. #5
    Boolit Buddy
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    Oct 2014
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    I just loaded 50rds of 308 on a 650 using 150gr fmj. The trimmers I have don’t chamfer (CTS trimmer and press mounted router trimmer). I was shaving ever so slightly some lead on the fmj which means I’d for sure shave lead on cast bullets.

    The M die would help with a chamfer I read if I just turned in a little also. The M die would only work in a 2 step process; 1) decap, trim, M die then 2) primer, powder, seat.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master
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    From what I know about my 550, the powder funnels for bottleneck rifle rounds do not go inside the neck of the brass. There is no expansion of the neck from the Dillon powder funnels. The case neck goes inside the end of the powder funnel, like slipping a larger piece of pipe(the powder funnel) around a smaller piece of pipe(the case neck). I decap/size on a single stage and then the first stage of the 550 has a Lee Universal Expander Die with an NOE neck expander.

  7. #7
    Boolit Buddy GWS's Avatar
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    For .223 and .308, I like to deprime off my press and then use a wet tumbler for bling, for sure if it's LC brass. The I prep it on a Trim Mate.

    Using deprimed brass means I can remove the expander rod out of my sizer. So in station 2, I can put the "M" style expander there, and expand (with the "M" step) and prime.
    That puts my P.M. is in 3, powder checker in 4, my bullet feeder in 5, seater in 6, and crimp in 7. (the taper crimp is just for smoothing out the "M" step)

    This method allows me to load very fast with cases and bullets swinging around the merry-go-round and in spite of the motion, the bullets in the "M" step don't tilt period. It's what I always wanted to try and taking the chance on RCBS's 7 station press made it possible. I love the result. The new press has the smoothest rotating plate I've ever used or observed. I know there's plenty of "bad press" on the Pro Chuckers, but I was confident that for how I reload it would be perfect. No buyer remorse on this one.
    Last edited by GWS; 05-23-2020 at 01:17 PM.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check