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Thread: 357 Crimp Amount/Location? Semi Hot Revolver Load

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy
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    357 Crimp Amount/Location? Semi Hot Revolver Load

    These 357 will be semi hot rounds with 13.5gr if 2400 and with a coated 158gr rnfp bullet.

    Manuals differ in OAL. Some have 1.590 and others have 1.550 or 1.570.

    Bullet I’m using will need a OAL just of 1.570 in order to crimp at the crimp groove.

    Photo below is 1.575 and crimped just shy of the groove. I’m also using the Lee COLLET crimp die. Not a taper crimp or roll crimp. Was suggested to use in rounds that will be used for both a revolver and rifle.

    Does that round look good?

    Should I let it out to say 1.580 and don’t worry bout the crimp groove?

    I can also run it a little shorter but then pressure spikes will likely happens using 2400 powder.


    Last edited by psychbiker; 05-15-2020 at 10:15 AM.

  2. #2
    Boolit Grand Master Bazoo's Avatar
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    I'd seat deeper to the groove. I personally would use a standard roll crimp. I put not quite enough crimp I buckle the case; heavy in other words. It looks good though and if it works for you and the bullets don't creep under recoil it's fine.

    2400 has been used lots at the high end and I've never seen anything about it being spiky. I've personally worked up to 15 grains with the 358156 seated in the upper crimp groove. That was safe in my gun with my techniques, might not be for you though.
    Last edited by Bazoo; 05-15-2020 at 01:49 AM.

  3. #3
    Boolit Buddy
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    Thanks for the reply.

    The collet crimp is my only option really. I don’t want to order a separate roll crimp and wait another week. I also don’t want to use the roll crimp that’s in my hornady crimp and seat die. I never got consistent rounds when I seated and crimped in same station.

    I’ve got a 38sp taper crimp die that would work but don’t think taper crimps are best for revolver.

  4. #4
    Boolit Grand Master Bazoo's Avatar
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    Do you trim your cases for consistency? That's the only way to get consistent crimps with a roll crimp. The work around is either, crimp light enough the long ones can go through without buckling or use a collet crimp. There's nothing wrong with a collet crimp it just ain't what I like.

  5. #5
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    winelover's Avatar
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    I would roll crimp in the crimp groove. Thirteen and a half grains of 2400 is not a light load for a 158 RNFP, as it would be for the same weight SWC. It's an upper end, according to Lyman's Cast Bullet Manual 4th Edition...........there is more bullet inside the case, reducing capacity. I just switched from the 158 SWC to a 158 RNFP for my 357's. I use to load 14.5 grains of 2400, with the SWC for my Rossi carbine. Worked up ladder loads with the RNFP, starting at 12.5 and ending at 14 grains. Fourteen grains was a half grain over Lyman's suggested maximum. The Rossi had no problem handling it, but the bullets were showing vertical stringing. I settled on 13 grains as my most accurate load in my carbine.

    Winelover

  6. #6
    Boolit Master
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    BTW, I've never trimmed a straight walled handgun cartridge, in all my nearly 50 years of reloading. Separate your cases by headstamps and adjust your dies, accordingly. Yes, some brands differ...............I dislike Hornady brass because it always is shorter than most other brands.

    If you want/need to crimp outside the crimp groove............invest in a taper crimp die for 38/357 Magnum. RCBS makes them. I have and use one when I occasionally, want to switch to a light 9 mm bullet for 357 Magmums.

    Winelover

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    Why not seat with your 38 special taper crimp die and crimp with your Hornady roll crimp die ? If you seat to the center of the crimp groove and roll crimp slight variations in case length will not make much practical difference.

  8. #8
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    Wayne Smith's Avatar
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    "rounds that are used for not revolver and rifle."

    So what are you shooting them in?? I assume you mean for rifle and not revolver?
    Wayne the Shrink

    There is no 'right' that requires me to work for you or you to work for me!

  9. #9
    Boolit Master
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    My Lee seating die will roll crimp. My collette dies are for neck resizing rifle cases. I have several sets of Lee dies, some of which have a carbide "crimp and post" (aka finishing) die which irons out bulged cases. I roll crimp all my cast bullet loads, some heavier than others.

  10. #10
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by onelight View Post
    Why not seat with your 38 special taper crimp die and crimp with your Hornady roll crimp die ? If you seat to the center of the crimp groove and roll crimp slight variations in case length will not make much practical difference.
    They are the same set of dies, hornady 38/357 sizing die and 38/357 seat/crimp. I backed off the crimp in the Hornady and put the collet crimp in the last stage for 357 or I put a taper crimp in the last stage for the 38 special.

  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Smith View Post
    "rounds that are used for not revolver and rifle."

    So what are you shooting them in?? I assume you mean for rifle and not revolver?
    I meant that when I loaded 45 colt I was told use the collet crimp crimp so the rounds can be used in both a rifle and revolver.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
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    I see no reason the round in the picture will not work in rifle or revolver if it chambers ok .
    I am not sure why you don't use the crimp groove but your guns will tell you if they like it or not .
    The overall length in the manuals is good if you are using the exact same components and your gun and chamber are just like the one one they used to work up the load. That is rarely the case so they give you a starting load to work up from , which is safe most of the time if the bullet you use has the same length from the crimp to the base of the bullet and approximate weight.
    At least this is the way I work up loads.

  13. #13
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    AZ Pete's Avatar
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    Onelight has a great solution for you. BTW, roll crimp in the groove would be what I would do....at least that is what I've been doing for 357 and 38 for the last 54 years.
    NRA Endowment Life Member

  14. #14
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    I shoot a bunch of 38 special, 357 and 41 mag. I shoot all 3 in both revolvers, levers and in the case of 41 mag semi-autos. These straight wall cases, IMHO, should always be roll crimped. The roll crimp provides the best retention and seems to allow for the proper hold during pressure build up. If I am approaching warm'ish loads, whether it is with 2400, 296 or H110 data, I will always use a very solid roll crimp. The key is to trim brass to maintain uniformity in the crimp. The other key is to moderate the crimp so you do non increase the case diameter, it is a fine line.

    Use the crimp groove as intended, crimp in it. A good roll crimp should be seated to almost the top of the groove and then crimped to seat in the groove as it will reduce the tendency to increase the diameter of the case at that point. Also, it works best to seat and crimp in separate operations. Seating and crimping in one step is fine for jacketed bullets, but cast and plated bullets may be squished in diameter if done in the same step.

    All that being said, that is a good looking crimp for a moderate load.

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