Lee Pot...UGH!

[curioushooter]

I have a lee 4-20. Though I can get it to work it is might frustrating. Today it started a new annoyance...the alloy would cool in the little drip spout and plug up the pot. Just long enough to let the mold cool down and start casing poorly.

I used a small drill bit to push the alloy out. I found that at about 750 degrees this didn't happen but at about 700 it started to.

Does anybody have a fix? Would filing down the spout help as it would reduce the amount of spout exposed to air?

Do more expensive melters have these problems? Or is this just a Lee thing?

I am curious...

Does the big lyman bottom pour melter keep a stable temp? Does it continue to pour nicely? How long does it take to bring 10 lbs of alloy up to temp?

Same goes for the big RCBS. Does it perform better? I have no frame of reference...I've only owned Lee 4-20 and used a Lee Production pot.

[Jake McCracken]

My 4-20 casts great at 700° Down under 670° the nozzle will start to clog. A quick touch with the propane torch and its flowing again. Only drops that low when I add to the pot a bit too late though.

Just cause mine works dont mean they all work good. I may have just got lucky with a good one. No drips no perma clogs and no other issues for me...

Any chance your thermometer is a little off? I'd just keep a little torch handy before I filed or drilled anything.


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[44magLeo]

On my 4-20 I can run as low as 650, but I have to let it warm up longer before I start casting and have to cast at a quicker rate to prevent spout freeze up.
It's easier at 650 to 700. I keep my electric heat gun handy. It gets hot enough to start a slow spout.
Alloy makes a difference. Softer can cast at a lower temp.
Preheating your molds helps. You can cat faster with a preheated mold.
I do have a PID so it helps. The PID controls the heat better than the stock temp control.
Leo

[gwpercle]

1.) Cast at 750 until things get good and hot , cut back a little at a time until you are at 725, usually 725 is about the happy medium... but only on a warm day .
2.) Don't cast when it's cold . I wait until it's above 70 degrees .
3.) Don't cast in a breeze...the wind cools off the pot .
4.) Install something called a POD , that may be a PAD or PSD , I'm not sure it's supposed to magically cure all your casting problems ... I'm so old we didn't have it when I learned casting.
3.) Ditch the bottom pour pot and ladle cast from a Lee Magnum Melter.
I gave the bottom pour pot away and the member I gave it to has also gone back to the ladle .

Don't waste too much time and money on expensive bottom pour pots and electronic controlled heat units , they all have their little quirks and kinks ...sometimes just going back to basics works best .
Gary

[Winger Ed.]

A quick touch with the propane torch and its flowing again.

That's what I always did.
Even with my old Peo-Melt, I have to give it that little bit of 'encouragement' at the first of a casting session sometimes.

[onelight]

I turn mine up if it does not stay hot enough to flow and give plenty of time to get back up to temp after adding to the pot.

[metricmonkeywrench]

I have one of the older Benzomatic Butane mini torches/soldering iron handy and just give it a shot when things freeze up. Works like a champ

https://www.lowes.com/pd/BernzOmatic...Kit/1000170991

[Gtrubicon]

Just used the torch yesterday for this problem, works like a champ. Only takes a second or two to get it flowing again

[405grain]

I was starting to have this problem. The alloy would leak just slowly enough through the spout that it would start to freeze up. During the casting session I just backed the rod out a little bit with a screwdriver. The pot would leak a little, but there was a catch pan under it, and the drip prevented the spout from freezing up. This was just a measure to keep casting during that session, not an actual fix. A few days later I cleaned out the pot with a small wire brush and unscrewed and removed the rod that plugs the spout. Just like I'd figured, the tip of the rod wasn't a sharp cone, but had become blunted and uneven. I very lightly dressed the rod tip with the fine wheel on a pedestal grinder, just until the tip was an even cone again. I've got an enormous pile of boolits and empty cases to reload so I haven't done any casting since the "fix", but I feel confident that it will correct the problem.

[Chris S]

Ya know, I've never used anything but the Lee bottom pours. They drip, and do not regulate too well, but they work. I build up a PID a few years back, and this has helped immensely. I've never had the spout freeze up on me. I have had it clog with slag. But overall, for the money, I find the LEE pots to be very serviceable...but then, I've never had anything else, so...

Chris

[high standard 40]

Are you sure your thermometer is accurate? It could be off. I use a Lee Pro 20 often and have used it well below 700 degrees without any problem, but that was with a high tin alloy. I run regularly at 720 for most of my molds but I use a PID. I recently ran a six cavity Lee mold at 690 degrees with COWW alloy without any problems. You might try to check the accuracy of your thermometer. Also, temperature swings without a PID can cause frustration sometimes. The temp control on the Lee pot is not all that steady. The PID cured my problems for
me.

[curioushooter]

That torch is a good idea. Should have thought of that.

I gave the pot a good cleaning. It's working better now.

One my my aggravations regarding these pots is that you want to cast when there is a cool breeze for both comfort and your heath. When you buy the thing it says to use strong ventilation and give all these warnings. I always cast on my front porch outdoors. Yet, the pots are not designed to work well this way. I have noticed that their thermostat is very sensitive to any breeze or draft and basically only work well if it's above 60 degrees.

I'd gladly pay for for a pot without all this baloney.

As for ladle pour. Yea, in desperation I tried that. Works if you do one cavity at a time and makes the whole process take twice as long. Plus I float a bed of ashes on my pot to prevent loss of tin/oxidation. Makes ladle pour even more troublesome.

Are you sure your thermometer is accurate? It could be off.

Well, it is very accurate in fact. It's a $20 Lyman digital. I took it to work (I work in a laboratory) and had the metrolgist verify the calibration. It was withing a degree Fahrenheit, which is to be expected from a thermo-couple type.

I have learned that the temp varies in the pot. It is much hotter (by 20 degrees sometimes) at the bottom vs the top. Another design flaw to the Lee pot.

I feel like these pots are made just well enough that they are not immediately returned. If I made one it would come with a accurate electronic probe thermostat, a heating element that ran 2/3ds up the pot instead of just the bottom, and it would be made of something sturdier than thin aluminum sheet metal screwed together. It would probably cost more too

[Mr_Sheesh]

It's not POD it's PID, stands for Proportional Integral Derivative, it's a control circuit that uses those three terms (Proportional to the difference between Set Point and current temperature, Integral of that difference, and Derivative i.e. slope of that derivative) to control the temperature about the best it can be done.

In practice, if there's a huge temperature difference between setpoint & measured temperature, it turns the heater on full power; As it gets closer it will start cycling the heater on and off, to try to just hit the desired temperature. Since it cycles the heater a lot, that's why you want an SSR (Solid State Relay) as mechanical relays are only rated for so many on/off cycles & you'll wear one out too quickly.

Those wanting more info, look here.

[cupajoe]

Anything below 720 degrees and my Mag20 will freeze up. When I got my PID I checked my Lyman thermometer in the pot along side the probe for the PID and the thermometer read 70 degrees lower than the PID. I don't have a Lab to check calibration but I did check the PID with boiling water and ice water and checked good. When I thought I was casting at 700 degrees, I was at 770 or so.

[Mal Paso]

A BBQ lighter will work to get a spout flowing.

[Mike W1]

That torch is a good idea. Should have thought of that.

I gave the pot a good cleaning. It's working better now.

One my my aggravations regarding these pots is that you want to cast when there is a cool breeze for both comfort and your heath. When you buy the thing it says to use strong ventilation and give all these warnings. I always cast on my front porch outdoors. Yet, the pots are not designed to work well this way. I have noticed that their thermostat is very sensitive to any breeze or draft and basically only work well if it's above 60 degrees.

I'd gladly pay for for a pot without all this baloney.

As for ladle pour. Yea, in desperation I tried that. Works if you do one cavity at a time and makes the whole process take twice as long. Plus I float a bed of ashes on my pot to prevent loss of tin/oxidation. Makes ladle pour even more troublesome.



Well, it is very accurate in fact. It's a $20 Lyman digital. I took it to work (I work in a laboratory) and had the metrolgist verify the calibration. It was withing a degree Fahrenheit, which is to be expected from a thermo-couple type.

I have learned that the temp varies in the pot. It is much hotter (by 20 degrees sometimes) at the bottom vs the top. Another design flaw to the Lee pot.

I feel like these pots are made just well enough that they are not immediately returned. If I made one it would come with a accurate electronic probe thermostat, a heating element that ran 2/3ds up the pot instead of just the bottom, and it would be made of something sturdier than thin aluminum sheet metal screwed together. It would probably cost more too

At least once the lead is melted I doubt very much there's any 20° difference between top and bottom. UNLESS one of your thermometers is an analog which do respond slowly. I made a holder that suspended one TC towards the top and another down at the bottom. There's virtually no temperature difference. And I checked that with 3 different PID's and a VOM that'll read temperature along with various TC's that seem to agree with each other. I'd have to look back in notes but I had to adjust my Teltru thermometer to agree with the TC's and if memory serves it was AT LEAST 50° off and slow to react. Hot lead conducts heat through out the mix very rapidly.

[Chris S]

I'll add this, and just this once: in the interest of saving my lungs and yet maintaining the comfort of casting indoors, I built a positive flow ventilation system in my garage using an inline fan, 6" flex piping and a series of adaptors to form a kind of small vent hood. I bought all the parts on fleabay and put them together in a weekend for less than $200.

I fully intend to remove this apparatus when I sell the house. But until then, the system works great, removes all the fumes that I make casting as well as spray painting and my wife's glass work. Yup, I cut a hole in the side of my house, but I won't charge any extra for that when I sell . It does have a spring loaded exhaust vent over it that I figure no one will notice anyway.
FWIW
Chris

[Conditor22]

The colder it is around the pot the more likely the spout will freeze-up at lower temperatures

[jsizemore]

Lyman and RCBS run part of the element beside the spout and Lee doesn't. A dripping Lee pot will pour lead into your mold. Maybe the drip is intentional.

[megasupermagnum]

I've never had this happen when casting in the summer. Mine will often start freezing in the winter when its 10 degrees or colder. A torch always gets it going. In my case the problem is self regulating in that I usually end up running a hotter pot temp in the winter, offsetting the problem. I certainly would not remove metal to try and fix the problem. If anything, I would weld on more to add mass. Unless you are casting at an extremely slow pace, the spout should stay up to temp just fine from the metal flowing through.