I want to learn about casting

[Sigs4Life]

Hello. I am very new to the idea of casting lead bullets. Years ago I started collecting random lead - mostly wheel weights. I have them all turned into ingots preparing for the day that I finally put on my big boy pants and actually start making bullets. I've been reloading for years, but have always purchased professional cast bullets. For economic (and fun) reasons, I would like to start casting. I am not a serious shooter - I'm a plinker by every imaginable definition. So I am more concerned with economics and safe function over "popping zits on a gnats behind" accuracy.

I have about 3.4 million questions... but I will start with these... (Backstory) The last few batches of lead that I turned into ingots seemed to not melt easily, properly, nor was it anywhere close to being enjoyable. Instead of a nice pot of liquid, I was left with what looked like silver, wet, beach sand. It did not pour into ingots well, plugged up the bottom pour spout of my pot something fierce, and was just an all-around pain in my fat, hairy, big toe. I've rid myself of the few remaining wheel weights, and I have nothing but ingots left. I think I have managed to clean out my pot and unclogged the pouring spout... but now I am afraid to try to melt it again to start making bullets for fear of more (of the same) problems.

Is this just a bad batch of wheel weights (high zinc, maybe)? I've fluxed using paraffin wax... only recently learning there is no such thing as over-fluxing. Do I need to flux more? Is the lead too hot when the wax burst into flames? Is any of this lead salvageable... possibly by mixing with the earlier "good" lead? Any other ideas or key knowledge that I should obtain before investing in a resizing/lube press (more questions about that lube process later)?

[Nobade]

Sounds like you melted some zinc weights in with your lead. Not much you can do about that batch but maybe sell it at a scrap yard and get some clean lead or make dive weights out of it. Next time bring the temperature up slower. The lead will melt before the zinc and you can pick them out.

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[Bazoo]

Howdy and welcome to the CB.GL forum. Well, what you describe sounds similar to zinc contamination but I've not experienced it, only read about it. You're doing well to keep it separate though. I have experienced a batch of lead that wouldn't fillout well no matter what I tried. I used it up a little at a time by mixing in an ingot here and there with good alloy until it was gone.

Fluxing is something I had trouble with. I didn't stir enough. I'd give it maybe 5-10 seconds of stirring and scraping, now I give it at least 30 seconds and often a minute or two. This has helped me a lot. I flux when smelting with sawdust first to get the debris out better and then with wax. When casting I just use wax.

[Slugster]

Sounds like zinc contamination. Probably not salvageable without an awful lot of time, energy, and sulfur. Search here on this site for writeups. I would not try to blend it with your good lead as you would just contaminate it too.
Read the casting and reloading stickies. There is about 10,000 years of experience there.
Welcome to the hobby, lifestyle, or sickness...you decide.

[Winger Ed.]

Welcome aboard.

Sounds like ya got ahold of some Zinc.

I'd dump it, but not throw it away just yet.
Something might come along where you could use it for trading material:
make duck decoy weights, big end of the line trot line fishing weights, or something with it.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Sigs4Life,
Welcome to the forum.

I have posted about my Zinc contamination, with photos. It was more like Oatmeal, than what you describe ..." wet, beach sand. It did not pour into ingots well, plugged up the bottom pour spout of my pot something fierce"

COWW alloy, if not heated enough, will be like what you say...like silver sand. Try reheating that batch of alloy, and try to get it as hot as you can. If the ambient temperature is cold, then try shielding the pot, to hold in the heat.

[brassrat]

Test for zinc with muriatic acid or hcl, and/or have scrap yard scan it or send some to the member that scans it, after you get some good lead to send him

[wmitty]

Welcome to the fun! Set the contaminated alloy aside until you have time to read the sticky’s on zinc contamination. Will you be casting for rifle , pistol or revolver? I’d advise against trying to add more good alloy to the zinc’ed batch; I tried that and simply increased the total amount of unusable alloy in inventory.

[slim1836]

Welcome. It might be advantageous to know where you live, may have someone close to you on this forum that could help you along.

Slim

[daloper]

One thing that might help is, update your location. You might get someone close that will help mentor you are at least help point you in the right direction. I know that it would have helped me. I am self taught and made a lot of mistakes. Crap I am still making mistakes but getting better. Welcome to the madness. Don't be afraid to ask questions. There is a lot of knowledge here. Finally, read, read and read.

[lightman]

Welcome to the site!

I would suggest reading the stickies about sorting wheel weights. There is also a great book "From Ingot to Target" that can be downloaded for free that would be worth reading.

Most of us are happy to answer your questions but those stickies contain lots of good info that we might not remember to mention.

Good Luck and Welcome to Casting.

[sqlbullet]

Like others, I have never dealt with zinc contamination, at least not to the point that I noticed in any meaningful way.

My first thought in your description was non-eutectic lead alloy that needed more heat. Heated beyond the solidus point, but not yet to the liquidus point.

Lead alloys come in to basic flavors: eutectic and non-eutectic. A eutectic lead allow, like linotype, has a solidus temp that that is the same as the liquidus temp. In the case of linotype this temp is 464° F. Other eutectic alloys have other solidus/liquidus points, but they are always equal.

It is not worth noting, but this being the internet if I don't someone will come along and say I was wrong not to mention this...By definition a eutectic alloy has a lower melting point that any of it's constituents alone. Also, note that pure lead, though it's solidus and liquidus points are the same, is not a eutectic since it is not an alloy.

Think of this like water/ice (eutectic) versus ice-cream. As ice melts, it transitions directly from solid ice to liquid water. Ice-cream, otoh, gradually gets softer and more liquid until finally it is a runny liquid.

Non-eutectic lead alloys tend to move through a "beach sand" stage just after the get above the solidus temp for the alloy. They get more and more "liquid-y" until they are past the liquidus temp. Your description sounds to me like you were in between and just needed some more heat.

Best way to figure this out for sure is to grab a lead thermometer. It will also be handy when casting as you do want to control the pot temp as you cast. You can get a lyman digital lead thermometer on amazon for less than $30 delivered.

And...Welcome to the addiction. I saved lead for years before I started casting.

[Sigs4Life]

Wow! I didn't know what to expect when I posted this. Thanks for all the suggestions. Now more silly questions... I am newer to forums than I am to casting, and I obviously know very little about casting. What are these "stickies" y'all are talking about and how do I find them? (oh, if only i had as much money as I do ignorance *SIGH*).

Now that I have all the lead turned into ingots, is there an easy(ish) way to tell which are the bad (zinc) and which are the good? I have them stored in coffee cans... mostly by batch... but I've recently moved and all the cans are mixed up now. I don't know which were the earliest ingots and which were the latest (the problems mostly being with the lastest). The best I can come up with is by looking for the waves and ripples in the ingots from the slow incomplete pours...???

[Sigs4Life]

I have a lead thermometer on the way... just ordered it two nights ago. My understanding is I want to stay in the 650 - 700 F range, correct?

[white eagle]

stickies are posts that are for reference the page you opened has them at the top of the page
not highlighted those are there for everyone to reference
has sticky next to title also a subforum titled classics and stickies

[Bent Ramrod]

If you were able to make ingots of your lead, it is likely uncontaminated. Remelt and flux the stuff. The surface of the melt should start out as mirrorlike after fluxing and skimming, but will of course get crustier as you continue the session. You can flux again if you want, but I usually just push it aside with the ladle and go on casting. You may have to flux again if you use a bottom pour, but may be able to get away with not doing so if you don’t disturb the surface by stirring, adding ingots or knocking sprues back into the melt. Don’t let the level go down too far, though, or that stuff will get sucked into the spout.

In my one experience with what i figured was zinc contamination, the entire pot was an uncastable slush, like silver oatmeal. Extra heat and fluxing and skimming revealed no mirror surface that poured easily.

I’ve never had it happen since, although the oatmeal surface is a common thing when melting even clean metal. It changes to mirror shininess and brown or black dirt with enough fluxing and stirring. That gets skimmed off and the casting then begins.

I use a lot of things for flux, depending. Reasonably clean metal I do with drips from candle ends I find at yard sales. (I stir and set the smoke on fire with the lit candle.) If it’s dirtier, I’ll use a couple tablespoons of sawdust. Dirtier yet, I have a stash of rosin flux that NEI used to sell. If it’s really horrible, out comes the Marvelux.

I save the skimmed off dross in coffee cans until I have a few cans of it. I fill an empty pot with it and turn on the heat. When it comes to temperature, I stir through the dross without fluxing until it feels like I’m stirring sand, then I carefully scoop the sandy material out. I generally get an ingot or two worth of lead at the bottom of the pot this way. After cooling, the dross is truly “spent” and out it goes. Yeah, I’m cheep.

[Bantou]

I have a lead thermometer on the way... just ordered it two nights ago. My understanding is I want to stay in the 650 - 700 F range, correct?

For smelting I keep my pot under 725F. For casting I run my pot at about 750.


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[FLINTNFIRE]

He is in yakima I believe , if you were to make it over this way I would run your metal in my smelting pot and see , I also have a gallon jug of muriatic acid as I was painting concrete walls , have not had to use it to test any lead yet , also if you have enough known good alloy you can mix the other in a bit at a time , I do not melt scrap in my bottom pour electric pots , better to do it over a outside gas burner , watch it and as it melts to liquid see how it is doing I myself do not use a thermometer in my smelting pot , as it melts to liquid I turn heat down while fluxing , funny I use old coffee cans for ingot storing and for sprues that for one reason or another do not get tossed into pot while casting .

[Wayne Smith]

Go to the hardware store and get a quart of muriatic acid. Put a drop of it on each ingot and if you get a sizzle there is zinc in the alloy.

[country gent]

When smelting use a chisel or metal stamps to mark the ingots by both batch and pot. A piece of steel pope can be used also. The flat chisel can be used to make I l X L + - Z M N F The pipe can make 0 8 ( or symbols similar to the Olympic one ) to designate pot number or batch then a number of slashes to the pot number they came from.

marking the ingots and keeping a note book always lets you know what it is.

The thermometer will help a lot also.

Flux 2-3 times before pouring ingots and stir a lot. work the alloy up thru the flux and the flux down thru the allow. A paint stir stick works food on big pots a spatula. Scrape sides and bottom while doing this. Fluxing blends the alloy and removes impurities. I use wood chips 2-3 times then follow with wax or paraffin