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Thread: Is the word of God absolute????

  1. #41
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by exile View Post
    Yes, I believe that God's Word, the Bible, is divinely inspired when read or spoken aloud in a good translation (not a paraphrase).
    exile
    "Paraphrase" seems to be a four letter word for a lot of people but every translation of anything from one language to another is, by definition, a "paraphrase." If that weren't true there could be no translation of anything at all and the original would have to stay original.

    The most obvious "paraphrase" is when the translator has to choose what he thinks is best from several words that seem to mean what he believes the original was trying to convey; sometimes translators miss the mark but rarely so far off to matter much.

    Some glaring examples of "error" from the KJV include "thou shalt not kill" - first, there was no royal "thee, thou, thine" in Hebrew and, second, it should have said "thou shalt not commit murder", that one word error, kill vs. murder, may seem small but it makes a massive difference in life application. And the KJV "Holy Ghost" should read "Holy Spirit"; he is NOT a "ghost"! There is much more but that's enough for now.

    Old Hebrew writing didn't have vowels, periods, commas, periods, question marks, paragraphs or chapters. The writing ran from right to left and scroll books read from back to front, etc. Try making a perfect word-for-word translation of anything into English from all that! And, even if you could overcome all that, you would still face formatting the original languages into English, our grammar is vastly different. You couldn't translate anything in the Bible if the original grammar wasn't rearranged - aka, paraphrased - so it could make sense in English.

    All of that means translations of anything must, of necessity, be a paraphrase of the original language, thus paraphrase is not a dirty word. What matters is not the specific words or sentence construction, it's the original message that matters. I know of no serious Bible translation or so-called paraphrase - including the KJV - that gets the gospel message wrong.

    (The proper tolerance of honest translation viewpoints does NOT extend to pretend "translations" such as the Jehovah Witness' diabolical "New Word Translation" and others of that ilk.)

  2. #42
    Boolit Master Wag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by a danl View Post
    wag, if you could , would you try to find the quote where Jesus said that we have to use our own heads for living in the world. i don't recall ever coming across that saying. also , why are you a former believer , did something turn you away ?
    That's not one I'm familiar with.

    If anything turned me away, it was the failure of the promises that god would answer my prayers. After growing up and living in the religion, at age 34, it was pretty clear that no answers were forthcoming.

    Then, after a year (and since then) of my life improving dramatically, there has never been any doubt that I made the right decision.

    --Wag--
    "Great genius will always encounter fierce opposition from mediocre minds." --Albert Einstein.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wag View Post
    That's not one I'm familiar with.

    If anything turned me away, it was the failure of the promises that god would answer my prayers. After growing up and living in the religion, at age 34, it was pretty clear that no answers were forthcoming.

    Then, after a year (and since then) of my life improving dramatically, there has never been any doubt that I made the right decision.

    --Wag--
    wag, god sometimes answers prayers in a way that we would never guess or maybe even understand. maybe he did answer your prayers and you don't even know. i don't say this to be argumentative but to encourage you . please don't give up on god , he sent his only son jesus to die for our sins, which is much more needed than anything else we could ask for. god works on his time schedule , not always ours. i would hope that you would take the time to read ephesians chapter 2 verses 1 thru 10.. take care

  4. #44
    Boolit Master Wag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by a danl View Post
    wag, god sometimes answers prayers in a way that we would never guess or maybe even understand. maybe he did answer your prayers and you don't even know. i don't say this to be argumentative but to encourage you . please don't give up on god , he sent his only son jesus to die for our sins, which is much more needed than anything else we could ask for. god works on his time schedule , not always ours. i would hope that you would take the time to read ephesians chapter 2 verses 1 thru 10.. take care
    Please don't take offense, however, this is the exact same canned answer I've heard a hundred times over the years.

    I did expect it, though. And no, I never truly felt like god had to give me the answer I wanted, only an answer I could understand and know that it came from him. Never did happen, though.

    --Wag--
    "Great genius will always encounter fierce opposition from mediocre minds." --Albert Einstein.

  5. #45
    Boolit Bub JShipwash's Avatar
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    Yes the WORD of THE BIBLE is absolute and infallible WORD of GOD!! There is NO OTHER GOD or true WORD!! I know I was an Atheist till I read it. Saved me because it’s not just words. ITS ALIVE AND ETERNAL

  6. #46
    Boolit Master
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    Poll question- Is the Word of God absolute?- For me, yes indeed.

    a danl asks
    ..."find the quote where Jesus said we have to use our own heads..."

    Mark 12:30 (Greatest Commandment)

    King James Bible
    And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

    ...all thy mind... He does not need mindless slaves.

    always glad I am to help.

    I miss Church.

  7. #47
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    Men say they prayed but God didn't answer their prayers; they are wrong, I have come to realize that God answers all prayers. He has three answers to every one of our prayers; "Yes", "No" and "Later", but He isn't a sock puppet for anyone.

    In my 80 years, I've seen enough "Yes" to know He hears me and, from that knowledge, I've come to accept that from His knowledge of the future he knows the best answer to what I want so when He says "No" or, "Later", I can accept his judgement in full confidence that He has a better idea than mine.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    Men say they prayed but God didn't answer their prayers; they are wrong, I have come to realize that God answers all prayers. He has three answers to every one of our prayers; "Yes", "No" and "Later", but He isn't a sock puppet for anyone.

    In my 80 years, I've seen enough "Yes" to know He hears me and, from that knowledge, I've come to accept that from His knowledge of the future he knows the best answer to what I want so when He says "No" or, "Later", I can accept his judgement in full confidence that He has a better idea than mine.
    i'll say amen to that, and i want you to know you have me by 2 years. yes god is good , always

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by a danl View Post
    i'll say amen to that, and i want you to know you have me by 2 years. yes god is good , always
    My brother, I won't hold your youth and inexperience against you!

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    My brother, I won't hold your youth and inexperience against you!
    thank you , i really appreciate it....

  11. #51
    Boolit Bub JShipwash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    Men say they prayed but God didn't answer their prayers; they are wrong, I have come to realize that God answers all prayers. He has three answers to every one of our prayers; "Yes", "No" and "Later", but He isn't a sock puppet for anyone.

    In my 80 years, I've seen enough "Yes" to know He hears me and, from that knowledge, I've come to accept that from His knowledge of the future he knows the best answer to what I want so when He says "No" or, "Later", I can accept his judgement in full confidence that He has a better idea than mine.
    Amen I agree

  12. #52
    Boolit Master
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    Is the Word of God absolute? Absolutely.

    Does God answer prayers? Yes, people sometimes only want to listen to the answer they want to hear.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by bangerjim View Post
    The Bible, any version, is man's interpretation of what they think they heard and was done. Over the years many "learned" (!?!?!) men have added to and taken away from what earlier men wrote and said. It is all man's words transcribed by them in what they "knew" was a gift to them from God.

    Today, with the many MANY versions of the Bible, you have to make your own decisions. And rely on the conversations you have personally with God in prayer to decide for yourself.
    Well, you make the Bible out to be very imprecise and materially changed through the years. But most learning back during its most critical years was through memorization, and they were QUITE fastidious that all the words were learned properly, and passed on without any changes. And as to what was written down, do you realize that one of the dead sea scrolls was found to be a near exact word for word version of one of the books of the Bible? If one book is passed down unchanged in any material detail, why would one expect the rest to be bastardized and unreliable???? That's just not a rational stance to take. We may not understand just exactly HOW it was preserved, but we'd have to be fools to not perceive that it's virtually unchanged. We can have faith in it because God, by whichever of His powers He used, HAS preserved it, just for us, IF we choose to pick it up and read and study it.

    One fault many have is assuming their initial impression is the correct one, and when they use that erroneous or at least imperfect "understanding" as the basis for further interpretation, serious misunderstandings can and do arise. Steadfastly holding to one interpretation, and arguing it to the hilt, brings about an awful lot of needless dissension.

    If only we'd learn that humility - not mousiness, but straight, honest humility - is the key to understanding much of the scriptures, we'd be so much the richer and better for it!

    God let us learn to be humble, so we can better understand you, and hear your directions. Thank you, and Amen.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wag View Post
    That's not one I'm familiar with.

    If anything turned me away, it was the failure of the promises that god would answer my prayers. After growing up and living in the religion, at age 34, it was pretty clear that no answers were forthcoming.

    Then, after a year (and since then) of my life improving dramatically, there has never been any doubt that I made the right decision.

    --Wag--
    Wag, I am very sorry that you lost your faith. But it doesn't have to be gone forever. I believe that you simply misinterpreted God's words, most likely for your own reasons, like wanting things to be one way when He made them another. As to answering your prayers, sometimes God answers with a "No," and we have to realize that He knows so much more than we do, that His decisions are always the best for us. What we WANT is not always what's good for us. I'm sure you're familiar with that principle, aren't you? And we're all His creations, and He has the perfect right to take any or all of us at any time of His choosing. Yes, children die, and many suffer and are lost. He has wisely created a world where not one of us can count on seeing tomorrow. This is intended to keep us wary, and keep us close to Him, lest we be lost, and lose Heaven, which He created just for us.

    Our God, the God of Christianity, is a very wise and loving God who watches over us, and does even the hard things that we might see and know and believe. He watches out over us many, many times when we won't even rightly watch over ourselves. And through it all, our attitudes are what drives most of our behaviors, and those are based on our perceptions. The biggest problem occurs when we perceive things through the prism of our wants and expectations, and not by simply looking for what's real, and lasting and true. Simple humility - the attitude most appropriate for the created toward the Creator - is the key to most all interpretations of the Bible, and our decisions to follow or not follow God's excellent direction and advice. Each one of us must make that decision. It is inevitable. And being mortal, some will make it wisely, and some whimsically, and some even, very foolishly. Many simply don't have the right attitude to understand the truth about God's words. But the meaning is always there, for those who truly seek it. And thank God for that!

  15. #55
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    Wag, please understand that God is NOT some big sugar daddy in the sky that grants our every wish if we believe. As it says in the Bible, it will rain on the just and the unjust alike. Faith just gives believers a way of coping that the profane cannot have. Christians enjoy a type of joy that non-believers cannot know. And though many read the Bible from the perspective of mankind, that's not the way true understanding of it is wrought. Understanding the Bible usually involves looking at matters more like Christ sees them, and His vision is often very different than ours. We typically just want what we want, and want everything to be easy and pleasurable. He wants us to learn and to grow, and often allows us to suffer, so that we might look at things harder and differently, and come to understand Him more thoroughly and completely, at least in the comparative sense. We can never quite know what He knows, nor see how He sees, but we can come close enough to discover some real and valuable lessons. He gave us all we really need, or can absorb, in the Bible, but it's not easy to understand how He meant many things to be interpreted in it. It must come with time and study and humble consideration. Your faith is not lost. You just laid it down for a while. If you ever really knew Him, or had real faith in Him, you may lay it down, but it can never be quite "lost." Maybe a review is in order for you now? Don't let the nihlistic cynicism that floats about seemingly everywhere these days dissuade you. Sometimes, the 2nd time's the charm!

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