Made an expander plug for the Lee Universal Expander

[ndnchf]

I'm sure most of you are familiar with the Lee Universal Expander Die. Its really a flaring die with a two different flaring plugs. Its a handy tool, but I don't always want a flare. I'm working on a long obsolete 44 cal cartridge and do not have an expander of the proper size. I was looking at NOE's web site and saw they have expander plugs for the Lee universal expander die. These are true expanders, not flaring plugs. We I thought I'd try making one myself. So I turned some mild steel to the appropriate shape and made a two-step expander plug. The first step is .407", the second step is .413". The second step will allow the bullet's heel to just enter the case, then as it goes in, it will have a snug fit in the tighter section. After turning and polishing, it was hardened slightly with a torch and oil. It seems to work just fine. I may still order some from NOE. They are very nice and reasonably priced. But I'm glad to know I can make one in a pinch.

[Scrounge]

I'm sure most of you are familiar with the Lee Universal Expander Die. Its really a flaring die with a two different flaring plugs. Its a handy tool, but I don't always want a flare. I'm working on a long obsolete 44 cal cartridge and do not have an expander of the proper size. I was looking at NOE's web site and saw they have expander plugs for the Lee universal expander die. These are true expanders, not flaring plugs. We I thought I'd try making one myself. So I turned some mild steel to the appropriate shape and made a two-step expander plug. The first step is .407", the second step is .413". The second step will allow the bullet's heel to just enter the case, then as it goes in, it will have a snug fit in the tighter section. After turning and polishing, it was hardened slightly with a torch and oil. It seems to work just fine. I may still order some from NOE. They are very nice and reasonably priced. But I'm glad to know I can make one in a pinch.

Thanks for posting these photos. I'm working on getting my shop area clean and organized, so I can set up my small machine tools in it.

[cwtebay]

Nicely done! What cartridge are you loading?

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

[ndnchf]

Nicely done! What cartridge are you loading?

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

It's a 44 long rimfire rolling block. But I put a centerfire breech block in it. I'm now making what would be .44 Long Ballard. It uses a .434" diameter heel type bullet.

[AntiqueSledMan]

Hello ndnchf,

I made a new expander plug for my LEE Powder through Expander Die for my 44 Colt,
the original powder through on left with my new solid on right.

AntiqueSledMan.

[ndnchf]

Nice! A lathe is a wonderful too!

[bedbugbilly]

Nice!

A question just out of curiosity. If I understand your 2 step expanding of your case, your boolit must be .412 to .413 in order to just slide in the mouth and then goes down to .407 or .006 difference to create your neck tension. Is that neck tension swaging down the heel any on your boolit?

[ndnchf]

I dont think so. That's only .003" on each side. But this is a heel bullet. So even if it does a little, it has no impact on bullet stability. The driving bands on the bullet are.431". This is close to the neck OD.

[bedbugbilly]

Thanks ndnchf for the photo and explanation - greatly appreciated! I was trying to figure out your dimensions, etc. and that explains it - I wasn't thinking about it being a heeled boolit and I missed your post that was heeled - chalk it up to old age! Looks like an interesting cartridge to work with and a lot of fun.

I have a Lee universal flaring tool that I have only used on several occasions. I use a number of the Lyman M dies - got them well before Al at NOE started offering the expander plugs for the Lee die. I personally think that the NOE plugs and the Lee die are the way to go. It looks like your expander plug that you made certainly does the job - nice when you have the tools and can make solutions to specific needs like what you are doing. Thanks again for your kind reply and the photo - have fun and enjoy!

[1hole]

Nice work. And making what's basically a Lyman "M" design with a two-step expander and flare to be used in a Lee Universal die is a good idea too; I'm sure you'll love using it.

I also enjoy improving and making reloading tools. I've made three of those stepped expander plugs to be used in an "M" die. The only difference is my expander's top had to be drilled and tapped for a short section of threaded rod so it can be mounted in an "M" die's screw plug, the thread was #8x32 if I remember correctly.

I do love lathes small enough for a modest home shop! Mine is a 9"x18" WW2 surplus South Bend Md. "A". It's a treasure I got for $500 when I sorta stumbled over it about 15 years ago; it's well worn but still in decent working shape. The lever change gear box makes it easy to precisely cut threads as well as turn; that's super helpful.

Good luck with your tinkering!

[ndnchf]

This was my first attempt at making one. I still dont know what bullet I'll use for sure in this cartridge. But when that is settled, I'll very likely be making another plug tailored to it.

My lathe is a 1946 Atlas 12"x24". I've had it nearly 35 years and made hundreds of things on it. It's like an old friend.

[OS OK]

Hello ndnchf,

I made a new expander plug for my LEE Powder through Expander Die for my 44 Colt,
the original powder through on left with my new solid on right.

AntiqueSledMan.

This is great ... I've been awaiting NOE to do this.

I have been using the Lee Universal Expander with NOE inserts or an RCBS Cowboy Expander in front of my Lee powder through expander under the powder drop.
This invention would get me back one station I could use for something else.

[ndnchf]

I had another, similar lathe project again tonight. I needed to trim some brass, but didn't have an appropriate pilot for my Lyman case trimmer. . I had a .440" and a .350", but needed a .400" pilot. So I made one on the lathe. The shaft is made from the same 9/64" drill bit that was used to bore the hole. It was set in place using high strength red Loctite. I made it a little thicker than needed, but it works fine.

[ndnchf]

I thought I'd update this thread with a new part I made for the Lee universal expander die - A neck sizer bushing!

I got thinking about ways to better tighten the neck after seating paper patched bullets in my .44-77s. It just needed to be a few thousandths tighter. Then I remembered the Lee universal expander dies. I already make my own expander plugs for them, and wondered if I could make a neck sizer bushing - hmmm. So after taking some measurements and thinking about it over morning coffee, I made a rough drawing, I went to work at the lathe.

After it was done and polished I ran 20 cartridges through it. They tightened up nicely. I'm sure I'm not the first to do this, but I didn't see them available anywhere, so I thought I'd give it a try. It turned out surprisingly well.

The Lee universal expander dies sure are versatile and very affordable. With a little creativity, they have many uses.

Has anyone else done this?

[Bent Ramrod]

I made one from a short piece of 7/8”x14tpi threaded rod. Forget the drill size, but it was just enough to slide the .44 patched boolit through. Then I set my boring tool on the compound at a 1 degree angle and bored until the mouths of the BACo and Jamison .44-77 cases would enter a quarter-inch or so. I polished with 400, 600 and crocus cloth. Didn’t bother hardening.

I put the patched boolit on the wad at the top of the loaded case, raise the lever, put my finger on the tip of the boolit to make sure it stays down on the wad, and raise the lever slightly more until I feel resistance. Even with the “excess leverage” that gun writers used to complain about, which allegedly made it “impossible” to seat primers accurately, on my Rockchucker or 2-A I can feel the slight “squinch” as the case mouth tightens on the paper. The boolit can be turned, and shaken out of the case mouth if the action is violent enough, but it stays in with normal handling. There is, of course, no actual turned-in crimp on the boolit; just a very slight mouth reduction.

The pictures are on one of my .44-77 posts around here somewhere.

[ndnchf]

Bent Ramrod - I was going to do the same thing, but I didnt have any 7/8-14 stock laying about. But then I thought about the Lee die. I cut a 5 degree lead-in taper at the mouth so the case enters easily. With the die adjusted high in the press I can run the ram all the way up and just tighten the length of neck needed to match the bullet depth. I have not hardened it, not sure it is really needed. Its only squeezing the neck about .004". But I can give it a kasenite treatment if needed.

[Bent Ramrod]

I have the threaded rod but only Factory Crimp Lee dies, no others. Works either way, obviously. “There are four-and-twenty ways to indite tribal lays, and each and every one of them is right.”

With the present high cost of many specialty dies (especially for obsolete calibers, if available at all), it’s worth while, if you have a lathe, to try to make your own dies. I’m presently going round&round trying to make 310 dies that barely size and mouth reduce shells in .22 Maynard and .32 Ideal. Lathe-turned cases don’t respond well to regular sizing dies. I’m trying for just enough reduction as to not embrittle and tear the cases, but to allow easy chambering and hold the boolit in the case mouth.

I’m certainly no diemaker, so there’s a lot of cut&try, and try again. It’s a very narrow tolerance. Even so, it’s interesting work, and (nowadays) definitely worth trying. I’ve actually gotten to the point where my tiny boring tools don’t screech and chatter while they cut. Progress!

[mongo40]

I just use this expander I ordered from track of the wolf, works good for my needs and the price is right.