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Thread: 44 Magnum loads

  1. #1

    44 Magnum loads

    I've just started loading for my Ruger Super Blackhawk Hunter. I wanted to know if 17 grains of 2400 under a 255 grain Keith style bullet would be good for deer? I have seen that Keith loaded these with 22 grains of 2400 but I feel this is over kill. I'm looking to get around 1000 fps.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
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    Deer aren't bullet proof. Lesser loads/calibers have killed boatloads of deer. Think poachers. How does that load shoot for you in hunting situations? Off hand or using makeshift rests? Confidence in your ability, from practice, is what's the most important.

    That being said, I wouldn't hesitate to use that load on deer. Providing, the bullet isn't cast of a hard alloy (<10 BHN) and distances are limited to 50-60 yards. Correct bullet placement is the key.

    BTW, welcome to the madness.

    Winelover

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    Excellent load, assuming your SBH Hunter is chambered in 44 Rem Mag (mine is 45 Colt). Anything reasonably close to and less than or equal to Alliant's published max is good with 2400. Personally, I recommend 90%, which in the case of the 44 Rem Mag would be 18 gr.

    https://www.alliantpowder.com/reload...rs/index.aspx&
    Last edited by Tatume; 03-16-2020 at 11:52 AM.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master
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    garnerboy. PM sent.
    We Know Mass Cannot Be Weighed But It Has Newtonian Weight And That Is Derived From Kilograms And Kilograms Can Be Converted to Pounds. But, Still Mass Cannot Be Weighed. But How is the kilograms obtained? Can Kilograms Be Weighed? Evidentally Yes It Can. But, Still Mass Cannot Be Weighed So Kilograms Must Not Exist. Funny Isn't It.
    One good thing out of this the next time I'm at the doctors and they want to weigh me I'll tell them mass cannot be weighed.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master Thumbcocker's Avatar
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    I killed several with a Keith over 18.5 of 2400
    You'll go far providin' you ain't burnt alive or scalped."

    Will Geer as Bear Claw in "Jeramiah Johnson"

  6. #6
    Boolit Buddy
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    2400 has been changed since Elmer published his data of 22gr 2400 and a 245gr bullet. 20 gr of new 2400 = Elmer's 22 gr, so cut 10% from any data from the "old days."
    According to Quickload, your powder/bullet combo is a low pressure load and the bullet speed should be a lot higher than 1000fps, even from a 7 1/2" barrel.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master JoeJames's Avatar
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    For a load that doesn't bother me at all, I shoot 7 grains of Unique under an Oregon Trail .431" 240 grain laser cast boolit - runs about 1150 fps in my Rossi R92 carbine. It is quite accurate.
    You Can Vote Your Way Into Socialism, But You Have To Shoot Your Way Out of it.

  8. #8
    Thanks for the info. I shot my gun with the above load and didn't lead much but not very accurate either. Maybe I will try more powder and see if it settles down.

  9. #9
    Boolit Buddy
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    I have noticed in my Redhawk, increments of 2/10ths and adjusting crimps can make a lot of difference in accuracy. I have some H-4227 left over and a little less recoil than 2400, but 2400 delivered top notch accuracy. I'm at work and don't have my load notes but remember it's pretty close to current Max load.
    Tony

  10. #10
    Boolit Bub
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    I need to clear up a misconception , " that 2400 has changed " ! I contacted the powder co. and asked that very question . His response was " not to our knowledge " . He went on to add that if they changed it , they would have to. change the name to " 2300 or 2500 etc " as powder making is tightly regulated . He told me they still had the original batch they had to match up to , give or take a 4% lot to lot variation that the feds allow . If you had a bottle that was 3-4% slower burn rate ( which meets specs) and you were loading a max charge . Then bought a new bottle , used the same load and now experienced over pressure (cases stuck in cylinder etc)it's probably because the new bottle is 3-4% faster burn rate . You have just experienced a 6-8% change in burn rate . Remember , when getting a new bottle of your favorite powder it is always advisable to work up to your preferred load slowly . Start low and work up . People get hung up on the idea that it has changed because someone told them that they had read it somewhere but didn't remember where etc . That is not proof . I have just gave you proof that it has not changed . It came straight from the powder co themselves . Regards, Paul

  11. #11
    Boolit Grand Master


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    cowboy4evr

    Excellent post. I have posted actual pressure test results comparing Hercules 2400 to Alliant 2400 in several different cartridges showing, other than lot to lot variation, there is no change/difference. Myths, especially when some writer states them in a magazine, are hard to dispel, even with facts.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tatume View Post
    I believe the 44 Rem Mag pressure specification is what changed.
    When did it change?
    We Know Mass Cannot Be Weighed But It Has Newtonian Weight And That Is Derived From Kilograms And Kilograms Can Be Converted to Pounds. But, Still Mass Cannot Be Weighed. But How is the kilograms obtained? Can Kilograms Be Weighed? Evidentally Yes It Can. But, Still Mass Cannot Be Weighed So Kilograms Must Not Exist. Funny Isn't It.
    One good thing out of this the next time I'm at the doctors and they want to weigh me I'll tell them mass cannot be weighed.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    I believe it was the maximum pressure specification that changed. I don't know when, but:

    44 Magnum pressure spec Speer #11: 43,500 CUP
    44 Magnum pressure spec current SAAMI: 36,000 PSI (40,000 CUP)

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tatume View Post
    I believe it was the maximum pressure specification that changed. I don't know when, but:

    44 Magnum pressure spec Speer #11: 43,500 CUP
    44 Magnum pressure spec current SAAMI: 36,000 PSI (40,000 CUP)
    Is the 43500 CUPthe actual average or the max allowable individual in a test string? The MPSM IS STILL 43200 CUP. That is what one needs to know.
    Elmer Keith called CUP by the term PSI to. Of course both are pressure. Plus we have better more sophisticated measuring systems now too.
    Who can actually say? Has anyone called SAAMI to find out? Would they even be able to answer the question now? Not saying they couldn't give an answer but would it be an accurate answer? Many years have passed.
    Plus Mr Keith said his "Keith Load" averaged around 34000 PSI actually CUP, Peizo Transducer method wasn't used back then, by HP Whites labs so any of this really is not too relative as to whether the pressure has been changed or not.
    Normal loading precautions and methods need to be exercised regardless.
    This is just all in my opinion only but based on some investigation and reloading for around 49 years.
    There are lot to lot variations in 2400 as they are in other powders. I posted chrono results on three lots of 2400 sometime back but they were picked apart so I deleted them.
    Any way have a good day
    Last edited by 44MAG#1; 03-17-2020 at 04:55 PM.
    We Know Mass Cannot Be Weighed But It Has Newtonian Weight And That Is Derived From Kilograms And Kilograms Can Be Converted to Pounds. But, Still Mass Cannot Be Weighed. But How is the kilograms obtained? Can Kilograms Be Weighed? Evidentally Yes It Can. But, Still Mass Cannot Be Weighed So Kilograms Must Not Exist. Funny Isn't It.
    One good thing out of this the next time I'm at the doctors and they want to weigh me I'll tell them mass cannot be weighed.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
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    Over the last forty five years, I burn't up many eight pound jug of 2400 powder in my Rugers. Never noticed any significant differences in those lots. Still wouldn't hesitate to use the Keith load. Still don't hesitate to use magnum primers, that were recommended, years ago. YMMV. I use 2400 for all my 44 and 357 loadings, as well as, Ruger only 45 Colt loads.

    Winelover

  16. #16
    Boolit Grand Master


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    I've pressure tested the RCBS 44-250-K bullet (253 to 257 gr fully dressed depending on alloy) with both Hercules and Alliant 2400. The average psi for a 10 shot test runs 34 - 36,000 psi, mostly hovering right around 35,000 psi which is the SAAMI MAP.

    Have acquired a nice 4 cavity Lyman 429421 mould but haven't got around to casting any yet. When I do I will pressure test them with Alliant 2400.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Gibson View Post
    I've pressure tested the RCBS 44-250-K bullet (253 to 257 gr fully dressed depending on alloy) with both Hercules and Alliant 2400. The average psi for a 10 shot test runs 34 - 36,000 psi, mostly hovering right around 35,000 psi which is the SAAMI MAP.
    Was the charge 20 or 22 gr?

  18. #18
    Boolit Grand Master


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    22 gr
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  19. #19
    Boolit Master
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    If your thinking about 1000 fps don't overlook unique. 9 grains will kill white tails one shot deader than a mackerel.

  20. #20
    Boolit Buddy 444ttd's Avatar
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    my ruger sbh really likes the 44 special(instead of the magnum) and 255gr keith under 7.5gr of unique. it kills deer with authority.
    "The religion of KE: proposed by the ignorant, and parroted by the unknowing" - MikeG

    ​“Einstein's relativity work is a magnificent mathematical garb which fascinates, dazzles and makes people blind to the underlying errors. The theory is like a beggar clothed in purple whom ignorant people take for a king... its exponents are brilliant men but they are metaphysicists rather than scientists.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check