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Thread: Expensive mistake?

  1. #1
    Boolit Man
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    Expensive mistake?

    I was loading .223 ammo with CFE 223. Went to change over to 9mm and accidentally dumped what was left of the CFE (just over the baffles is Hornady thrower) in about 5lbs of Ramshot Hunter. Did I just ruin all that powder or would it still be safe to use shaken up real good. My first thought was to use a screen to separate them but they are both small spherical powders. Looking at a burn rate chart, CFE is between Varget and Hunter and Varget is another .243 powder. Thanks. I feel real dumb about this one.

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  2. #2
    Boolit Master
    NoZombies's Avatar
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    Well, I guess you've got about 5 new pounds of fertilizer.
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  3. #3
    Boolit Master trails4u's Avatar
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    I'd have some concern about varying density between the two powders. Will they mix/disperse evenly within the container, or will one 'float' toward the top or 'sink' toward the bottom. I don't know how to answer this question...but it would be my primary concern. You could certainly back off load development a bit and work up again with the 'oops'....I just don't know for certain that they would blend evenly.
    "Do not follow where the path might lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail" Ralph Waldo Emerson

  4. #4
    Boolit Master Bazoo's Avatar
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    If you ain't mixed it yet and the jug has not been disturbed since dumping you might could cut the top of the jug off with a razor knife and skim the first 1/2" of powder off carefully. You might be able to see a difference too in good light. That's where I'd start.

    If I couldn't do that, I'd mix it and use it. It's approximately 1/8 pound of powder in 5 pounds.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    Id just shake it up,it will stay mixed...such a small quantity of a similar burning rate will make no difference......One of the shotgun powders I use has at least three distinct shapes and colours of granules,obviously blended from different feeds to produce a specification.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master Shawlerbrook's Avatar
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    Personally, I wouldn’t let an expensive mistake, turn into a disastrous mistake.

  7. #7
    All is not lost. If you're talking about an ounce or so of CFE223 dumped into 5 lbs of Hunter, then I would use it. However, since CFE223 is a bit faster burning than Hunter, then I would start my loads about 15% lower than normal and work up watching for pressure signs. That's just being on the safe side, but I doubt you'll see much difference. Factory loads are often a mix of different powders to obtain a desired result. But then, those guys are truly the experts.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    I like the cut the jug open and skim the top off. but youd have to be sure you didn't move it. most people would have tipped it sideways and looked inside instinctually after they poured the wrong thing in which would have mixed it some. they whatever you put it in after slap a huge label on it

    if it didn't stay upright id mix it and slap a huge label on there that says blah blah mixed powder and re establish load data from scratch.

    I poured half ounce of 2400 in a can of bullseye before then I burned it which I regret doing now.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master

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    I'd recover what I could.
    The area under that baffle can't be more than about 3 tablespoons by volume.
    Going into 5 lbs. That's a pretty thin ratio.

    After that, mix it up real well.
    If you're not loading max. charges, it shouldn't be a big deal.
    Last edited by Winger Ed.; 02-25-2020 at 12:17 AM.
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  10. #10
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    be safe, toss it your life isn't worth a mistake.

  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy Cheeto303's Avatar
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    That is why I only have one container of powder out of my powder magazine at a time. I also have reusable labels that I put on my powder dispenser so I know exactly what is in it at all times. When I'm done I match the powder dispenser label with the powder container before I dump dispenser into the powder container. Then the label is removed from the powder dispenser and stuck to the powder container. The container is then returned to the magazine. At that time I remove the next type of powder from the magazine. Only 1 powder out at a time.Stay alert stay alive.
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  12. #12
    Boolit Master Bazoo's Avatar
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    I label my powder measure too. And I leave it labeled when empty as to what powder and amount it's set for.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master poppy42's Avatar
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    I hope your kidding and not really thinking of using two powder, mixed together and shaken real well! Yah, I’d use it! For fertilizer!
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  14. #14
    Boolit Bub
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    It would probably be ok since its so little powder mixed into 5lbs and the burn rates are close. I'd probably mix it in well, shoot it and stay under max loads. If it was 1lb of powder you were talking about I'd put it into the garden.

  15. #15
    Boolit Buddy
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    Burn it! don't be foolish. $100 dollar lesson at most. I would be closing my eyes every time I touched a round off with that jug of Powder.

  16. #16
    Boolit Master gnostic's Avatar
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    I'd be afraid to pull the trigger, consider it a learning experience....

  17. #17
    Boolit Master Hick's Avatar
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    If the opinion of a Chemical Engineer matters, here's what I would do. If I only got a small amount of CFE223 in the Ramshot Hunter (an ounce or two in 5 pounds), I would Just stir it well and use it. The primary components of Ramshot Hunter are Nitroglycerine, Diphenylamine and DiButyl Phthalate-- same as CFE 223. The chemical difference is that CFE 223 uses Ethyl Centralite to stabilize the powder and moderate its burn rate, while Ramshot Hunter uses 2-nitrodiphenylamie as a stabilizer. They are both ball shaped, CFE on average has a diameter of 0.60 mm, while Hunter is on average 0.74 mm. The chemical difference makes the Ramshot burn somewhat slower. The main concern would be if you had pounds of one mixed with pounds of the other-- then you will have trouble getting a consistent burn rate-- and that could be a real problem.
    Last edited by Hick; 02-24-2020 at 11:08 PM.
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  18. #18
    Boolit Master trails4u's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hick View Post
    If, in fact, you only got a small amount of CFE223 in the Ramshot Hunter (an ounce or two in 5 pounds), Just stir well. The primary components of Ramshot Hunter are Nitroglycerine, Diphenylamine and DiButyl Phthalate-- same as CFE 223. The chemical difference is that CFE 223 uses Ethyl Centralite to stabilize the powder and moderate its burn rate, while Ramshot Hunter uses 2-nitrodiphenylamie as a stabilizer. They are both ball shaped, CFE on average has a diameter of 0.60 mm, while Hunter is on average 0.74 mm. The chemical difference makes the Ramshot burn slower burn a little slower, but these two are so alike you will be hard pressed to see a difference. The main concern would be if you had pounds of one mixed with pounds of the other-- then you will have trouble getting a consistent burn rate-- and that could be a real problem

    For me, at least, this would alleviate all of my concerns. Being chemically very similar, and also similar in size of granulation, I would blend it well and shoot it. I would take the step of backing off and re-working the load. Probably overkill....but I'd do it. Safe is better than sorry.
    "Do not follow where the path might lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail" Ralph Waldo Emerson

  19. #19
    Boolit Buddy

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    I would mix well and load it into light plinker loads.

  20. #20
    Boolit Master
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    The safe answer is always to dump it.

    But when you are talking about, what 2 or 3 ounces of powder in a 5 pound jug, and both are similar burn rates? I would shoot that and not worry. I can't imagine that being much different that the difference between brand new, and 20 year old powder.

    The worst I did was one time dumping my lead shot from a hopper, about a pound before realizing my mistake, into the powder, thankfully only a pound. At the time I couldn't just go out and spend $15 on another pound. I spread it out on a cookie sheet, and picked the shot out with tweezers.

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