PC Test

[bisher.arthur]

So today I cast my first round of 150 gr .309 and tried some powderbuythepound super durable wet red. I didn't want to star anything major just yet as I am still in need of a few things. I only did a PC on one round and in the oven 400/10 but when it was complete I noticed it didn't do a good coat.

Now I only used one bullet with a little powder in a no.5 container. Is there a technique I am missing?

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[NikA]

Not enough bullets (or add plastic BBs). Even distribution of the powder depends on tumbling with multiple objects, you're very unlikely to get enough on tumbling a single bullet (even with a No. 5 container).

[klenke.ryan]

I found that when I only shake a few bullets, in your case one, I can't get a good coat. I like to shake around 100 or so bullet size depending and they cover well.

The attached picture is what I like them to look like after shaking.

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[rancher1913]

not all powder works with the shake and bake method, make sure you are using a powder that tumble coats

[bisher.arthur]

not all powder works with the shake and bake method, make sure you are using a powder that tumble coats

Do you have any examples on powders that work?

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[DHDeal]

I have never used Powder by the Pound powders so can't help there. Smoke's and Prismatic Powder work well for me.

I agree with the others in that you weren't going to get a good coat without something in the container for the bullets to rub against. You're trying to create static electricity in there. I started with black BB's and will continue as I've tailored my PC process to use them. Regardless, put more bullets in there, at least, and see how it shakes out.

I should have added to use a high gloss. Heck, Smoke's clear works so easy, but it isn't eye catching. Smoke's or Prismatic ship fast, but what you have probably will work fine if you put something else in the container.

Crap, I keep editing this post.... the 400/10 you are referring to is undoubtedly the temp/time yes? I cure mine for 400/20 at temp. In other words, when my tray with it's contents get to 400, then I cure for 20 minutes (or I just cheat and just put 30 minutes on the timer and call it good). Works every time!

[rancher1913]

Do you have any examples on powders that work?

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simply goes to smokes page, he lists powders that he knows will tumble.

[lar45]

Some pics of your finished bullet might help.
Be sure to use the black airsoft BBs, they make static electricity to make the PC stick to the bullets.
I use a CoolWhip tub that has the 5 in the recycle symbol. Instead of shaking, I swirl the bullets around the inside of the tub for a minute or two. I use some big tweezers to pull my bullets out and set on some "Non-Stick Reynolds Aluminum Foil" , then bake in a preheated toaster oven.
You might try smashing your test bullet to see if the powder adhered to the bullet. Put it on an anvil and smack it with a hammer. If it chips and comes off, then it didn't stick well enough and probably needs more time in the oven. Post a pic of your smashed bullet also.

[stubshaft]

I agree on the use of Smokes powder, it works! You need to add more boolits and shake aggressively, not just swirl them around. You need to cook them longer than 10 minutes, 20 works for me. Lastly, try the black BB's if you want, but for me they are more trouble than they are worth and I don't use/need them.

[Conditor22]

I have had the greatest success with polyester (usually TGIC) semi & high gloss powder.
I've found that the lighter colors white, beige, yellow, light blue don't cover well.

The best/easiest covering PC I've used is silver, Cardinal semi-gloss metallic silver tops the list

Of the many brands of PC's I use I've found Cardinal to be the best overall with Tiger Drylac a close second.

There are many good powders sold by many companies.

I also have found the need for at least 10-20 boolits in a #5 bowl to get good coverage.

some powders don't need BB's but I've found that BB's help get a smoother coating.

humidity ISN"T always a factor; a friend and I have coated successfully in our garages with the door open when it is pouring rain.

This again depends on the powder and your process.

My 2¢ YMMV

[Dragonheart]

Some good advice here, but I didn't read any post about humidity. Winter usually has overall lower humidity levels but it still depends on where you live. If you live in the desert go ahead and shake away because what ever you do you will likely get a good static charge. But if you live in the Gulf Coast as I do where humidity levels can be 100% and it is not raining getting a good static charge may take some extra effort. I have used the black plastic BB's, but a while back I switched to the Poly Pellets for Weighted Blankets available from Amazon. These pellets are smaller about the size of a true BB. A buffer like this give me a harder and more even tumble coat.

[Dapaki]

Can anyone comment on how to get white to coat well? I am on my third white powder and still cant find one that gives me a good "Storm Trooper" white finish even after successive coats. I have tried the Air Soft BB's, PVC beads and tumbling them alone. Is there a wet method for normal powders or is that just for the Hi-tech?

Congrats Bisher!

[popper]

"Storm Trooper" yes, spray it - only way.

[Dapaki]

Thank you Popper! Off to buy a gun spray gun!

[Tonerboy]

be sure to post pictures of your storm troopers vs. vaders!

[Dragonheart]

If you haven't purchased the gun: the easiest way is simply do a "Partial Cure" on the first coat. That means coat as usual then stop the cooking process after the coating reaches a good even flow or 250 degrees should be a pretty good number. Let the bullets cool then do a second coat. The final coating do a full cure. A partial cure allows multiple coats to bond together.

The second way is also easy , but you absolutely have to have a good thermometer to monitor the process. Heat your pan of bullets to about 140 degrees F, no more that 150 degrees maxium. Once the temperature of the bullets has stabilized quickly do a shake coating. You will immediately notice a thicker better bonded coating on the bullets as the powder tends to stick to the hot metal.

If you have a sticky ball of bullets instead, then you didn't listen to what I said about a good thermometer and monitoring the process. Don't ask how I know this.

Some powders especially yellows can be difficult or impossible to get good solid coverage in a standard single coat, even spraying. Yellow Paint has the same problem. High humidity makes coverage worse. Also high humidity can play heck with spray coating and the gun if your compressor air is not dry.

[Dapaki]

Dragonheart, I didn't buy the gun yet but I did try all three of the methods (2 of them yours) I saw that interested me with varying degrees of success.

I did what you said and did a partial cure and added a second coat (tumble) at 145 degrees (2 ideas in one!) and did a full cure at 400 degrees for 20 minutes. The overall coat is much better but still has spots where the boolit appears "bare" but will not scratch with a fingernail. The problem was that too much of the powder was taken up and it sagged. Still shootable but these will be 'plinkers' for sure!

Not wanting to waste anymore of the Eastwood Yellow, I tried the same thing with the harbor freight black and white but they all went back into the melting pot as the coating was super spotty and ugly!

Looking through some old threads from 2013, I fell upon the PIGLET method for Harbor-Freight PC and decided to try it! No-Joy! The powder did not dissolve or make an emulsion but rather, made a thin syrup with acetone pooling on top when coating a flat piece of steel. I let it sit overnight and ran it through the oven this morning, I will see how it turned out when I get back to the shop.

Thinking that maybe it's just the Shi*ty HF powder, I tried the Eastwood FORD Blue with a little paint thinner (the acetone may have been wet) and WHOOPIE!! the powder dissolved easily so I threw a hundo boolits in to the bucket and swirled them up. Not wanting to have my face inside the bucket all the time the thinner was gassing off, I took the heat gun and locked it in the vice, pointing down and blew warm air into the bucket while swirling until the boolits were sticking together then beyond that to the point where they were just a little tacky and poured them out on a silicon baking mat and tipped them up on the baking tray with gloved hands and allowed them to dry.

200 degrees for 20 minutes (Eastwoods recommendation) in the oven yielded very good coverage but a little too much powder was used. I'll try the yellow tonight and see what happens.

[Dapaki]

be sure to post pictures of your storm troopers vs. vaders!

Toner, I don't know if I will ever get that effect! My HF white does not end up white after baking, it become mottled and grey in spots. I may try Eastwoods Signal White with the Piglet method though.

[Traffer]

I just went through the thread quickly but didn't notice if anyone mentioned that:
Using too much powder will cause problems... I was having problems with small batches and someone said "only use enough powder in the container to coat the bullets that you put in."
That is hard to do with only one bullet. But for some reason if you put too much powder in the container, it just doesn't stick. I cut down to a very small amount of powder and it made a big difference.

[454PB]

[IMG][/IMG]

Here's some using Eastwood PC, tumbled in a ziplok freezer bag, then dragged across a piece of carpet to add some static. The small red marks are caused by residual Harbor Freight PC that was baked onto the mesh.