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Thread: Is there fishing in Heaven

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    Yeah, I've often been told that too, quite emphatically. That, along with other stuff the speakers have no way to support; meaning they're probably wrong.

    Sometimes it gets funny when some folk insist on telling about things they really know nothing of! Truth is, we don't need to know that so we're not told. But, we ARE told there will be "horses" in heaven and I see no valid reason to insist it will be limited to horses.

    A lot of Christians have come to believe the eternal heaven will be a gauzy, nebulous, purely spiritual place; if the Bible is correct that image isn't even close to being true. Instead, we'll have a restored (physically resurrected) New Earth - or Eden - where resurrected humans will live in company with Jesus forever. God - Jesus - put animals, fish, vegetation and mankind, etc., on Earth and he called each of them "good". It's illogical for any of us to jump up now and announce there will be no animals, fish, vegetation in that restored earthly existence! I won't guess if we will have resurrected pets in heaven but I will guess there will be no shortage of creatures of all types. So, If I'm right about this, I'll finally be going fishing again!
    If that is the case and I will not say it isn't. What do the saved do in the mean time. Some people have already been waiting for 2000 years for the Earth to be resurrected and while some think the time is near, it could be another 2000 years or more before that comes to pass. What have the saved to do in the mean time?

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  2. #42
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    I don't know. What I do know is that Jesus did his fishing down here. I sure pray there's deer hunting though.
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  3. #43
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    The Bible's descriptions of both Heaven and Hell are highly symbolic and should not be taken literally. The original audience certainly would not have. The ideas conveyed are that the redeemed will be with God and the unsaved will be punished and then destroyed.

    One of the only things that pertains to our lives in Heaven that can be taken at face value (per Jesus) is that humans will not be married. There is also the new body we will receive, but the Bible doesn't go into explicit detail on its attributes.

    I don't suspect that our existence will be without challenges, work or opportunities. If we didn't have those, we'd get bored. I highly doubt Heaven will be one eternal church service as some suggest. At least that is not my idea of paradise!

  4. #44
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    Interesting take Icki. I have been lucky to have jobs that were not "work", as many define it. I enjoyed most of mine. Work in heaven could well be doing something we enjoy and then it is not "work".

    Many of you love to cast, and I hate it. Some love to reload, but me not so much. You guys can cast away and reload; and I can shoot!!

    But seriously, I wonder if God will use us to intercede in the lives of those on earth (or other planets) to help Him do His works? I guess that is a foolish notion for those who believe God is all powerful and omniscient...He does not need help. But what if His power is transferred to other beings and He acts more like a supervisor? It allows Him to be everywhere, at all times by proxy....the ultimate Collective...the Borg.

    One of my problems, and I believe it affects many others, is trying to put our human traits on God. Anthropomorphism. We get bored and we think God gets bored too. We think He has an image (We were made in His image) but He cannot have an image...at least not as we think of the term. We have no idea of what Gods face is but He has a face....yet it may not be our concept of a face.

    God IS! But do not know what He is. Heaven IS! But we do not know what it is. Our little pea brains can only frame those concepts with what our limited knowledge can envision. So yes Virginia there is a Santa Clause....and fishing in heaven...and shooting ranges....and gun free zones...and whatever we want heaven to be.
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  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by dverna View Post
    Interesting take Icki. I have been lucky to have jobs that were not "work", as many define it. I enjoyed most of mine. Work in heaven could well be doing something we enjoy and then it is not "work".

    Many of you love to cast, and I hate it. Some love to reload, but me not so much. You guys can cast away and reload; and I can shoot!!

    But seriously, I wonder if God will use us to intercede in the lives of those on earth (or other planets) to help Him do His works? I guess that is a foolish notion for those who believe God is all powerful and omniscient...He does not need help. But what if His power is transferred to other beings and He acts more like a supervisor? It allows Him to be everywhere, at all times by proxy....the ultimate Collective...the Borg.

    One of my problems, and I believe it affects many others, is trying to put our human traits on God. Anthropomorphism. We get bored and we think God gets bored too. We think He has an image (We were made in His image) but He cannot have an image...at least not as we think of the term. We have no idea of what Gods face is but He has a face....yet it may not be our concept of a face.

    God IS! But do not know what He is. Heaven IS! But we do not know what it is. Our little pea brains can only frame those concepts with what our limited knowledge can envision. So yes Virginia there is a Santa Clause....and fishing in heaven...and shooting ranges....and gun free zones...and whatever we want heaven to be.
    We are made in God's image in respect to the fact that God has intellect, will and emotion. We mirror that, except on a smaller scale (some animals do have these attributes, but on a limited scale). God made us in his image so we could not only understand him*, but choose to be like him. Whether or not God the Father and God the Holy Spirit have bodies is up to debate. We know that Jesus Christ has a body.

    God the Father always uses an agent (e.g., the Son of God was the agent of creation and redemption, man is the agent that spreads the Gospel). Therefore, it is not a stretch to imagine some of the missions you proposed.

    *To claim we cannot understand God is nonsense. God spent thousands of years revealing himself to man and those revelations are recorded in the Bible. John summed up God's personality in three words, "God is love." Love motivates everything God does. The Bible also explains God's methods. Unfortunately, many Christians overlook this and adhere to their ideas of what they'd do if they were God.
    Last edited by Ickisrulz; 02-14-2020 at 10:30 AM.

  6. #46
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    I don't know if there will be fishing...or dogs....or shooting and everything that entails. What I DO know is that it is going to be so much better than earth and this life that I definitely don't worry about it and rarely wonder about it. God is in charge and that's all I need to know.
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  7. #47
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    Why would we have to work in heaven? No fishin for this guy, give me wheels and I'll go anywhere with you, give me a rod and I'm out!

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by dverna View Post
    Don, some thoughts on your thoughts:
    One of my problems, and I believe it affects many others, is trying to put our human traits on God. Anthropomorphism. We get bored and we think God gets bored too. We think He has an image (We were made in His image) but He cannot have an image...at least not as we think of the term.
    I believe you're absolutely correct so far as the spiritual, not physical, nature of our triune God, including Jesus, the Son of God. But .... Jesus, the son of man, had (and still has) a physical body; in fact He was the "first born of all creation" (Col 1:15-19). Meaning, in the Mind of God, His human body was a created existence at that moment so far as God was concerned. Jesus was by no means the "first born man" in the literal sense at that time but I believe all humanity is made in the image of what would be his body, soul and spirit.

    I don't KNOW any of that as a fact of course but, IF I'm right, it will be Lord Jesus, the son of man (that's what he always called himself and I think it's significant) that we will see face to face.

    Come quickly Lord Jesus!

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    One of the only things that pertains to our lives in Heaven that can be taken at face value (per Jesus) is that humans will not be married.
    That's the common idea for that verse but that's NOT what it says. I mean, it simply says people will not be getting married. But, other than stretches of personal interpretation, that verse does not say those of us who are truly married, truly heart bounded as if one flesh, will not continue to be married in the after life.

    There is also the new body we will receive, but the Bible doesn't go into explicit detail on its attributes.
    Yeah. As my old pastor's wife says, "Surely we won't be doing THAT in heaven!", as if sex is dirty on its face. I say, "Not so, it is man who puts that slant on the physical bond between husband and wife, not God."[/quote]

    I highly doubt Heaven will be one eternal church service as some suggest.
    Ditto.

    In fact, I suspect the divisions of "time" will more likely be as God made it to start with; one sabbath and six non-sabbaths with lots of options for the other day's activities. Like, fishing and playing with the hordes of animals!

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    We are made in God's image in respect to the fact that God has intellect, will and emotion. We mirror that, except on a smaller scale (some animals do have these attributes, but on a limited scale). God made us in his image so we could not only understand him*, but choose to be like him. Whether or not God the Father and God the Holy Spirit have bodies is up to debate. We know that Jesus Christ has a body.

    God the Father always uses an agent (e.g., the Son of God was the agent of creation and redemption, man is the agent that spreads the Gospel). Therefore, it is not a stretch to imagine some of the missions you proposed.

    *To claim we cannot understand God is nonsense. God spent thousands of years revealing himself to man and those revelations are recorded in the Bible. John summed up God's personality in three words, "God is love." Love motivates everything God does. The Bible also explains God's methods. Unfortunately, many Christians overlook this and adhere to their ideas of what they'd do if they were God.
    I "understand" the concept of eternity, but I really do not understand it. For example, is time eternal or just a dimension we do not understand? If it is eternal, did it have a start? In some ways, God is easier to understand. He just IS. He has shown His love for us. Unlike eternity, He has intellect, a plan and emotions that we can identify with. We cannot identify with eternity...well I should say I cannot. God is mostly just but has done or permitted some unjust things as well...like man has. A few examples...

    He cursed all mankind for eternity for the sins of Adam and Eve.
    He destroyed the world during the Flood...I cannot wrap my mind around every person except those on the Ark deserved death.
    He killed the baby of David and Bathsheba as punishment for their sins.
    He allows innocent newborns to die or even worse, suffer terrible afflictions that resulting a painful death.
    etc etc

    I can identify with God. I fear Him for what he can do and still does. But I cannot understand Him completely. Yet, I know he loves us.
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  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    That's the common idea for that verse but that's NOT what it says. I mean, it simply says people will not be getting married. But, other than stretches of personal interpretation, that verse does not say those of us who are truly married, truly heart bounded as if one flesh, will not continue to be married in the after life.
    Well, with the way you understand it, we are back to the Sadducees' question: You are married more than once and deeply love all of your wives, but they died. Who will you be married to in Heaven? Jesus' answer was, people will not get married. I don't know how you could take this any other way.

    Companionship is another issue and Jesus didn't address this. Probably because it is intuitive and can be inferred from Scripture.
    Last edited by Ickisrulz; 02-14-2020 at 07:11 PM.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by dverna View Post
    I "understand" the concept of eternity, but I really do not understand it. For example, is time eternal or just a dimension we do not understand? If it is eternal, did it have a start? In some ways, God is easier to understand. He just IS. He has shown His love for us. Unlike eternity, He has intellect, a plan and emotions that we can identify with. We cannot identify with eternity...well I should say I cannot. God is mostly just but has done or permitted some unjust things as well...like man has. A few examples...

    He cursed all mankind for eternity for the sins of Adam and Eve.
    He destroyed the world during the Flood...I cannot wrap my mind around every person except those on the Ark deserved death.
    He killed the baby of David and Bathsheba as punishment for their sins.
    He allows innocent newborns to die or even worse, suffer terrible afflictions that resulting a painful death.
    etc etc

    I can identify with God. I fear Him for what he can do and still does. But I cannot understand Him completely. Yet, I know he loves us.
    His methods are clear and I think you have a good understanding of them. We don't always know the why (e.g., child born with ailment), but we have faith because we know the motivation: love.

    Eternity past is baffling.
    Last edited by Ickisrulz; 02-14-2020 at 07:16 PM.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    Well, with the way you understand it, we are back to the Sadducees' question: You are married more than once and deeply love all of your wives, but they died. Who will you be married to in Heaven?
    Well, first, that story comes from an effort of the religious authorities to trap Jesus, at least in a moral sense. He out smarted them without answering their question in a specific way that they could use against him.

    Jesus' answer was, people will not get married. I don't know how you could take this any other way.
    But I'm not taking it in any other way. I simply recognise there's a subtle but clear and wide difference between saying married people won't still be married in heaven is by no means the same as saying that no one will be married at all and I'm not comfortable going beyond what is written.

    Taking away or adding to scripture as it is written is some deep waters and there be some scary spiritual monsters in that kind of depth ... meaning cults.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    Well, first, that story comes from an effort of the religious authorities to trap Jesus, at least in a moral sense. He out smarted them without answering their question in a specific way that they could use against him.



    But I'm not taking it in any other way. I simply recognise there's a subtle but clear and wide difference between saying married people won't still be married in heaven is by no means the same as saying that no one will be married at all and I'm not comfortable going beyond what is written.

    Taking away or adding to scripture as it is written is some deep waters and there be some scary spiritual monsters in that kind of depth ... meaning cults.
    The Sadducees attempted to trap Jesus over a theological issue. Sadducees did not believe in a resurrection, spirits or angles and challenged him with their question. He answered the immediate question about life after death from Exodus (one of the books the Sadducees felt was inspired). Jesus won the debate, but continued on giving us a glimpse of existence in Heaven.

    If you take the passage to mean that future marriages will not take place in Heaven, but married people will still be married for eternity, we have serious problems.

    The first is someone who had been married multiple times (the Bible is not pro-polygamy). The second is, what if you were not particularly fond of the specimen you married? Are you stuck forever? What if your spouse dies and you enjoy a life of solitude--are you stuck being married again? I remember saying "till death do you part", which is the biblical ideal. Finally, the individuals in the Sadducees' example were in fact already married. But Jesus answered the question by saying people will not be "given or taken in marriage" referring to the hypothetical individuals.

    This touches on the same idea when people expect to get all their pets back. Some dogs I have had I was glad when they died. Eternity is an awfully long commitment to anyone other than God.

    I don't feel I am adding to or taking away from this passage. I know the LDS believe along the lines you do though.
    Last edited by Ickisrulz; 02-14-2020 at 09:35 PM.

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by dverna View Post
    I "understand" the concept of eternity, but I really do not understand it. For example, is time eternal or just a dimension we do not understand? If it is eternal, did it have a start?........
    Time started (time as we humans know it) with the first creation. With Let there be Light. That began time, with nothing there is no time, time is the measure of change. Without change there is no time. As long as there is something and it is changing even if it is a single photon there will be time. Time might be eternal but God could end it. If God eliminated everything but God, time would cease.

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  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    If you take the passage to mean that future marriages will not take place in Heaven, but married people will still be married for eternity, we have serious problems.
    Maybe, but I don't think so. Let's see:

    The first is someone who had been married multiple times (the Bible is not pro-polygamy). The second is, what if you were not particularly fond of the specimen you married? Are you stuck forever? What if your spouse dies and you enjoy a life of solitude--are you stuck being married again?
    I surely don't know the answers to those issues but the paperwork legal thing we accept as proof of marriage is certainly not, ip so facto, a "one flesh" bonding thing that God intended, and that matters. I'm sure God has an alternate eternity plan for those who made nuptial mistakes in this life. BUT - I sure don't believe they will be finding a "heavenly true love" and getting married again in heaven. That IS contrary to scripture!

    I remember saying "till death do you part", which is the biblical ideal.
    I don't think the couples who actually bond to become "one flesh" will have a problem with spending eternity together. My other half and I recently marked our 60th anniversary and it seems like little more than a blink of the eye to us. She's always been my favorite Bible study partner, fishing, water skiing, SCUBA diving, bolling, hiking, gardening and ruffing it camping buddy too. (And that's all I'm going to tell you about!

    I really like her a lot and today, at 78 and 194 lb. she's a great-great granny lady with care worn arthritic hands and varicose veins, but she still looks like a lovely 115 lb., 17 year old girl to me! Sorry about others who feel differently.

    I obviously don't know God's plan to deal with those who haven't been truly married in the Biblical sense like us. However, I doubt those who regret the secular legal agreement they once made will be compelled to stay together in heaven. But it's likely that none of them will be getting married again either!

    Eternity is an awfully long commitment to anyone other than God.
    Yeah, including spending eternity with God's special gifts, one of which - for me is my eternally bonded one flesh, best thing that ever happened to me - wife. That's a wonderful thing to contemplate ain't it! Eternally together in the company of Jesus - with youngish bodies, hearts and minds that won't tire, worry or hurt anymore.

    I know the LDS believe along the lines you do though.
    Well, "along the lines" ... okay, reluctantly, sorta. But Mormons are a religious cult, they don't agree with me (the Bible) on much in this life and virtually nothing at all about the afterlife! (For one thing, I already have all the wives I want!) My home library has copies of the LDS main books and I know a bunch of 'em personally; in fact, some are close family. All nice folk but they do have weird beliefs. Including their cult leader's totally unbiblical plan of salvation and his massively distorted view of heaven.

    So, I love Mormons individually but please don't equate anything I believe with them, not even slightly.

    Come quickly Lord Jesus!
    Last edited by 1hole; 02-16-2020 at 06:50 PM.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    Maybe, but I don't think so. Let's see:



    I surely don't know the answers to those issues but the paperwork legal thing we accept as proof of marriage is certainly not, ip so facto, a "one flesh" bonding thing that God intended, and that matters. I'm sure God has an alternate eternity plan for those who made nuptial mistakes in this life. BUT - I sure don't believe they will be finding a "heavenly true love" and getting married again in heaven. That IS contrary to scripture!



    I don't think the couples who actually bond to become "one flesh" will have a problem with spending eternity together. My other half and I recently marked our 60th anniversary and it seems like little more than a blink of the eye to us. She's always been my favorite Bible study partner, fishing, water skiing, SCUBA diving, bolling, hiking, gardening and ruffing it camping buddy too. (And that's all I'm going to tell you about!

    I really like her a lot and today, at 78 and 194 lb. she's a great-great granny lady with care worn arthritic hands and varicose veins, but she still looks like a lovely 115 lb., 17 year old girl to me! Sorry about others who feel differently.

    I obviously don't know God's plan to deal with those who haven't been truly married in the Biblical sense like us. However, I doubt those who regret the secular legal agreement they once made will be compelled to stay together in heaven. But it's likely that none of them will be getting married again either!



    Yeah, including spending eternity with God's special gifts, one of which - for me is my eternally bonded one flesh, best thing that ever happened to me - wife. That's a wonderful thing to contemplate ain't it! Eternally together in the company of Jesus - with youngish bodies, hearts and minds that won't tire, worry or hurt anymore.



    Well, "along the lines" ... okay, reluctantly, sorta. But Mormons are a religious cult, they don't agree with me (the Bible) on much in this life and virtually nothing at all about the afterlife! (For one thing, I already have all the wives I want!) My home library has copies of the LDS main books and I know a bunch of 'em personally; in fact, some are close family. All nice folk but they do have weird beliefs. Including their cult leader's totally unbiblical plan of salvation and his massively distorted view of heaven.

    So, I love Mormons individually but please don't equate anything I believe with them, not even slightly.

    Come quickly Lord Jesus!
    I hope you can see that you have a certain amount of bias on this issue! Congratulations on a 60+ year marriage. I am only at 23 myself. I'm not sure anyone could stand spending eternity married to me.

  18. #58
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    Jesus the Christ said we will be like the angels of God at the resurrection. Figure out what the angels do, and you'll have a pretty good idea of heaven.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    I hope you can see that you have a certain amount of bias on this issue! Congratulations on a 60+ year marriage. I am only at 23 myself. I'm not sure anyone could stand spending eternity married to me.
    It's not "bias", it's life experience and Bible study.

    Stand by, you'll get some to!

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thundarstick View Post
    Jesus the Christ said we will be like the angels of God at the resurrection. Figure out what the angels do, and you'll have a pretty good idea of heaven.
    It is pleasant to think so.

    Tim
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