Lee 200 Grain .358 in .357magnum?

[Blind Dog]

I've been looking for load data for 200 grain cast bullets in .357 magnums. I have a Lee 358-200rf mold. The best I can find is an old 43rd edition Lyman book. Unique at 3.5 grains up to 5.0 grains seems to be workable. Alliant 2400 starting low is another. Anyone work with 200 grain bullets in the .357 Maggie?

[Silvercreek Farmer]

Welcome! Do a site search, I know a couple people have tried it!

[mehavey]

Depending on the length of the action/cylinder, you may have to use 38 Special cases.
If so....

[30calflash]

You didn't mention the firearm they would be used in, Lyman had some 200 gr loads listed for the 357 TC Contender a while back. OAL was too long for a revolver but velocities were pretty good.

[Ateam]

I did some load development with this boolit over the fall, intended purpose was for bear backup wile in Montana elk hunting. I tried it in 38 brass and 357 (357 I had to crimp on the ogive to make cylinder length in my sp101). Accuracy, velocity, and function were identical so I just went with 357. I ended up approximating the buffalo bore loading with 2400. If you want the info pm me as the loads are not published.

[RU shooter]

Ive loaded that bullet to max cyl . Length in my 686 with 5 gr of unique worked OK nothing really special I much prefer loading my 190 gr ranch dog bullets if I'm going heavyweight nose is about twice as wide

[Rizzo]

I've been looking for load data for 200 grain cast bullets in .357 magnums. I have a Lee 358-200rf mold. The best I can find is an old 43rd edition Lyman book. Unique at 3.5 grains up to 5.0 grains seems to be workable. Alliant 2400 starting low is another. Anyone work with 200 grain bullets in the .357 Maggie?

I did some testing with that bullet for my Henry 357 mag rifle.
I just looked up my test results and found that the best groups were:
12.9 grains of IMR4227
11.7 grains of H110
7.7 grains of Blue Dot.

These were in .357 mag cases with a C.O.A.L of 1.585"

Hope that helps you.

[BrutalAB]

Aa no. 9 at 9.3 grains. Is my standard load for my henry big boy. I load to coal of 1.64"

5 Years ago i had an email exchange with western powders starting load was 8.8 and max was 9.8, they called for a magnum primer.

Velocity was stated at 900 to 1075 for a 6 inch barrel.

I get around 1300 out of my henry.

I believe there is data for no.7 or 5 in their free ish data magazine they used to put out. Ill check tonight if i can remember.

[Larry Gibson]

Blind Dog

As mentioned, you don't say what firearm they are to be used in?

The RCBS 350200-FN (the Lee is a clone) loaded in 38 SPL cases to 1.640" oal is about max length for use in revolvers. For a member here I pressure tested his load of 7.1 gr Alliant 2400 in R-P 38 SPL cases with a WSP primer. The pressure ran 10,700 psi as measured with the Oehler m43 PBL out of my Contender test barrel.

[Blind Dog]

Roger GP100 is my intended arm. This is for my “bear” loads during Colorado archery season. Currently using 170 grain hard cast Keith’s over 12 grains of 2400 with CCI SPP’s loaded in .38 special cases. I have the Lee mold and thought I’d try the 200’s.

[Larry Gibson]

I don't have the "Keith" mould as I use and prefer the 358156 for such loads. I have recently received from Outpost75 some 170 +/- gr cast bullets similar to the Keith bullet [358429] to pressure test in 38 SPL cases over 2400. I'd planed on testing up to 12 gr of 2400 so I will post the results when I get the test done. I may also test some 35-200-FNs with a bit more 2400.

[Silvercreek Farmer]

I don't have the "Keith" mould as I use and prefer the 358156 for such loads. I have recently received from Outpost75 some 170 +/- gr cast bullets similar to the Keith bullet [358429] to pressure test in 38 SPL cases over 2400. I'd planed on testing up to 12 gr of 2400 so I will post the results when I get the test done. I may also test some 35-200-FNs with a bit more 2400.

Just a hunch, but I think you will hit the max with a bit less than 12 grains of 2400 with the 200's.

[Blind Dog]

That would be very interesting to see when you're completed.

[Silvercreek Farmer]

I don't have the "Keith" mould as I use and prefer the 358156 for such loads. I have recently received from Outpost75 some 170 +/- gr cast bullets similar to the Keith bullet [358429] to pressure test in 38 SPL cases over 2400. I'd planed on testing up to 12 gr of 2400 so I will post the results when I get the test done. I may also test some 35-200-FNs with a bit more 2400.

Did ever get around to testing this combo?

[Larry Gibson]

Did ever get around to testing this combo?

Repost;

Please note; I am not recommending or saying anyone should shoot any of these loads in any revolver/firearm other than a 357 Magnum chambered revolver/firearm. I certainly do not recommend them for use in any 38 SPL chambered revolver other than the S&W 38/44 “Outdoorsman”, the Colt New Service and the Ruger Security Six chambered in 38 SPL. Even then I would only recommend loads within 38 SPL +P pressures. The data presented here is for information only.

38 SPL +P+ or 38/44 Loads with 170 gr Cast Bullets & 2400

Often on the forum someone asks about loading 160 – 180 gr cast bullets over 2400 powder in the 38 SPL for use in S&W 38/40 N frames along with 357 chambered handgun/rifles. The questions usually center around start and max loads.

Rem-UMC produced a 38/44 cartridge for use in the S&W 38/44 Outdoorsman revolver, the precursor to the 357 magnum revolver. The velocity was listed with 150 and 158 gr j and lead bullets in the 1120 - almost 1200 fps (just going from memory there. Colt is said to have said the 38/44 loads were fine to use in the Colt New Service revolver.

Over the years I've seen the 358156 seated to second crimp groove over 12.0 gr 2400 as "the" load for use in the S&W 38/44 revolvers. That load was also oft recommended for use in M19s and other 357 magnum revolvers "back in the day" when 38 SPL cases were plentiful and easy to obtain and 357 magnum cases were hard to find and expensive.

The 358136/12 gr 2400 was and still is an excellent load in 357 Revolvers. Years back i shot a lot of that load in my Colt Trooper, S&W M28 and Ruger BHs. Back then, as a low paid LEO, I had lots of 38 SPL cases but little 357 Magnum cases. These days I have a sufficient quantity of 357 magnum brass to use.
I have a bit of pressure test data on the Lyman 358156 seated out to the 2nd crimp groove loaded over 2400 in 38 SPL cases for use in 3844 or 357 handguns as that is what that bullet was designed for. The 358156 has become my favorite bullet of choice in the 357 Magnum for use with top end magnum loads. Also, if I was loading +P+ 38 SPLs for use in 357 magnums that is the bullet I would use.

Some seem to want to use the heavier bullets though so I’ve pressure tested two different bullets [36-168K & 36-175H supplied by Ed Harris (Outpost75)]. Many like the 358429 or similar bullets loaded to the crimp groove in 38 SPL cases because of fit in certain Magnum cylinders and feeds in some lever guns. Many also like the longer "Keith" design SWC for longer range shooting among other reasons. I am not averse to anyone using this bullet. The above test was done because many have asked me if I have Pressure tested the 358429 or similar bullet in 38 SPL cases with 2400 powder. The above test results are in answer to those queries.

Unfortunately, I no longer had a 170 gr Lyman “Keith” 358421 mould when I started pressure testing. I never developed an affinity for that bullet in the 357 or 38 SPL so long ago when I traded off an OM Ruger BH I let the mould go with it. I regret letting the Ruger go but not the 358421 mould. With the receipt of the 36-168K (169 gr) & 36-175H (184 gr) bullets I loaded them in 10 shot test strings of 8 – 12 gr in 1 gr increments. I used W-W 38 SPL cases and WSP

primers. Alliant 2400 was used. All charges were thrown using a Lyman 55 powder thrower. The bullets were crimped in the crimp groove with moderate crimp.

Testing was done last Monday, May 22, at the local range here. Temperature was 90 degrees with 7% humidity. Testing was done in the shade so the ambient temperature is also the temperature of the ammunition.

The test firearm was a Contender with a 7.94” barrel. The pressure data and velocity was obtained via a strain gauge attached over the chamber connected to the Oehler M43 PBL. The M43 corrects the screen velocity to muzzle velocity and I posted muzzle velocity. Chronographing the similar loads in a 6” barreled Ruger Security Six results in 150 – 200 fps less velocity out of the revolver.

Test results are the averages of the 10 shots with each test string;

36-168K (169 gr)
Load……Vel……..PSI
8.0……..923……20,100
9.0…….1065…..22,800
10.0…..1151…..24,600
11.0…..1291…..27,000
12.0…..1392…..28,900

36-175H (184 gr)
Load……Vel……..PSI
8.0……..948……22,500
9.0…….1094…..24,400
10.0.....1185…..25,500
11.0…..1298…...28,100
12.0…..1396……29,700

[Barry54]

There are three different powder options for a 200 grain cast boolet on the Hodgdon reloading data center. The oal with the Lee version requires seating below the crimp groove in magnum brass.

600 FPS 38 Special loads with the 200 grain Lee are very mild.

[mehavey]

Whether seated in Magnum or Special Brass, the same OAL --> same powder volume/ballstics

[45DUDE]

Love your posts Larry--Old post but the Lee book has 40 loads in 357 brass using a 200 grain lead boolit with different lengths. For accurate loads I find 200 lead more accurate with a 38 special case from a 19-3 S&W. 2400 has been the better powder for me. There are 40 loads of 38 special with a 200 grain lead boolit in the Lee book. I base my tests on if I can get a boolit grouping 1 1/2'' or so at 25 yards bench with 10 shots I'm really close and wright it down. I use the Lyman 195 grain mold. Western makes a good grouping 200 grain boolit for 357 brass. I tend to stay away from top end loads=I don't have an N frame at the time. My 19-3 groups very good and I don't wont to take a chance loosing accuracy. Here is a 50 yard load I worked up with 4227 with a 200 National but they went out of business. IN A S&W MODEL 27 you have to use 38 brass. In Model 19 you can use 357 brass because the cylinder is longer than a model 27.

[gunarea]

OK Guys
Yesterday at the range playing Lawnsteel, Nancy fired the RCBS 35-200 through her S&W madel 27 for two games. We use this slug for precision handgun competition. It is loaded into 38 and 357 cases. Fired through several different handguns. The load being tailored to match a sight setting. This is being done with Red dot, Promo and Bullseye. Loaded to fit different chambers and legnths, we find the slug to be one of the most accurate in these calibers and deliver greater knockdown, on steel, than similar weights in larger calibers. In Lawnsteel play, accuracy is top priority! I personaly run the RCBS 35-200 through a Uberti rolling block pistol, Ruger N/M Blackhawk and S&W 66. It is easy to get high level accuracy in an open sighted handgun. Lawnsteel players do it regularly and routinely! Handguns employed by other Lawnsteel players with this slug are; Contenders, Tarus raging hunter, S&W (mods 27, 66, 686, 19) Ruger Blackhawk. Not a big deal to us! Simply ask any Lawnsteel player and they will gladly explain how they do it. Best of skill to you.
Roy

[justindad]

The Western Powders Handloading Guide #1 has data for a 200 grain boolit using A#2, Accurate TCM, and A#11FS. I bet Ramshot’s website has this same data.