Magnus vs Zero swaged boolits for 45 ACP target shooting

[gregw72]

I have been using Missouri Bullet Co. 200gr LSWC bullets with good success in my Range Officer 1911. The local bullseye guys say that MBC is not all that and I should be shooting a "swaged" lead boolit. Seems like Magnus and Zero are both swaged and get mentioned a lot. Anyone have experience with either or preferably both? Or, do you have a better source of target grade LSWC bullets. I have intention or time to cast my own. Thanks!

[Preacher Jim]

Magnus is located close to my daughter, I started using them and have had great results in my tuned 1911s. I can recommend them for quality products.

[winelover]

I've been using Magnus Bullets for many years.......when I'm too lazy to cast. However, I have only used their machine cast ones. Good company that must be doing something right since they are still in business, when others have folded.


Winelover

[kenton]

If you are having good success why change? If you just want try new things more power to you.

[boatbum101]

I shoot Bullseye & use the Zero bullets . Both the 200gr SWC & 185 SWCHP are excellent . Both are capable of shooting a clean target @ 50yds if shooter does his part . You don't need to push them as hard as cast . 200gr swaged Zero SWC start with 3.8grs Bullseye , 185 start with 3.9grs Bullseye . Have also had good luck with 4.2 WST , 4.4 with 185 . VVN-310 also works well but is faster than Bulleye with a 200 start with 3.6grs . These should function unless gun is very tight , then you might have to bump loads above a tad to get functioning . With open sights & stock 16lb recoil spring you should be OK , if not try a 14lb recoil spring . Hammer spring should be reduced from stock 23lb to a 19lb . If you still have the ILS mainspring housing , I replace them with a standard 1911 MSH . Hope this helps . If you have questions PM me & we can talk . BTW Zero makes these bullets regardless of where you buy them . Magnus makes their own cast , but swaged bullets are all made by Zero . Cheapest place to buy is Powder Valley or direct from Roze Distribution . Sometimes Zero / Roze website has not been updated . Worth a phone call to verify rather in stock or not . Also the Zero 185 JHP shoots as good as the vaunted Nosler 185 JHP .
IMHO the Missouri Bullets are too hard & their lube sucks . TL them with 45-45-10 . If you stick with a 200gr cast H&G 68 style , for 50yds try 4.2grs Bullseye & for 25yds 3.5grs Bullseye .

[dondiego]

I shoot Bullseye & use the Zero bullets . Both the 200gr SWC & 185 SWCHP are excellent . Both are capable of shooting a clean target @ 50yds if shooter does his part . You don't need to push them as hard as cast . 200gr swaged Zero SWC start with 3.8grs Bullseye , 185 start with 3.9grs Bullseye . Have also had good luck with 4.2 WST , 4.4 with 185 . VVN-310 also works well but is faster than Bulleye with a 200 start with 3.6grs . These should function unless gun is very tight , then you might have to bump loads above a tad to get functioning . With open sights & stock 16lb recoil spring you should be OK , if not try a 14lb recoil spring . Hammer spring should be reduced from stock 23lb to a 19lb . If you still have the ILS mainspring housing , I replace them with a standard 1911 MSH . Hope this helps . If you have questions PM me & we can talk . BTW Zero makes these bullets regardless of where you buy them . Magnus makes their own cast , but swaged bullets are all made by Zero . Cheapest place to buy is Powder Valley or direct from Roze Distribution . Sometimes Zero / Roze website has not been updated . Worth a phone call to verify rather in stock or not . Also the Zero 185 JHP shoots as good as the vaunted Nosler 185 JHP .

Why would you think that you have to push cast harder than swaged? There is little difference between cast and swaged. From my experience Magnus bullets are as good as any swaged or cast bullet out there.

[boatbum101]

Well lets see . 40+ years of shooting Bullseye & scoring targets , thousands of rounds Ransom Rest testing hundreds of Bullseye guns etc . Granted a softer load might be accurate @ 50yds , but slower loads are more difficult to shoot well off hand . For 50yd cast 780fps is what you want , swaged will group @ 720 fps . Didn't say Magnus made bad bullets , their cast is pretty much same as all the other commercial harder than you need .

[charlie b]

Yep. Swaged bullets are typically a softer alloy so they do not need as big a push to engrave the rifling. They also expand faster to seal the bore, letting less gas blow by (which is a cause of leading).

It isn't much of a difference.

[dondiego]

I have cast bullets of pure lead and shot them at low velocities with no issues.

[gregw72]

I shoot Bullseye & use the Zero bullets . Both the 200gr SWC & 185 SWCHP are excellent . Both are capable of shooting a clean target @ 50yds if shooter does his part . You don't need to push them as hard as cast . 200gr swaged Zero SWC start with 3.8grs Bullseye , 185 start with 3.9grs Bullseye . Have also had good luck with 4.2 WST , 4.4 with 185 . VVN-310 also works well but is faster than Bulleye with a 200 start with 3.6grs . These should function unless gun is very tight , then you might have to bump loads above a tad to get functioning . With open sights & stock 16lb recoil spring you should be OK , if not try a 14lb recoil spring . Hammer spring should be reduced from stock 23lb to a 19lb . If you still have the ILS mainspring housing , I replace them with a standard 1911 MSH . Hope this helps . If you have questions PM me & we can talk . BTW Zero makes these bullets regardless of where you buy them . Magnus makes their own cast , but swaged bullets are all made by Zero . Cheapest place to buy is Powder Valley or direct from Roze Distribution . Sometimes Zero / Roze website has not been updated . Worth a phone call to verify rather in stock or not . Also the Zero 185 JHP shoots as good as the vaunted Nosler 185 JHP .
IMHO the Missouri Bullets are too hard & their lube sucks . TL them with 45-45-10 . If you stick with a 200gr cast H&G 68 style , for 50yds try 4.2grs Bullseye & for 25yds 3.5grs Bullseye .

Great information! The local High Master Bullseye shooter got me turned on to WST and 200gr LSWC. I have used Zero bullets in 9mm, 357 and 45 ACP (all JHP) and they have been nearly as good as Hornady XTPs. I also either get them from Roze or Powder Valley.

Seems like you and I are on the same page on the RO modifications. The first thing I did was take out the ILS system and install a lighter hammer spring and also a reduced weight Cylinder and Slide sear spring. Made the trigger much better. Now I need to mount an UltraDot on the sucker like I have on my Buckmark and I will be good to go.

[boatbum101]

Fit a tighter bushing will really help . Also pull your slide stop & mic the pin . Most SA's will have .195 pins . You can also put a .200 pin & in extreme cases a .203 pin in . Both will help with group size . EGW will custom cut you a bushing , you want the angle bored . Measure the end of your barrel & opening on the front of the slide . You want .001" clearance both inner & outer . Say end of barrel mics .590 , you'd want bushing ID to be .591 . End of slide mics .701 , you want bushing OD of .700 . Around $50 for the pair from EGW . Since you've local experienced shooters , one can help you with this . You want precise measurements & check slide clearance & upper lug engagement prior to going oversize on the slide stop . These will improve lockup . Pretty much stuck with factory lower lug fit as is unless you fit a new barrel correctly . Many have done these mods to the RO .

[gregw72]

Fit a tighter bushing will really help . Also pull your slide stop & mic the pin . Most SA's will have .195 pins . You can also put a .200 pin & in extreme cases a .203 pin in . Both will help with group size . EGW will custom cut you a bushing , you want the angle bored . Measure the end of your barrel & opening on the front of the slide . You want .001" clearance both inner & outer . Say end of barrel mics .590 , you'd want bushing ID to be .591 . End of slide mics .701 , you want bushing OD of .700 . Around $50 for the pair from EGW . Since you've local experienced shooters , one can help you with this . You want precise measurements & check slide clearance & upper lug engagement prior to going oversize on the slide stop . These will improve lockup . Pretty much stuck with factory lower lug fit as is unless you fit a new barrel correctly . Many have done these mods to the RO .

Fantastic feedback. I literally was looking at getting a new bushing the other day. Mine comes out with my fingers no problem. Good to know about the angle bushing and slide stop. For the price point, I have been very happy with the RO. I just got another one in 9mm, but that seems like a much harder beast to make shoot well.

Thanks to all of the posters for their feedback!

[boatbum101]

Yup 9mm is a whole different kettle of fish . I wouldn't buy a production gun in 9mm if you want it for Bullseye . 38 Super is much easier to work with , plus it will be accurate enough with lead & reduced loads . 9mm it's jacketed , new brass for 50yds & loaded to 1100fps+ . Recoil is snappier than either 45 or 38 Super with BE loads . Google KC Crawford in Maysville , NC . He's a retired USMC marksmanship unit armorer who built GySgt Zinns guns when he was active duty . He will tell you about 38 Super . Long time womens Champ Ruby Fox shot 38 Super in CF matches & her guns were built by the legendary Bob Marvel . Seriously 9mm is an incredible PITA & costly to be competitive . You can build 2 45acp guns for what a good 9mm will costs . IIRC a 9mm can be converted to 38 Super rather easily .

[gregw72]

Very good info on the 9mm. Wasn't planning to use it for Bullseye, but wanted to have a target gun for load development and just plain fun that shot 9mm. My dad has a mint condition Sig P210 that will shoot Winchester White Box into a 2" group at 25 yards off hand without trying too hard. Have yet to find a 9mm that will shoot that well. Guess the AMU guys using the Beretta had to do some interesting tricks to get that to work. Very interesting comment on the 38 super. They are very popular for IPSC/USPSA events, but I've never heard anyone talk about accuracy. Now my interest is piqued. Bob Marvel was the man and his Marvel 22 conversion kits for the 1911 are great.