Double Rifle Regulation - Need Some Samples

[Huvius]

Looks like a great rifle. Congratulations!
Is this your first BPE double?
I was going to mention the Berry's bullets too. I've used them in a Westley and they seem to shoot well enough but that particular rifle shot just about everything well - it was a single shot btw.
If they happen to work for you, that's a lot of reasonably priced shooting! Not a traditionally shaped or sexy looking boolit, but very economical.
I have a lot of those on hand if you want to try some out and I will also send you some swaged paper patched boolits in the 350gr range I make to try out.
How are the bores?
I ask, because it seems that old BPE rifles with iffy bores can shoot jacketed (but maybe not plated as the Berry's) better than cast or paper patched.
I just picked up a 450BPE hammer rifle too and can't wait to get it out to see what it likes!

[vandeusenps]

Looks like a great rifle. Congratulations!
Is this your first BPE double?
I was going to mention the Berry's bullets too. I've used them in a Westley and they seem to shoot well enough but that particular rifle shot just about everything well - it was a single shot btw.
If they happen to work for you, that's a lot of reasonably priced shooting! Not a traditionally shaped or sexy looking boolit, but very economical.
I have a lot of those on hand if you want to try some out and I will also send you some swaged paper patched boolits in the 350gr range I make to try out.
How are the bores?
I ask, because it seems that old BPE rifles with iffy bores can shoot jacketed (but maybe not plated as the Berry's) better than cast or paper patched.
I just picked up a 450BPE hammer rifle too and can't wait to get it out to see what it likes!

Thanks Huvius! Yes, this is my first double rifle. The bores on this one are very nice considering age, I can’t detect any pitting in either side. I would definitely like to try some of your Berry’s if you can spare a few.

I’ve tried paper patched bullets only once before...results were not promising, but I will say that was my first go at paper patching. I bought the .451 350 grain swaged bullets from BACO, they patched up to .457. I actually just loaded a new batch to try, this time using black powder revolver seals sandwiched between to milk carton wads above 110 grains of Swiss 2f. I’m thinking that a larger final diameter bullet would probably work better, but we’ll see!

Very nice 450, what flavor is that one?

[iomskp]

Regulating can be a bit of a challenge best way to solve it would be to give the rifle to me, I promise I would take good care of it. Back to reality well done on the purchase, doubles can be tricky the best advise I can give is log every change and the results of that change.

[dtknowles]

My Belgian Double in 450 BPE





I have loaded a couple different cast bullets (purchased) that I don't recall offhand over 110 gr. of fff from different makers with just a card wad between the bullet and powder with just between a quarter and an eight inch of compression in Hornady NE brass. The shot well enough to not need messing with. Three inch groups 4 shot groups two from each barrel with express sights.

It has what I think is called Henry rifling. Poliganal with spikes in the corners. The barrels are 30 inches long but it looks like it was cut back from something longer. The Hornady brass sized in Hornady dies would not chamber so I lapped the chambers until they would. It did not take much lapping, looking down the breach you would never know.

The wood is so nice.


Tim

[vandeusenps]

My Belgian Double in 450 BPE





I have loaded a couple different cast bullets (purchased) that I don't recall offhand over 110 gr. of fff from different makers with just a card wad between the bullet and powder with just between a quarter and an eight inch of compression in Hornady NE brass. The shot well enough to not need messing with. Three inch groups 4 shot groups two from each barrel with express sights.

It has what I think is called Henry rifling. Poliganal with spikes in the corners. The barrels are 30 inches long but it looks like it was cut back from something longer. The Hornady brass sized in Hornady dies would not chamber so I lapped the chambers until they would. It did not take much lapping, looking down the breach you would never know.

The wood is so nice.


Tim

Tim, a nice looking rifle indeed. You reminded me of the most frustrating part of purchasing my rifle...the chambers on these old guns are typically smaller than SAAMI or CIP spec, as was mine. Full length sized Hornady 450 brass didn't fit all the way into the chamber. Taking desperate measures, I search online for a solution, and ended up using a Lee .510 bullet sizing die to squeeze the portion of brass down that was holding it up from fully chambering. After doing this, I was able to chamber some rounds, fire them, and send the cases off to Hornady to have them build a custom sizing die for me. Three months later, I received the custom die and the cases drop in to the chamber now as they should!

[Huvius]

Very nice 450, what flavor is that one?

It actually has no name or serial number but almost certainly made by P. Webley or Webley & Scott.
450 3-1/4" chambering.

PM your address and I will post some of these Berry's to you and I can throw in some Hornadys too for you to try if you will pay postage.

[lar45]

I almost forgot an important detail.
Double rifles are regulated to be shot standing, not from the bench. That way the rifle and your body move together. The right barrel will recoil up and to the right and the left up and to the left.
While you are working up your load, mark the targets with the load and the holes for the left and right barrels so you can track your progress. I did all of my testing at 50 yds and shot for the centers of the right and left targets to be about 1.5" apart with the right barrel printing on the right and the left barrel on the left. Make sure they are not backwards and crossing.
What I did for mine was took a 2x4 and built a 90 deg triangle, then when I was sighting in at the range I would take a C clamp and clamp the triangle to an upright next to the shooting benches, put a sandbag on it and rest my left forearm on the bag while holding the rifle. Get the sights lined up a little low on the target and raise up slightly and shoot.

[vandeusenps]

I almost forgot an important detail.
Double rifles are regulated to be shot standing, not from the bench. That way the rifle and your body move together. The right barrel will recoil up and to the right and the left up and to the left.
While you are working up your load, mark the targets with the load and the holes for the left and right barrels so you can track your progress. I did all of my testing at 50 yds and shot for the centers of the right and left targets to be about 1.5" apart with the right barrel printing on the right and the left barrel on the left. Make sure they are not backwards and crossing.
What I did for mine was took a 2x4 and built a 90 deg triangle, then when I was sighting in at the range I would take a C clamp and clamp the triangle to an upright next to the shooting benches, put a sandbag on it and rest my left forearm on the bag while holding the rifle. Get the sights lined up a little low on the target and raise up slightly and shoot.

Lar, funny you should mention this...my first few range sessions were shot sitting at the bench with my left hand holding the barrels and resting on a sandbag. I was getting horrible groups, and crossing badly. Then, I decided to play around with a few rounds standing while shooting at steel plates at 50 yards. I noticed my bullet marks on the plates were much closer together and not crossing. My offhand groups standing were much better than sitting at a rest with my off hand resting on a sandbag! You live you learn! Thanks for the 2x4 idea...sounds like a simple fix for shooting at the range.

[lar45]

Here's my 470

[vandeusenps]

Here's my 470

Very nice, one day when I grow up I’ll be able to afford a nitro double!

[Rick B]

Looking forward to a shooting report.
Rick

[vandeusenps]

Just wanted to say thanks again to all who have sent bullets for me to try! Thanks to the kind members on this site, I now have 6 different bullets to try. As I get time to head to the range, I will post results here.

First up are the Lyman 457122 and Hornady j-bullets, both loaded with smokeless. Should have a report posted within the next few weeks.

[vandeusenps]

Well, finally got a chance to get to the range today, although with a 20mph crosswind and a temperature of 28 degrees, conditions weren't the greatest. I got a chance to try some of the bullets I received from the members on this site. The pic below is a CADD rendition of three groups of four, green are right barrel, red is left. The crosshair shows aim point, and bullet holes are shown to scale at .458":

Left and Center Group: Lyman 457122, both groups shot with 52 grains H4198 and foam backer rod.

Right Group: Hornady 350 grain Jacketed, shot with 110 grains Olde Eynsford 3F.

Obviously, more development is needed. The 350 grain jacketed is showing the most promise, but looks like I'll have to increase velocity with either Swiss 3F, or smokeless.