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Thread: 1/2" at what range

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    1/2" at what range

    At what range will your, more or less out of the box gun, shoot into a 1/2" circle? Not a 1/2" group, but all of the shots, (at least 5 consecutive) INSIDE a 1/2" circle. A few minor modifications, such as trigger adjustment/change, bedding, etc. are acceptable for this conversation but I'm really not interested in full blown custom built guns. Stock target rifles and "high end" rifles are included in my "box" gun definition as long as they are that, stock.

    I have found a new to me, game, that is a great deal of fun to shoot and am curious as what you folks have for rifle/ammo combinations that will meet the 1/2" criteria.
    There are 550 million arms in worldwide circulation. This is 1 firearm for every 12 people on the planet. The only question is , HOW DO WE ARM THE OTHER !!? The Lord of War.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master


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    So a group of .500-.222 for .278"?

    All my guns will do that at some range

    At 100 yards, none of my .22's can do that...so should I say...I am not capable.
    Last edited by dverna; 01-07-2020 at 02:53 PM.
    Don Verna

    NRA Endowment Member

  3. #3
    Boolit Grand Master


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    At 50 yards my Remington Model 504 will put 5 shots inside 1/2" with select ammunition most of the time. My old Remington M37 target rifle (box stock) will 10 shots inside 1/2" at 50 yards all day long in decent conditions with most all "match" 22LRs.

    We shoot a 400 point 100 yard BR match once a month here. Four 10 shot strings are shot on 4 different bulls. The X ring is right at 1". Usually there are 4 or 5 400 point scores with the winner being by X count. I have shot numerous 10 shot strings with 10 Xs with the right select match ammunition and under mild wind conditions. The winners have very high end match or custom built match rifles. I usually place 2nd to 4th...….. which is fine with me as it's just a fun shoot.
    Larry Gibson

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  4. #4
    Boolit Master
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    ah, I just realized this is under rimfire after typing for a while. inside a half inch without touching is strict, basically means .25" group. but I know a new cz455 with various eley ammo will do a normal .5" 5 shot at 50yds. but I can do your standard at 25yds which I guess don't sound very impressive when its put like that

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    The most economical gun I've eve owned that could do that is my CZ455 sporter with very select/tested ammo, shot off a solid rest with me shooting the gun. My only concession to modification was adding a Timney trigger to it...under a hundred bucks for the trigger. I have owned two different Anschutz rifles that would do this right out of the box with no modifications. However, both of those guns were a minimum of three times the cost of the CZ. Actually, about four times the cost. Even then, it required a lot of time testing ammo to find what worked the best and then buying a large lot of that ammo. FWIW, I shot around 35,000 rounds of .22lr rifle a year for over ten years back when I shot a lot of competition. You don't just buy a gun and ammo and "get er done". There's a definite learning curve. Good luck with your new shooting game.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    I didn’t do anything to my 22 WMR Ruger American plain Jane all black with a 22 inch barrel accuracy wise except for lighten the trigger. I polish the trigger group and cut about a coil and a half out of the trigger spring. It breaks around 18 ounces. The very first time I took it out I shot a .648 and a .678” 3 shot group at 100 yards with Winchester 2250 ft./s ballistic tip varmint ammo. I only shot 3 inch groups and I repeated it again with another three. I then tried two groups of three with Hornaday 2200 ft./s Vmax ammo. I shot a .312” and a .314” with two groups of 3 in a row. So I guess if I would’ve shot six times with the same or ammo at each target you can average these groups out. I used a Nikon 3.5x14 pro staff 5 and Warne QD rings. I’ve since installed a KDW scope base so I can take my night vision on and off of it as well. I removed my quick detached mounts with my Nikon last year and forgot I did it and reinstalled it and never checked zero. If you seen some of the posts I listed here on the squirrels I’ve shot at 100 yards my POA obviously never moved. Now my 22lr CZ 452 ultralux I bought used I mounted a 2x7vx1 with tasco rings, never cleaned it, or checked action screws for torque specs. I did lighten the trigger. Maybe pulls at a pound max. The optic was pretty blurry and I tried a bunch of groups at 50 yards and the best groups came from the cheap Winchester 33 threes with shot a half inch group outside the outside. Aquilas Wouldn’t hit minute of pie plate at 50 yards. Velocitors shot a .7”, 5 shot group. I cleaned the barrel the other day, I talked my action screws to 22 inch pounds( it took a good full turn and a half so they were maybe 10 in pounds?), I remove my rear sight blade to install a longer optic, and installed a cheap tasco world class 3x9 mildot optic. I’ll have to retest. I bought some CCI stingers and I’m hoping they shoot under an inch at 50 yards. I’ll sight in with the Winchester 333’s and see if they shoot tighter.


    I did some research on that Ruger American 22 inch barrel 22WR Martin and saw that someone get a gun review on it and shot about the same groups with those Hornaday Vmax so I don’t think it’s uncommon to have that gun and ammo combo to shoot that tight of groups. My Smith has one and recommended it to me as his shoots just as tight with vmax. I found mine on sale the Christmas before last at Cabela’s discontinued for 199 bucks. I called the store which was an hour away and they had one left and zero left in any other stores in 17 HMR or 22 WinMag I paid for the last 22 WMR they had over the phone and literally ran to my truck and drove there and picked it up. Best thing I ever did it’s the funnest gun I own. I did have a few feel the fires and fired ammo sticking in the chamber when I first got it. I Took apart the bolt and found very ruff machining, a good size burr of metal floating around in it and thick dark grease packed in it. I polished all the parts and reassembled with some synthetic slip 2000 and polished the inside of my chamber with mothers chrome polish. Never had a hiccup since. I still have to clean my chamber after about every box of 50 or two or I’ll get build up from all the powder residue and the empty cases will start sticking again. I did have some FTF Until I cleaned the bolt. The only random FTF i still had was from the Winchester’s which I’ve read is pretty common with that ammo. I stopped buying it and have zero FTF with the hornadys and they shoot tighter anyways.

    It must be a rimfire thing because that used CZ that I bought had 3 out of 4 FTFs right off the bat. Whoever owned it never cleaned it. I took the bolt apart and found it had shellac and varnish all over the internals and look like a dirty carburetor. I polished all the parts and put it back together with the same lube and I had only one FTF in 200 rounds when I tested it. I blame that on a bad round as well cause I tried to fire it three times in a row and tossed it.
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 01-06-2020 at 02:59 PM.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    25 yards or 50 yards depending on what you mean by inside the circle. At 25 yards all the shots would be inside the circle not even touching the circle easy. I have three firearms that can do that my Anschutz Exemplar, my Ruger MKII Hunter and my Savage Anschutz mark 10. At 50 yards some of the shots would cut the circle. The at 50 yards assumes a nice day. As you extend the range with .22 LR wind conditions make a big difference.

    Tim
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  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    My BSA martini international can shoot tiny groups at 50 yards but me keeping a group inside a half inch circle is something else.

  9. #9
    Boolit Grand Master



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    Groups are measured center to center of the holes. To be inside a 1/2" circle you are needing to shoot a 1/4" group. Very few rimfire guns or ammo are capable of that type accuracy at 50 yards.

    This is what the very best rifles and ammo can do.

    https://www.accurateshooter.com/guns...mparison-test/

    http://forums.accuratereloading.com/...3/m/9871088921

    Capable ammo is not cheap.

    https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1392140858
    Last edited by M-Tecs; 01-06-2020 at 08:00 PM.
    2nd Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. - "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

  10. #10
    Boolit Grand Master tazman's Avatar
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    I have 2 CZ rifles that will do that at 25 yards. At 50 yards, close but not quite.
    Easily minute of squirrel head though.

  11. #11
    Check the dimensions of an NRA 50 Yard and 100 yard target. I don't have one in front of me to measure but I think the 10 ring @ 50 is about the dimensions your looking at. Any quality target rifle like an Anshutz 2013 or Bliecker will shoot one hole groups all day long when paired with the right ammo.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
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    I have a CZ455 that will do it with RWS ammo and get very very close to the same with CCI Standard Velocity. Sporter barrel, wood stock, and a bipod.It has a Mueller scope that had so so reviews on RimfireCentral.com, but is working very nicely.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    Most of my scoped (or target sighted) rifles will do it (.278 group cyc) at 25 yards. Both T-bolts, a M69 Winchester, and the 69A all capable of .25 at 25 yards for 5 shot groups. 52Sporter repro probably at 35 yards but limited by the 6x scope I use almost universally on my squirrel rifles. I believe my Match 54 international held that at 50 meters, but has been 35years since I tried, talking 50 meter prone competition.
    I no longer have the inclination to pay the price for target ammo that is needed to consistently hold good groups on paper. Even less interest in benchrest, so the data is old and over a long period of time. In general a box stock 22lr that hold consistent .278 ctc groups at 25 is not terribly uncommon, but at 50 that becomes much more costly and unusual, for a stock Sporter.
    I forgot, but my 10 inch MkII Ruger would do it at 25 yards when scoped and benchrested, I thought that exceptional. That based on numerous 3/8 inch 10 shot groups from it @25. My M17 8 3/8 would probably do it scoped, just guessing but I shot some very tight open shifted grouped with it, back in the day.
    “You don’t practice until you get it right. You practice until you can’t get it wrong.” Jason Elam, All-Pro kicker, Denver Broncos

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    I test my rifles and ammo with ARA rimfire targets, if you don't cut the first line, it's inside. 500, cut outside the big ring, and it's over an inch. I use to play all kinds of games over at rimfire central. The .25 at 25, and .25 at 50 club where two of my favourite. You shoot 4 groups of 5 shots and 4 sizer shots on the same sheet of paper, measure the smudge marks of the sizers, average, and measure outside smudge of the groups widest point, then subtract the sizer for you group. 3 of the 4 groups had to be less than 0.250 for the gun to get in the club. Same gun, different ammo was allowed.
    To make it work takes a gun that's capable, ammo that's capable, a shooter that's capable, and just about dead calm weather conditions, and in my experience 70F and above temps. The lower the temp goes, the harder it got for me because of ammo ignition and lubrication behaves erratically.

    Probably my best bone stock 50 yard rifle is Remington 541T shooting ELEY ammo. I have 2 Browning T- Bolts that will do it at 25 yards, and two self customized 10-22s that will do less than. 250 at 25 yards. When you start shooting that ARA target where accuracy and consistency count, that's where the rubber meets the road!

    I love to hear some one say "I've got a bla bla bla that'll shot into a dime at 50 yards all day long", I've not seen a single one able to back it up at the range! Not one! Shooting 22lr rimfire into tiny groups is its own form of insanity!

  15. #15
    Boolit Grand Master



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    Yep the lot to lot accuracy variation of ammo was to much for me. Whenever I found a good lot searching for a useable supply was a pain.
    2nd Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. - "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

  16. #16
    Boolit Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Well I went out with my CZ today and finally sighted it in with a new cheap Tasco world class scope 3 x 9 mill dot I mounted on it the other day. I also torqued the front and rear action screws to 22 inch pounds. It took me a little bit but I finally got it sighted in at 25 yards with Winchester 333’s that I knew shot very well out of the gun. Last time I tested it when I first bought the gun and did not clean the barrel or check the action screws and I was shooting consistently half inch groups at 50 yards with the 333’s. My actions screws when I checked them the other day were very loose. It took a good one and a half plus rotations with my wheeler torque wrench to tighten them to 22 inch pounds. I also cleaned the barrel for the first time. When I sighted the gun in today at 25 yards I aimed for a bullet hole in the target. I stack three in the bullet hole that looked like one hole basically. I then went out to 50 yards to try a group of the CCI stingers that I bought the other day. I wasn’t expecting miracles because ive read on every other forum that they did not group very well in CZ rifles. Here’s my first five shot group at 50 yards with the CCI stingers. I do have to firmly close the bolt as the bullets grab the lands. I’ll be using them for squirrel hunting from now on and then the Winchester 333’s for back up when I can’t afford to go out and buy the expensive stingers.







    After I shot this group I checked it at 75 yards and they drop about an inch and a half. I then played with the mill dots with the cheap Winchester ammo at 100 yards. I had it set at nine power and hit dead on aimed with the second mill dot dead center. Once I figured out where the drops were at 100 yards I hit 11 out of 11 little pieces of stones that were the size of a 50 Cent pieces or smaller. The gun is ridiculously accurate!
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 01-06-2020 at 09:19 PM.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master Forrest r's Avatar
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    Interesting to say the least.

    The 1/2" @ 25yds is a good test for sporter rifles.

    All's anyone has to do is grab a handful of usbr targets and play around on the 50yd line. The 9-ring is .3", if you can consistently hit 9's or better on a usbr target. You'll be in the ballpark.

  18. #18
    Boolit Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Here’s the very first 100 yard group I shot with my my Ruger American 22 WMR with hornady vmax ammo.

    I shot a smaller group the second time around a few minutes later.



    and here is the first 100 yard group testing the Winchester varmint ammo at 100 yards...




    Imo the 22 wmr’s are more inherently accurate.


    Here’s a review with similar results...


    http://www.downrange.tv/blog/reviewi...-magnum/26532/

  19. #19
    Boolit Man

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    My Nylon 66 and Browning Bl-22 lever will shoot inside 1/2" at 30 yards with the ammo they like best, Mini mags in the BL-22 and RWS HVHP in the Nylon 66. They are equipped with peep sights, if scoped I could stretch that out a bit.
    My scoped 552 Speedmaster will keep RWS Subsonics inside 1/2" at 50 yards. I shoot 10 shot groups with it, and they are always in a dime size cluster at 50 yards.
    The CZ American Varmint barrel and skinny barrel Ruger 77, both in .17 HMR will do 1/2" at 100 yards, with Hornady ammo.
    My Ruger MK IV Lite pistol is capable of 1/2" groups, if only I could hold it steady enough !

  20. #20
    Boolit Master


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    Man, I am not nearly as good as most of you. Shooting a consistent .278" 5 shot group at 50 yards+ with a stock .22 rifle is excellent.
    Don Verna

    NRA Endowment Member

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