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Thread: automating my Mark IV Ballisti-cast bullet caster need input.

  1. #21
    Boolit Master jmorris's Avatar
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    Yep, not counting friction a 1:1 or direct drive would give you motor output torque. A 2:1 reduction would double it a 1:2 increase in speed would cut it in half.

  2. #22
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    Gear motor should be here tomorrow and then the hunt for either a piece of aluminum to mount the bullet caster and motor on or the less costly heavier piece of steel. I could have gotten a piece of aluminum in Iowa for probably around $22 so it will probably cost three times that much in Arizona. Also have my timed relay. Currently looking for sprockets for use on a 5/8" shaft.

  3. #23
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    I received my Bodine gear reduction motor yesterday. Its a stout motor capable of over 20ft lbs of torque. Next to find a chunk of aluminum.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Its a pretty good sized motor. It came with a 10 tooth sprocket with the number PF 0713 on it. 5/8" shaft on the ballisti-cast and 3/4" on the motor.

    The sprocket that came with the motor measures 1.835 tip to tip across. Bottom of the notch across to the bottom of the next notch is about .445

    Looks like a #40 chain.
    Last edited by 6bg6ga; 01-15-2020 at 04:46 PM.

  4. #24
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    Anyone have a #40 twenty tooth sprocket for a 5/8 shaft and some chain they want to sell reasonably.

  5. #25
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    I have parts in hand now.

  6. #26
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    Looking forward to updates
    Mike
    NRA Benefactor 2004 USAF RET 1971-95

  7. #27
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    Need an answer from someone experienced with sprockets.

    The motor came with a 10t 3/4" bore sprocket which I assumed was 1/2" pitch. I figured I was set for that sprocket so I ordered a 20tooth 1/2" pitch sprocket for the bullet caster along with a chain. The problem now is the chain cannot be tightened. Do I have the wrong sprocket selection? I'm wondering now if the motor sprocket is slightly different in pitch or something.

  8. #28
    Boolit Master jmorris's Avatar
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    I don’t understand the question, if the chain won’t lay down (doesn’t fit) in the sprocket, it’s the wrong pitch. Has nothing to do with tightening it though.

    Might take a look at these.

    https://www.rollerchain4less.com/ans...imension-chart

    https://www.usarollerchain.com/Metri...art-s/4870.htm

    https://www.efficientplantmag.com/20...ain-sprockets/

  9. #29
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    NoZombies's Avatar
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    I'll be keeping an eye on this, eventually I'd like to add automation to the mark X. Too many other projects on the table at the moment, but one day soon...
    Nozombies.com Practical Zombie Survival

    Collecting .32 molds. Please let me know if you have one you don't need, cause I might "need" it!

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmorris View Post
    I don’t understand the question, if the chain won’t lay down (doesn’t fit) in the sprocket, it’s the wrong pitch. Has nothing to do with tightening it though.

    Might take a look at these.

    https://www.rollerchain4less.com/ans...imension-chart

    https://www.usarollerchain.com/Metri...art-s/4870.htm

    https://www.efficientplantmag.com/20...ain-sprockets/
    I figured after I posted this that the motor sprocket from China must be something slightly off the #40. I ordered a new sprocket for the motor. Since I have a #40 chain and a sprocket for the Mark IV that is 1/2" pitch the only logical solution was to replace the motor sprocket with something of a known pitch that would mate with what I have.

    To be honest I don't know for sure what the exact pitch of the motor sprocket is/was. I got tired of trying to get it to mate correctly and simply ordered something that I know what it is. It doesn't seem to conform to U.S. specifications or Metric. If I had a chunk of the original chain it would have helped.
    Last edited by 6bg6ga; 02-15-2020 at 05:07 AM.

  11. #31
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    Due to the lack of a piece of 1/2" aluminum plate that I wanted I bolted the Mark IV directly to my bench along with the motor. Yesterday I mounted a 120 volt solenoid to the frame of the Mark IV along with a pull cable. Going to use what I have in hand right now to get it working. The new sprocket for the motor will arrive Monday. I currently have a optical switch and a programmable relay I'm going to employ to time and cycle the caster. The optical switch will be operated off the mold/crank assembly and break the beam every 180 degrees to operate and stop the crank assembly in order to properly align the molds for lead pour. The switch assembly will be a primitive arm off the end of the crank that will rotate with the crank and act simply to break the light beam in the Omron E3S-GS30E4 switch.

    OSHA will not be happy because I don't have a chain guard in place. So, don't do as I do. When I can get out and around (gout attack now) I will obtain some sheet metal in which to make a guard for the chain and the rotating arm that acts as a sensor trip.

    Pictures to follow when I can along with a video.

  12. #32
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    Proof that I am working on it
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Sorry for the sideways pictures from the phone. I tried to rotate and save but they still come up wrong.

    Picture on the left the optical switch and a piece of paint stir stick just to prove operation for right now.

    Other pictures show the timed relay that will control the motor operation and the motor speed control box.

    I will fabricate a more substantial way to trip the optical sensor after I get it running properly. Lacking a machine shop I have to use whatever I can find in the garage that is handy.

    Operation is quite simple.

    A power supply provides power to the optical sensor and its optical closure provides the missing power leg to the timed relay. When the relay is activated at TDC of the crank power to the Bodine motor is interrupted and at the same time the lead pour is started which is controlled by the programmable timed sequence. Once the lead is poured into the mold with sufficient sprew the relay will reset. Once reset the motor once again begins to turn the crankshaft the sprew plate hits the stop the mold opens and dumps the bullets and the 2nd mold is at TDC and the cycle begins all over again.

    Easier terms?... when the mold hits TDC the motor quits because the N/C contacts on the number one set of contacts in the relay opens up. At the same time the other set of contacts #2 makes contact which is controlled by the adjustment variable resistor/pot on top of the relay which activates the lead pour solenoid for a preset time determined by the pots resistance. This timed relay controls the motor run and lead pour. The motor speed is controlled by the variable DC power supply that feeds the motor.

    This in my mind has the capability to work properly and to provide some needed relief to my arthritic shoulders. Its not really a quest for speed in so much as a consistent way to run the machine.
    Last edited by 6bg6ga; 02-15-2020 at 01:36 PM.

  13. #33
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    I thru caution to the wind yesterday and started it up. With the loose chain it ran sort of jerky but the concept was proven. Monday a different motor sprocket will arrive and things should work ok.

  14. #34
    Boolit Master
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    jmorris I never get tired of looking at the stuff you build, thanks for posting the videos.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by 6bg6ga View Post
    I thru caution to the wind yesterday and started it up. With the loose chain it ran sort of jerky but the concept was proven. Monday a different motor sprocket will arrive and things should work ok.
    I worked kinda. I had so much chain slop that it was possible for the lead solenoid to trip again simply because the excess slack in the chain made crankshaft movement longer than normal. With the slack out it seems to run nearly flawless. Will know for sure today when the new sprocket comes. Not a jmorris setup but functional when done.

    I cut a piece of paint stick to serve as my method to interrupt the light beam on the optical switch. I'm leaning toward a model airplane propeller of thinner construction to do the job. If I had a machine shop I would machine a spacer that would take the place of the one on the other side and it would have two cams on it. You sometimes have to use what you have on hand. While I don't like my paint stick it works and it serves as a reminder that fingers and chain don't mix well. That will be the next step a chain guard. Oh, how I miss not having a hand brake when I need one. Maybe a neighbor has several pieces of angle iron that I can clamp on some aluminum in order to bend it.

  16. #36
    Boolit Master jmorris's Avatar
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    Post a video if it running when your parts come in.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmorris View Post
    Post a video if it running when your parts come in.
    I will do so. You'll have to remember its not going to be up to jmorris standards so please judge me accordingly. I haven't ordered the airplane propeller to take the place of the shortened paint stick. Looking around the garage to see if I can find something more appropriate.

  18. #38
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    The drive sprocket coming today is a 12 tooth instead of the 10 tooth I had on their which changes the ratio from 2.00-1 to 1.67-1 which decreases the torque from 480 in lbs or 40 ft lbs to 400 in lbs or 33.4 ft lbs. Granted only a maximum of 20 ft lbs is needed worst case to run the crankshaft. It was a matter of economics as I found a out of the box sprocket for $4.00 and some change instead of close to $20 for the 10 tooth I wanted. If I don't feel comfortable using it I will up the driven sprocket in teeth to obtain a 2.00-1 or 2.25-1 ratio. Worst case is the sprocket on the Mark IV will slip and no parts will break.

  19. #39
    Boolit Master jmorris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 6bg6ga View Post
    I will do so. You'll have to remember its not going to be up to jmorris standards so please judge me accordingly. I haven't ordered the airplane propeller to take the place of the shortened paint stick. Looking around the garage to see if I can find something more appropriate.
    To people that really know what they are doing, I’m a hack. Lots of folks just say I have too much time on my hands. If it works, that’s the only thing that matters.

    Lots of my functional stuff isn’t even painted but I figure that beats something that looks pretty but doesn’t work, every time.

  20. #40
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    No video yet but it worked with the exception that lagging everything down to the bench isn't a solution. My piece of wood that trips the optical sensor had to be made narrower which I knew was going to happen. I need a decent piece of steel to fasten the Mark IV and the motor to. I also need a method to provide constant tension to the motor bracket. This I had also considered as something I would have to do. Last but not least the solenoid kill switch which I had drawn into my wiring diagram that I need to add.

    The piece of wood that trips the optical sensor while primitive worked 100% once I made it narrower. It wanted to trip the lead solenoid again because of chain slack problems. I had more than enough capability for speed control. I could make it crawl or run it very fast. As I mentioned before its not speed I'm after its consistency of operation and when I get it properly mounted and the chain tensioned so it won't loosen after 10 or 15 minutes operation I will be at my goal.

    More updates after I get a piece of steel to play with.

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BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
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