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Thread: .458 Winchester Magnum is Ohio deer legal.

  1. #41
    Boolit Master
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    ok blikseme we all want to know
    are they powder coated or just lube
    and again do you have leading
    Last edited by canuck4570; 12-27-2019 at 05:01 PM.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by canuck4570 View Post
    ok blikseme we all want to know
    are they powder coated or just lube
    and again do you have leading
    They are powder coated and lubed with Bens Red through a Star sizer at .459". My experience has been that accuracy is better with lower ES & SD numbers when lubed. My theory is that filling the lube grooves supports the base or skirt and prevents it from slumping or collapsing when fired.

    There is no leading and the bore is coated with a nice protective layer. Here in the high humidity of Deep South Texas this is a bonus as I don't want any rust in the barrels of my guns.
    Liberalism is the triumph of emotion over intellect, but masquerading as the reverse.

    I don't know how we ever shot maximum loads before P/C come along and saved us all. R5R

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  3. #43
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    well I just have to try this powder stuff

    thanks

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by canuck4570 View Post
    do you get leading with your plain base bullet at 1750 fps
    what is your alloy please
    I have a 450 Rigby and would love to shoot my 500 gr at that velocity without leading
    No leading at all. The alloy is isocore container alloy blended 50/50 with Pb. BTW the hole in the picture is the exit.
    Liberalism is the triumph of emotion over intellect, but masquerading as the reverse.

    I don't know how we ever shot maximum loads before P/C come along and saved us all. R5R

    "No mosque in the United States flies an American flag."

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by canuck4570 View Post
    well I just have to try this powder stuff

    thanks
    The powder is John Deere green from vendor Smoke here on the forum. Shake 'n Bake and then baked in a modified toaster oven so the bases are coated with PC as well. This may or may not make a difference, don't know.
    Liberalism is the triumph of emotion over intellect, but masquerading as the reverse.

    I don't know how we ever shot maximum loads before P/C come along and saved us all. R5R

    "No mosque in the United States flies an American flag."

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by blikseme300 View Post
    No leading at all. The alloy is isocore container alloy blended 50/50 with Pb. BTW the hole in the picture is the exit.
    Lucky me I have 60lbs of the core from a good member here I bought a couple of years ago. I'm going to try the 50/50 without the powder coat and see what happens
    I am become death. The destroyer of worlds

    We all do our duty when there is not cost to it, honor comes easier then. Sooner or later there comes a day in every man's life when it is not so easy, a day when he must choose and live with it for the rest of his days.

    The further society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those that speak it
    George Orwell

    "I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery."
    - Thomas Jefferson, letter to James Madison, January 30, 1787

  7. #47
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    blikseme300

    have you tried to reach that speed with just lubed bullets?

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by canuck4570 View Post
    blikseme300

    have you tried to reach that speed with just lubed bullets?
    No, the mold I have drops the CBs at .4575” so the PC adds the needed thickness to get to the required diameter.
    Liberalism is the triumph of emotion over intellect, but masquerading as the reverse.

    I don't know how we ever shot maximum loads before P/C come along and saved us all. R5R

    "No mosque in the United States flies an American flag."

  9. #49
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    People Who make the rules never know what they are talking about ,same idiots over here .most makes no sense at all .eg the land I shot over I can use a 243 but not a 308.why?

  10. #50
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    I'm wondering how it would work to take some of the 45 cal muzzleloading sabots for .358 bullets would work with a 180gr .358 XTP? Wonder what the OD is on those sabots?

  11. #51
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    It would work much better with a big, full diameter flat nosed bullet and those are plentiful and easy to produce. Inline sabots would just retard the performance of the rifle.

  12. #52
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    Thanks so much for posting this!

    I saved a copy of the pic- if .458WM is legal, my .450 Marlin should be too! Belted- but straight walled.

    Well done, Sir!

    John

  13. #53
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    Yes, Danish, just like a .38 in a .357 mag. I enjoy all the ribbing I get when this subject comes up. The first blush is always -"OMG, is there anything left after the shot?" Then they see it actually work and amazement is the usual response. The vast majority of .45-70 shooters far exceed the power levels of my load with the .458 WM (actually .458 Lott because I reamed the chamber). When I let loose with a real .458 Lott, the earth tilts off it's axis just a little bit, but the anemic .458 WM is a powder puff. Go forth and conquer. The WM is one of those that has an amazing useful range of performance.

  14. #54
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    Pawn shop in my neighborhood had a CZ in 458. I wondered what to heck anyone would want with such a thing. Now it makes sense.
    Last edited by arlon; 01-02-2020 at 01:51 AM.

  15. #55
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    I have a Ruger #1 Tropical in .458 Win Mag that I bought new in 1991 and as luck would have it, I have not seen an elephant on my front lawn ever since! Being a shame to have this beautiful rifle just gathering dust in my gun safe, I decided to go the cast bullet route to get some use out of it on smaller game. I tried 292, 405 and 500 gn cast bullets sized to .460 and as cast, with several different powders like 5744, 3031, Unique and a few others loaded from mouse fart loads to loads well past my threshold of pain with no luck! At 50 yds, my shots were hardly hitting the 3 foot square target backstop and those that did were sideways! Measuring the rifles throat, I found that I would have to seat a 500 gn (Lee) so far out on the case that only 1/16" of the bullet was seated on the case! Jacketed bullets, (Win factory 500 SPs) shoot great but are very punishing and I am 6'3" and 280 lbs! Any suggestions? My 2- 45/70's shoot superbly with any cast bullet and powder charge that I have put through them!

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanishM1Garand View Post
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/QJReNpeWSjrLchJB7

    I canít seem to link a photo. I have a line on a rifle in .458 Winchester Magnum. These can be loaded to trapdoor Springfield levels. This would be a fine deer legal cartridge. The game warden was not going to give me a straight answer so I got two dummy cartridges from @725 and @richdog66 and mailed one to the DNR.

    I got the linked letter in todayís mail.
    Happens with unknowing [stupid] legislators making laws with no idea what the subject is about.

    Next what is wrong with using a .458 handload for deer anyway.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geezer in NH View Post
    Happens with unknowing [stupid] legislators making laws with no idea what the subject is about.

    Next what is wrong with using a .458 handload for deer anyway.
    Nothing that I can see. Since a good member here sent me some cast to try in my 416 Ruger I've downloaded some and they are quite pleasant to shoot. The Ruger has become a one rifle do all. A little heavy for coyote but for any type of game animal a good deal.

    The miracle of cast strikes again!
    I am become death. The destroyer of worlds

    We all do our duty when there is not cost to it, honor comes easier then. Sooner or later there comes a day in every man's life when it is not so easy, a day when he must choose and live with it for the rest of his days.

    The further society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those that speak it
    George Orwell

    "I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery."
    - Thomas Jefferson, letter to James Madison, January 30, 1787

  18. #58
    Boolit Master RU shooter's Avatar
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    What exactly is the reasoning for not allowing bottle neck ctgs. ?
    If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck!

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by RU shooter View Post
    What exactly is the reasoning for not allowing bottle neck ctgs. ?
    I think the reasoning was that people would hunt with rifles designed to use pistol cartridges, mainly lever guns in things like .44 magnum, which wouldn't really carry any farther than a shotgun slug or muzzle loader. Of course, people are going to do what they can to make the most of the rules, hence the existence of the .350 Legend.

    A .458 Win Mag, loaded to what it's capable of, will carry a long ways and hit hard at that long range. The laws are stupid and fairly easy to get around as this thread is all about.

    Fortunately, we're all handloaders and bullet casters and there's no reason to hunt deer with a full house .458. It becomes a very pleasant Trapdoor Springfield quite easily.

  20. #60
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    The prejudicial mind puts the world into familiar boxes. Stepping outside the box truly expands the useful bounds of the .458 WM, or in my case, the converted .458 WM made into the .458 Lott. I get one hole accuracy from mild loads and have never cranked it up to anything over trap door stuff. I have loaded monoliths and jacketed to the capacity of the Ruger #1 and those dog-gone things will rock your world. I like mild recoil and accuracy. Suits my hunting style, pocket book, and miserable rotator cuff.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check