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Thread: Quick question regarding velocity and leading

  1. #1
    Boolit Bub
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    Quick question regarding velocity and leading

    Hi there,

    I'm still pretty new to cast so I figured I'd ask just to make sure. I put together some loads using a Kieth style 160gr HP with 13grs 2400 @ 1200 FPS and 173gr SWC with 12grs 2400 @ 1130FPS out of a 4" barrel. These were cast as a 2-2-96 alloy. Does this velocity sound like a good place to be at? My previous load was a 158gr PC SWC with 13.5 grs 2400 @ 1250 FPS. I'm curious if it's worth it to try a get the 160 gr a little faster. I'm shooting a model 19, and I'd hate to wear it out shooting to high of magnum loads. The other thing is I believe I have some leading on the last 1/2" of barrel, which if I understand correctly means there isn't enough lube on the bullet. Does this mean that I should lower velocity? I've attached a photo which hopefully shows the extent of it.


  2. #2
    Boolit Grand Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
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    What lube are you using?
    Larry Gibson

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  3. #3
    Boolit Bub
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    Unfortunately I don't know what lube it is, as I bought these from GT Bullets online. Though there is a picture, which may give an idea of what lube it is.


  4. #4
    Boolit Grand Master
    454PB's Avatar
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    Those loads (and velocities) are fine, as long as the boolit matches cylinder throat and barrel diameters. Commercial boolit lubes like this are not always the best, since they are designed to withstand shipping and handling more than lubrication performance.
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  5. #5
    Boolit Master
    JBinMN's Avatar
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    I think that if I was in your situation, I would try adding some more lube to the already lubed "store bought" cast ones since the lube currently on the boolits appears to not be able to do it's job for the length of the bbl. of the firearm you showed in the pics using those boolits , rather than try to change up powders or amounts of powders. To me it just seems that I would prefer to add lube than restrict, or narrow the range of powder- velocity to adapt those store bought boolits if I wanted to continue to use them.

    A coat of Alox of some type or even 45-45-10 & either one tumble lubed for one coat would be pretty easy to do & inexpensive. As well as most likely eliminate the issue of lack of lube leading in not only that firearm, but others as well, if you chose to use them in other firearms.

    Another lube/coating alternative is to PC or Hi-tec them before loading as well, and I am sure some of the others here who do such practices would tell ya the same thing. Still adding extra time & expense but ikely would solve the lube issues. Using those methods will likely mean more expense & time than the tumble lubing with Alox or 45-45-10, but might be your "cup o tea" anyway for those & other types of boolits you either make yourself or buy. ( I would go the TL option because I prefer it anyway. )

    Yes, it is an extra step(s), any way you might choose, TL, PC or the like and does add a tiny bit of time & expense for TL, and up to a bit more time & expense with PC, etc., as the processes are added in, but like I said, I don't consider those to be that time consuming or expensive myself, considering the alternative of continuing to use those store bought boolits "as is" & dealing with the lead removal & just changing load makeup to try to stop it, or changing to another supplier & their lube to see if it will work for you, or just buying the lead, molds, etc. & casting your own, then lubing them with an appropriate lube that you find works & meets your needs in time & expense. All of which is something you will have to ponder on & decide for yourself.

    I think it is going to be a tossup of whether you would want to do the other options, or just limit/restrict your powder/velocity load range to what will work with that lube. If you do find out that the load range limitations does not make the lube issue(s) go away, then the other options will be back "on the table" to solve the lack of lube issue.

    G'Luck! on whatever ya decide to do.
    Last edited by JBinMN; 12-11-2019 at 03:39 PM. Reason: Fixed a sentence for syntax, & some spelling errors
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  6. #6
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    The biggest cause of leading is improper sized bullets in relation to the barrel. You might want to slug your barrel and make sure your bullets are .001 to .002 larger in diameter.


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  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    For a Model 19, you’re doing right in using heavier boolits instead of the 125 grains. The 150’s and heavier will not crack your forcing cone at the little flat on the bottom side. Also using 2400 in that application is a great choice.

    Keep in mind though the Model 19’s will develop end shake when feed a steady diet of magnums. Your magnums are on the light end, but I’d back off another 200 FPS for an all-the-time load and save what you’re shooting for serious social work. My opinion, but my Model 19 from the early 70s is still wonderfully tight.

    I agree it looks like lube failure. I’ll suggest using a much softer lube than than the boolits came with. If you can get the ingredients for Felix World Famous Lube, mix up a batch, flip the factory lube off and smear Felix lube on. Quite likely will solve you problem.

    It’s also possible the boolits are too hard. This might not be the whole problem but a contributing factor. It could be the factory lube is being blown by early in the trip down the barrel and there’s nothing left when the boolit is near the exit.

    Another idea is to shoot them in a shorter barrel...Ha!
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  8. #8
    Boolit Bub
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    I appreciate the help guys! I plan on slugging my bore just to be sure, but haven't gotten around to it yet.

    I Shoot less than a a few hundred magnums a year so i'm not too worried about wear, but I really don't want to have issues down the line so i'd rather error on the side of caution. But these are going to be for varmints so i'm just trying to find something that shoots accurately and takes advantage of the HP.

    I'll look into switching out the lube though!

  9. #9
    Boolit Master

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    Don't worry to much about the barrel, slug the cylinder throats. Also what diameter is your boolits? Hopefully they are .358", as this diameter has always worked for me in several .357 magnums. You want your boolit to be a tight fit in the cylinder throats.

    Buy a bottle of Lee Alox, put a couple of drops in a plastic baggy, drops the boolits in, and shake until they get a nice coating. This may help you shoot these commercial cast slugs without any leading, and give good accuracy.

    Just stick a boolit in the cylinder chamber throat and too see if it is a tight fit. If you get a good tight fit, (push it with a wooden dowel), and apply a coat of Lee alox, I bet you will see a clean barrel.
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  10. #10
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    Your lube failure is a problem with commercial cast bullets.....the lube is just too hard and doesn't do a good enough job. Over the years I've shot thousands of such lubed commercial bullets. I used to remove the lube and relube them with a good NRA type 50/50 lube and never had any leading after that regardless of "fitment". Most of them were 44s which were sized .429 and I shot them in revolvers with with .430 - .433 throats w/o any further leading. I also found a coat of LLA (as per lee's instruction and let dry thoroughly before loading) on the commercial bullets with the lube left on cured the leading problems. So now, with commercial cast bullets, I just TL them in LLA, let them dry and then load them.....works for me.
    Larry Gibson

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  11. #11
    Boolit Grand Master

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    The leading in the last inch or so of barrel and the absence of a lube star on the crown indicate the lube isn't doing it's job...it's running out .
    Commerical caster's use hard lubes which in my mind leave a lot to be desired .
    Take your bought lubed boolits and tumble lube them to add some extra lube to them and see how that works .
    I cast and lube my own with soft lubes usually a soft Lithium-Beeswax in a 1 part lithium grease to 3 parts beeswax ratio . This lube has always worked .

    You wouldn't believe how many recovered boolits lubed with hard lube still have the lube stuck in the lube groove...it does no good there it needs to be in the barrel !
    Gary
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