Cast boolits in a sabot?

[Tripplebeards]

I have a Thompson center 50 Cal omega that I received the first year they came out. Years ago I load tested it and the best groups game from three pellets of triple seven along with a 300 Grain Thompson Center shockwave bullet. It will put three shots on the same tattered hole at 100 yards. I bought a Nikon Monarch 2 1/2 x 10 with a BDC rectical The first year they produced them and mounted it up. I had to call Nikon to ask them what the drops were when turned all the way up the 10 power since there was no on line download or program yet other than paper directions include with it to tell me how the drops worked. Well I guessed from what they told me and sighted in my gun three and three-quarter inches high at 100 yards. The rest of the circles were perfect dead center at 200, 250, 300, and 350 yards when I tested it. I tried a three shot group at each of these off my bench. The 200 yard group was one and five eights inch, The 250 and 300 yard shot group were both 4 inches, and the 350 it opened up to a 12 inch group. I’ve shot almost a dozen deer with this load and all do the same... Run like they haven’t been hit and travel probably 50 to 80 yards and drop. I even drilled one square in the shoulder one year which broke the front leg on entry and exited the other side and the deer still went a good 45 yards on three legs before it fell over. I’m guessing it is just too hard of a bullet and doesn’t expand and not a lot of kinetic energy transfer. I’m guessing my load is around 1950 ft./s. I got the idea the other day to try some of my group buy 450 bushmaster boolits I casted up using a sabot from the shockwaves and the same three pellets of triple 7. My boolits weigh 263 grains and i PC’d them with clear because I was planning on shooting them out of my rifle. I did not gas check them but did size them to .452. My alloy is 50% clip on wheel weights, 50% pure with 2% pewter added to the mix. The boolit seems pretty snug in the sabot. I guess I’ll have to take it out to the range and see how it groups. I would guess this will at least put a pretty big exit in a deer if it runs vs a bullet diameter exit hole with the shock waves. Has anybody tried loading cast bullets with sabots in muzzleloaders?... I’m sure many people here have...I am just kind of curious with the results and how the accuracy is. The shockwave seem to do OK and are extremely accurate but sometimes I get very little blood trails because the bullets don’t open up but they do always exit. The only time I dropped a deer with it was back boned and then I had to finish it off with another round which is still laid there for a couple minutes after a heart and lung shot to expire because the bullet never expanded again. I was just looking for something that might give me a little better blood trail or a little quicker dispatch and wondering if my soft cast hollow point might be the answer.

[BK7saum]

I have loaded and shot the MP 44 310 grain bullets as hollowpoints. they weigh about 295 I think. Loaded into sabots without the gas check is a good fit and are pretty accurate, about 1moa at 100 yards, maybe a little bigger. They have shot well for me.

[Tripplebeards]

Good to hear I figured since my jacketed bullets were .452 diameter I better stick with a .452 boolit for a good tight fit. I figured if I can get it to shoot an inch and a half or less at 100 yards I’ll use them since my longest shot is maybe 150 yards and my average shot is normally 40 yards or less. I do have some lee 255 grainers PC’d with the same alloy I could try as well.

[Pipefitter]

Cast them out of pure lead if you are looking for expansion. with the sabot you wont get any leading regardless of the velocity you drive them at.

[Tripplebeards]

If that’s the case which I was guessing so I will not waste my time group testing these in my gun since muzzle loader season starts Monday and I already have a proven load with the shock waves. If they are to hard to expand i’ll be right back to where I was with the shockwave and I’m sure they won’t group as tight anyways. I am out of town for Thanksgiving and will not be back until Monday and I’m not gonna waste time casting up bullets and load testing when I can be out hunting. My plan was is when I go out the range to make sure my muzzleloader is on I was going to shoot a three shot group with my cast that I already had ready to go and if they shot accurately I’d hunt with them. I would’ve thought 2100 ft./s with the 50-50 mix would have probably over expanded them? I never tested the BH of these boolits but tested the exact same mix out of another batch and got about a 10.5 BH.

I don’t have this mold anymore so I can’t cast some pure lead boolits up after hunting, it was just a thought to try.

[JBinMN]

I have the same muzzle loader & it is a tackdriver. Bought it a long time ago. Before the TC Encore or the TC Impact were out & available. I use only 2 pyrodex "pellets" because most of my shooting is only around 50 yds or less, with the occasional longer shot out to 75. I have tested it at 100 yds, but never needed to shoot that far. Sights are set to 50, IIRC. All because I live in a part of MN where the terrain usually does not allow for real long shots all that often,( steep bluffs & ravines) so this doesn't bother me one bit. There could be some longer shots out in farm fields, but it is real rare to see the deer out at this time of the year out in the fields feeding since they have been shot at for a few weeks & are not keen on being shot at... ( Unless at night.)


I have been considering doing the same thing as you mentioned in the OP, for several years & just not got around to it. Our MN muzzle loader starts tomorrow morning & I decided not to hunt it this year. ( Or at least until I possibly change my mind. ) I reckon I have enough venison right now, to be honest.

If I do change my mind & hunt I will be trying this possibly, but only after some testing. The loads I currently use are giving such good results that I just never got around to testing with cast in sabots yet.

G'Luck! if ya do try it!

[Elkins45]

I have used both a Lee and an MP bullet with sabots in my Savage smokeless. I hollow pointed the Lee mold with a big giant cavity and cast some from pure. I shot a doe with one (lung shot) and found a petal of the sheared off point inside the backstrap. To say it expanded violently would be an understatement. The Savage moves that bullet at over 2K fps so I think in the future I’m just going to stick to wheel weight equivalent.

Accuracy is just as good as jacketed as long as I use good quality sabots. IMO the Hornady ones are the best. They will still hold accuracy in warmer weather when other brands get too soft.

[Tripplebeards]

The black original sabots that come with the 300 grain shock waves group the tightest in my gun that all go in one big hole at 100 yards. The 250 grain original shock waves come in second and will shoot a .5” group. The hornady 250 grainers group at 1” and the quick load hornady sabots with 250 grainers grouped 1.8”. The superglide sabots and bonded TC sabots grouped at a good 2.5/3.5”. I upgraded to the base line, all back omega the first year it came out. I believe it was $399 from midsouth shooters supply at the time. The gun is ridiculously accurate. I’d just like a better expanding bullet.

The only reason I have it set up for long range is I went elk hunting with it in AZ years ago. My average deer I’ve harvested with it has been 20 yards.

Years ago it shot a doe in the backbone at 279 yards with open sights, with 2 pellets, a 265 grain hornady jacketed soft point, and my BK92 Knight. It dropped on the spot with a chunk out its back the size of my fist. I shot a red fox with it earlier in the morning as well.

[JBinMN]

The TC black sabots with the TC 250 gr. bullet & 2 Pyrodex pellets is what I have & been using for extremely accurate shooting , if I was not clear. I would refer to try sabots & cast, & even patch & cast some time, but until I do , I am perfectly happy with the TC stuff I have been using for some times now. ( I bought a good lot of them long ago , and still have around 20 or so, I'd reckon.)

[WBH]

I've been using .446" cast RCBS and Lyman in my .50 cal Muzzzleloader with Hornady black sabots. They load far easier than the .452" with no loss of accuracy out to 150 yards over 2/50 pyrodex pellets. multiple loadings are a breeze with little effort and no swabbing the bore.
.446 is for the .43 spanish I believe.

[kens]

I have tried a variety of bullets/boolits in .50cal sabots. they all shoot ok.
Have you tried .45 pistol bullets in the sabot?
My CVA .50 SxS likes to have 100gr BP + 45acpHP bullet in a sabot.
My CVA .50 inline likes 50gr pellet + 60grpellet + soft lead HP in sabot
The CVA inline likes Powerbelts also.
I have never had a deer run away from any of these loads. DRT.
All these left a exit wound that let the insides out and the cold air in

Those cast pics you posted, I would expect them to work nicely as well

[Tripplebeards]

I was thinking about trying some 250 grain .452 FTX that I load for my 450 bushmaster. They probably would only be going 100 ft./s less than a 450 BM with 3, 50 grain pellets of 777.

The 300 grain TC shockwave and 3 pellets of triple 7 has always been my goto load. My buddies both both own TC encores. I load tested them both with this load. One shot a .5” group and the other a .8” group at 100 yards. Its my pet load for TC muzzle loaders.

I can’t believe they discontinued that gun! In my opinion that was the in-line muzzleloader that was the game changer for modern muzzleloading . It’s the first in line that shot sub MOA for tons of people.

[Tripplebeards]

Im guessing my load my load in my 265 grain cast will be around 2175 FPS with 150 grains of tripple seven.

[Buzzard II]

Google MMP sabots. They have good info available and a good selection of sabots. Good luck.
Bob

[LUCKYDAWG13]

Cast them out of pure lead if you are looking for expansion. with the sabot you wont get any leading regardless of the velocity you drive them at.

This I lost a Deer with too hard of a boolit in my T/C Omega So i went back to a 250gr shock wave and 150gr of proydex it just shoots to good in my rifle to rock the boat

[725]

I shoot those Shock Waves in my 700ML w/ 80 gr. loose Triple Seven. Blisteringly accurate and I never shot a deer twice with that load. Many have taken only 5 or 6 steps. Usually pile up well within 40 yards. There are so many choices to investigate, it would take you all summer to even get to most of them. Pure soft cast in a sabot would work well. No need for alloys. Just try different weights. Heavy & slow is tough to beat. Full bore bullets work just as well. Don't limit your experimentations. A summer at the range is time well spent.

[Gtek]

Had my Omega also for many moons, that 90 measured loose 777 with the red Sabot 250 Hornady shoots/worked so well I'm almost afraid to mess with it. Anyone cut their muzzle back removing easy load area? I have a 454424 HP SC mold I am tempted, maybe this summer.

[Tripplebeards]

Since season starts tomorrow I’m just going to shoot the shockwaves since the last time I load tested them they shot a .3” group at 100 yards. I will head to the range tomorrow to check to see if my scope is on and hit the woods. I’ll try casting some pure 44 cal Lyman devastators up next year and try them. I’ve never lost a deer yet with the 300 grain shock waves so if it’s not broke don’t fix it.

[JBinMN]

Since season starts tomorrow I’m just going to shoot the shockwaves since the last time I load tested them they shot a .3” group at 100 yards. I will head to the range tomorrow to check to see if my scope is on and hit the woods. I’ll try casting some pure 44 cal Lyman devastators up next year and try them. I’ve never lost a deer yet with the 300 grain shock waves so if it’s not broke don’t fix it.

G'Luck! & put one on the Meat Pole.

[Tripplebeards]

I do have a lee .452 300 grain and 255 grain mold I’ll cast up pure for next year to try as well. Our season lasts 10 days and we can use our unused bucks tags. I’m excited this year because there really wasn’t hardly any shooting on the surrounding properties so even though I haven’t been seeing deer I believe they have not been spooked to the point of being nocturnal yet.