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Thread: Light loads causing difficult to open bolt? First time out with Ross 1905E

  1. #41
    Boolit Buddy
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    May 2016
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    Quote Originally Posted by swheeler View Post
    I would be looking for the PPU brass when the snow melts, mixed brass is never the best choice for accuracy but I have used plenty of it! Now this is just me but I would pull down a PPU loaded round and weigh the powder charge, measure a bullet for diameter, COAL, and then chrono at least 2 rounds and record everything. Open up your favorite loading manual to 303 Brit, by using the powder charge and velocity you recorded you now have the approximate powder speed for 180 gr bullet of correct diameter and shape, now you can use published data and a chrony to duplicate the PPU ammo. When you get some more trigger time I look forward to a range report. When you start loading for accuracy with cast it will be fun I'm sure!

    I'm not too concerned about trying chase groups with the Ross as much as manufacturing functioning plinking ammo.
    My shooting bench is in an advanced state of disrepair and wobbles far to much to allow any real accuracy work.

    I do however, have a good collection of steel targets at all ranges and just enjoy shooting offhand at 50-250m for cast. Mixed brass will be more than fine. I bought this rifle specifically for such shooting. It points exceptionally well, the trigger is excellent, and the action is slick and easy to work, it's a true pleasure to handle. Especially now that it's actually shooting.

    This rifle is far too much fun to shoot really fast, you can work the action very quick.

    The express sights consist of a relatively tiny bead and notch, while I shot pretty well with them they're definitely not my preference. When I was shooting it was in the glare of a cloudless sky on white snow so my eyes did OK.


    Reading through this thread again I see a few comments about 14gr. of Red Dot being too heavy of a charge for the weight of boolit. This is likely true, that was the maximum of what I deemed appropriate to establish if simply increasing pressure would change the internal ballistics enough the brass would extract easily. uscra112's quickload data is appreciated, I had no plan to load any hotter than that nor load more.
    Last edited by Peregrine; 02-24-2020 at 11:46 PM.

  2. #42
    Boolit Master
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    Bad thing I have found is where the case wall meets the solid part of the 303 case. Supposed to be .455 but all U.S. made cases seem to suffer from this defect. Privi, including the old Hanson Cartridge company brass does not show the case bulges. Neither does the Greek HXP nor the South African berdan cases. I've shot just about all of the different 303 British ammo I could find including some WWII and post war British ammo as well as the above and the case bulges that showed up were all U.S. manufacture. A lot of the British WWII and post war British 303 is well past its expiration date and we'd not speak of the Pakastani 303. All the ammo I mentioned was fired in a #4MKII made in 1949 with good headspace. Standard velocity for 303 is in the area of 2440 feet per second. U.S. ammo is loaded slightly hotter. 2500 plus feet per second. Have a Perker Hale sporter done up on a Long Branch arsenal #4MKI* w/2 groove barrel. Have to glass bed the action body and in the back of the forestock as you can see light between it and the front of the butt socket. Nice piece of wood so don't want it to crack from being unsupported. My version
    is the bottom one. All they did was chop the barrel, cut the forestock down and install a sporting ramp front sight that takes standard #4 sight blades. Englands gun industry was in tatters after the war and with hundreds of military surplus P14's.P13's,and scads of Enfields of all kinds this was a way to make money. I read that food rationing for the Brits didn't stop until the mid 50's. Frank

  3. #43
    Boolit Grand Master 303Guy's Avatar
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    Great to see your Ross is working fine with the PPU, Peregrine!

    Samari, there is supposed to be a clearance between the rear or the fore-end and the front of the butt socket. I have a SMLE chambered in 25-303 with a plastic fore-end (that I have since dumped for being too heavy) that was a loose fit. I stuck a piece of cloth tightly under the knox form and this thing shot sub-MOA (I don't remember whether that was before or after the cloth but after the cloth it was very accurate). I have a Longbranch No.4 two-groove with a poorly fitted fore-end and that too was very accurate. It was however, sensitive to hold so I once again stuck tight fitting cloth under the fore-end (from the same cloth) and that fixed the hold sensitivity problem.

    An earlier comment on the pressure of the Red Dot load was that it was a rather high pressure load. The primer indicated a fairly high pressure load - not excessive but high for a light load. The problem with fast powders and fairly high pressure loads is dynamics of the pressure wave inside the case. When a full power load does not expand the necks int rust pits while a light load does, it tells me something. That's on my one rifle with rust pits in the neck area.

    I've done a bit of work on primer pressure reading (relative pressure) and those primers would alarm me with fast powder. Not so much with slow powder. For slow powder that would be moderate pressure.
    Rest In Peace My Son (01/06/1986 - 14/01/2014)

    ''Assume everything that moves is a human before identifying as otherwise''

  4. #44
    Boolit Master
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    303Guy, many years ago I bought a #5 jungle carbine. Most poorly fitted firearm I've ever worked with. You could grab the buttstock and actually twist it even after the stock bolt was checked for tightness. Forestock was just as bad. Groups were like shotgun patterns. Bedded the section of wood that went into the butt socket, the back end which was already showing some minor cracks and action and barrel. Let sit for a week took it apart and cleaned it up. From patterns to 2" groups with R-P 303 British with the 180 grain RN bullet. Sadly my shooting buddy kept waving money and relented so sold it to him. He passed away and I didn;t find out till after the funeral. The back end of the forestock is also showing minor cracks on the PH sporter and is also a little loose. I can see light between the front of the butt socket and the back end of the forestock. Which means some of the wood is unsupported and taking some of the strain from recoil when fired. Anyway we're talking about a 78 year old rifle (long Branch made in '42) and possibly the same age for the wood. Even when assembled and all screws tight that sliver of light is still there. Will glass it and the action body and first inch or so of the barrel or a little more. Never had a bedding job that did not show an improvement. Frank

  5. #45
    Boolit Master
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    One thing Ive noticed (actually had pointed out) is that with light loads the Ross bolt comes partly open ,then closes again.I suspect this is because the lugs are cut with a considerable screw pitch.......if you own a Ross ,and look at a Swiss,you can see alot of things done to cure the faults of a straight pull.......unfortunately the Swiss ended up with a very ugly action,while the Ross is trim and taut.

  6. #46
    Boolit Master
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    When I get sticky extraction with a Ross,first thing is to dismantle the bolt and grease the splines with moly grease......A Ross can jam empty if the bolt is dry inside.....Cure is run oil down the firing pin.

  7. #47
    Boolit Grand Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
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    Peregrine

    I got the same sticky extraction with similar loads in my Ross M10. It is causes by the backed out primers and the lack of very good primary bolt camming of the Ross design. Solution was simple; Drill out the flash holes with a #28 drill so the force of the primer explosion doesn't back the primer out. There are reasons the primer backs out but none are the fault of the rifle. It's simply the use of such loads in the Ross design. With standard cast or jacketed loads I NS the cases and still have easy extraction. Once the flash holes were drilled out for the very light cast loads extraction proved as easy.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check