44 cal Wadcutter molds

[6string]

Hi,
One of my favorite cast boolit designs of all time is the Lyman 429348 .44 cal full wadcutter, typically coming in at a weight of about 180 grains.
I see that many modern mold makers prefer a much heavier weight. For example, the NOE 44 WC "432-246-WC" mold, as the name implies, weighs in at 246 grains.
Has anybody used and/or compared these heavy weight designs?

I'm sure that the heavy one is liked obstensibly for it's stopping power. But, for target use, where accuracy and recoil reduction hopefully co-exist, do such heavy boolits offer any advantage over Lyman's classic?

Jim

[shooting on a shoestring]

I’ve used Accurate 43-200Z, a double ended wadcutter that can be gas checked, although I’ve never needed checks on it. I haven’t run it to long distances. All 25 yds and less. Used in Magnum and Special.

An indoor range I frequent has a game they call Gun Pong. Ping pong balls dangling on about 18” of fishing line at 17 yards. It’s fun with 32s bc the balls jump, spin swing and wiggle. With the 32s I can literally shoot the balls to pieces until all the pieces drop off. The 44 wadcutters are funner. The balls just go away at the first hit.

To save on boolit weight (both lead and the weight of carrying a few boxes to the range), I’m trying NOE 432-153 wadcutter. Just had it to the range once in a 44 Special short barrel Peace Maker. The light boolit shot under point of aim about 3 inches at 17 yards. Made hitting the ping pong balls tough because using hold over, I couldn’t see the balls. Sticking the front sight a little above the rear worked, but it took awhile to figure out how much. Then it was just an estimate each shot and not easy for me to duplicate. I’ll probably move back to heavier boolits for that gun and try the 153s with adjustable sights. Should work good in my short barrel Lipsey Flattop Blackhawk.

[6string]

Thanks for your reply. I will look into that NOE 432 153 WC.
I do most of my shooting outdoors at 50 yds minimum, bullseye style.
The little Lyman 429348 is surprisingly good at that distance!
Saving lead is nice, so I can cast more!

[Bill*B]

Accurate 43-185B might interest you.

[Ed_Shot]

I use the NOE 430-226-WC. Mine drops at 223 gr. at .433 dia with a boolit OAL of .603. Seated in the top crimp grove in a 44 Mag case my COAL is 1.368. As I have read here (sorry I can't find the post) this WC loaded to 1.368 in a 44 Mag case gives you essentially the same boiler room in the 44 Mag case as does a Lyman 429421 (boolit OAL .774) loaded to a COAL of 1.570" (Lyman 4th spec) in a 44 Spc. case. The NOE 430-226-WC over Red Dot/Promo 5.0 gr or Unique 6.0 gr is super accurate and soft shooting in my SW 629 6".

[GBertolet]

I have the 429348 mold also, in 2 cavity. It is my plinking bullet in the 44. 4.5 gr Bullseye in the 44 special case. I have never had a bullet that shreds tin cans like this one does. It launches them quite a distance when hit.

[6string]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for your kindly replies. As Ed Shot mentioned, Unique is a surprise performer. My initial exposure to the Lyman 429348 was as a light practice load in a M29. Unique consistently outperformed Bullseye.
In the 44 Special, Bullseye comes into its own.
As GBertolet points out, even at lower velocities, that little Lyman WC really packs a wallop. Same experience....a friend whose reference is a S&W M66 with full power factory 357s, was amazed to see the damage that .44 can do! And, with great accuracy!

Jim

[rintinglen]

Yet another powder that gives great results in the 44's is Red Dot. My NOE 432-226 WC provides me with wonderful accuracy when loaded with WLP primers, 5.5 grains of Red Dot, and an OAL 1.375" in Mag brass. 4.5 grains works equally well in 44 Special with an OAL of 1.24.

[Dale53]

I got in on the Group Buy 200 gr, double ended wadcutter (six cavity Lee mold). Seating the bullet crimped with one band outside the case for ease of loading (using the crimp groove), 5.0 grs. of Red Dot chronographs just under 900 fps. in .44 Special brass. I have a number of .44 Specials and this makes a fine field and range load.



Dale53

[Forrest r]

I've owned a lot of 44cal wc molds over the years, been thinning the herd lately and I'm down to these wc's/hbwc's.
[IMG][/IMG]

Of all the wc molds I've owned the cramer nose pour 200gr wc has always performed well in any revolver I tried them in. 4.5gr of clays in the 44spl cases or 6.0gr of clays in the 44mag cases make excellent target loads. Typical 6-shot groups from a beater 629 @ 25yds with that cramer wc.
[IMG][/IMG]

[6string]

Hi Guys,
Thanks for the replies. I was recently given an unused can of Hercules Red Dot (I know the guy!) which I've been hankering to try. So, guess I got something new to work with.
That Cramer bullet shoots well. Typical great Cramer quality!

Jim

[Blackhawk357]

Thank you for posting this information. I am looking at a full WC 44 mag mold as well.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[Drm50]

I'm about to find out I picked up a Lyman 180, on your advice. It does shoot well in the m24 but I though something a little heavier might do even better. I looked for a couple years for a 200-210gr. WC and the couple that were on CB got snapped up before I had a chance. Just got a MP 214gr HBWC / 248gr as solid. Plan to pour Sat and shoot some Sun. Haven't picked a powder yet. Going to pour 3:1 lead / WW and 1lb tin per 20lb alloy.

[dkf]

I've been shooting some of the old 175gr Himmelwright wadcutters with HS6 and find them accurate and soft shooting. Going to try an get an MP mold group buy started on it, maybe an 8 cavity aluminum.

[6string]

I've been shooting some of the old 175gr Himmelwright wadcutters with HS6 and find them accurate and soft shooting. Going to try an get an MP mold group buy started on it, maybe an 8 cavity aluminum.

Are you referring to the pointed Himmelwright target bullet?
I posted separately that NOE currently makes three weights of the pointed Himmelwright bullet, with a choice of plain base or GC, and with an as cast option of .432" or .434". There may be other options....
Very interesting!

[dkf]

Are you referring to the pointed Himmelwright target bullet?
I posted separately that NOE currently makes three weights of the pointed Himmelwright bullet, with a choice of plain base or GC, and with an as cast option of .432" or .434". There may be other options....
Very interesting!

No. I did not even know those NOE designs were Himmelwright designs. I am referring to the 429220 Ideal used to make. There was a 358 version too, the 360302.

Here is a pics. http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell-Himmelwright-Wadcutters.htm

[Forrest r]

Years ago I had a single cavity 360302 mold, ended up trading it along with several other molds for some swaging equipment. It performed extremely well, just didn't like casting 1 bullet at a time. Lately I've been shooting a lot of the mp's modern version of the 35cal himmelwright bullet. Bought a 6-cavity brass mold that casts beautiful bullets for the 38spl's & 9mm's. The mp bullet (right) next to some cramer 110gr gallery bullets for the 35cal's.
[IMG][/IMG]

If mp were to do a 8-cavity group-buy mold of the 429220 I'd definitely be in on it!!!! I think it would be an excellent bullet for the 2 1/2" bbl'd ca bulldog. Used to have a single cavity 429303 mold & ended up selling it. Just don't like casting with single cavity molds to feed revolvers.

[bobthenailer]

I at one time had the Lee 208 WC mould but later sold & then bought a 4 cavity Saeco #944 200gr wc mould.
I mostly used this bullet for bowling pin matches. which I rarely do anymore

[pettypace]

I recently loaded some of those NOE 432-149 wadcutters, two per cartridge, for gel testing with a friend's new Charter Arms Bulldog. I fired 5 shots at some (no longer quite so) Clear Ballistic gel from about 4 yards. Here are the entrance holes:



Note that the WC pairs had barely started to separate before hitting the gel. That's not good!

And here's the penetration in the gel:



Those are ammo can size gel blocks -- each 11 inches long. The wadcutters traveled from left to right with penetrations ranging from 16" to 21.5" with an average penetration of 18.5" for the nine projectiles recovered. (One is still AWOL.) Average velocity for the five shots was about 630 f/s. Accuracy at 25 yards was surprisingly good and recoil was stout but not fierce.

[6string]

That is remarkable performance, regarding velocity vs. penetration. Reminds me of a stiff 455 Eley load!