Lack of cleaning/lubing info in manuals- Rant

[mjwcaster]

Why do many manufacturers not include cleaning/lubing info in their manuals any more.

I am an instructor and we heavily push reading the manuals for your firearms.

But more and more I find manuals with the instructions ‘clean and lube’

That’s it.

28 page manual, 12 pages of warnings and no info on how to clean or what to lube.

Oh sure, nice info on taking it apart, but what do you do then?

Many of our students are new or inexperienced gun owners.

And even for experienced owners I have guns that the recommended lubing ranges from none at all to rails and barrel hood to 15 different spots to lube.

Just read the manual for a students new Taurus TX22 (cool gun) and no cleaning/lubing info.

And even major American manufactures, same story on my Ruger LCP II.

I guess it doesn’t matter, cleaning and lubing isn’t that important anyway, right.

Ok, rant over, for now.


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[Handloader109]

Some do.... My Spectrum didn't (guess Taurus just means you to put a drop here and there.....
My Walther PPQ had detailed info.
My CZ scorpion, pictures with what to use, but all are foreign oils.... (even recommended Ballistol in a couple of spots)
My Ruger precision 22 had detailed instructions....
But they ALL have more warnings than usable good information.
Lawyers...... Shakespeare was right.

[mjwcaster]

I can’t argue with the warnings, I just wish they had useable info.

I have seen enough dangerous gun handling, heard of enough negligent discharges ( luckily never been present) to be ok with warnings.

I run a 2 day concealed carry class (16hr required in Illinois)
And I brand it as a firearms safety class with a touch of marksmanship and legal.

Yes we cover everything we can and teach students to shoot, but the only thing that is really important is firearms safety.

Without that everything else is worse than wasted, it is deadly.


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[Thumbcocker]

I read somewhere that gun manufacturer research shows that the average handgun will be shot very little, (less than 50 rounds iirc) so maybe that is part of the logic.

[mattw]

Yup, manuals have become useless documents to protect the maker from being sued. A new shooter, that wants to shoot a bunch might have tough time learning to clean and care for a gun nowdays.

[mjwcaster]

I read somewhere that gun manufacturer research shows that the average handgun will be shot very little, (less than 50 rounds iirc) so maybe that is part of the logic.

I hate it, but I am seeing it first hand.
In Illinois Ccw permit holders have to recertify after 5 years, our first permits just started expiring this spring.

I haven’t done that many recertifications, but have had a student bring in his house gun jammed up with a round in the chamber.
After beating it open I found it dry as a bone and rusted up.
Worst part was I still couldn’t convince him to purchase his own cleaning kit.
He was going to keep having his son maintain his guns, even though it worked out so well before.
And now his son had moved out.

Seen people who weren’t familiar with their weapons, loading and racking the slide.
One even loaded the ammo in the mag backwards.

Another family of 3 were return students.
Small class and we like them so we stuck around to clean their guns after class.
They were’t that dirty, not because they maintained them, but because they were new 5 years ago, they put 100+ rounds through them then, 50 or so in class 5 years later.
That’s it, they have only been shot in our class.

They had NEVER been cleaned.

I do what I can, but these people are adults and can live life however they want.

But it is pathetic.

And yes we cover cleaning with a demo in our full class.

When I worked at a shop and people wanted their guns cleaned I would try to teach them how to do it.
And tell them the next time would be more expensive if they wouldn’t learn how to clean them themselves.
Even the owner preferred teaching people vs making a quick buck on something as important as this.


I have thought about setting up a cleaning table at the local gun show, including lessons.
Gun show season is starting, I might just do that.




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[mattw]

Kankakee, I make it to that show once in awhile. At one time one could find moulds and good used reloading stuff... Is that still the case?

[mjwcaster]

Mattw don’t know, I haven’t been there in a couple of years.

The old guy who ran it passed and his family carried on for a few years.
It became a flea market, new guns and a couple of reloading vendors.
Best thing was the meat stick guy, but he died.

A new group took over a few years ago, it became a gun show again, right after that we stopped setting up there and I don’t bother going to gun shows just for myself.

Less junk but still mostly new guns and some overpriced junk.

The real deals were to be had before the show opened, another reason I liked having a table there.

By the way your handle always confuses me when I see it, as I am a mattw(ehland)

You don’t happen to be a red head that went to Sandburg or a lawyer from Indiana?

The only other Matt W’s I’ve ever meet.


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[samari46]

Here in Louisiana I've seen some truly horrible conditions in regarding to fail to clean and lube. Rem 600 done up in camo, and the barrel looked like a sewer pipe. Most firearms folks I know religiously do clean any thing they shoot. It's the ones with dirt, gravel and just about anything you can imagine in the firearm. And I'm not kidding about the gravel. I have a Finn M39 that was shot with corrosively primed ammo, never cleaned and sat in a closet for about 10 years. Finally found a replacement barrel in mint condition and a gunsmith who would do the job. Between the cost of the barrel, shipping and gunsmith fees I was money ahead as all the rest of the M39 was in mint condition. And I got the rifle for free. Frank

[Walks]

I spent about 12yrs working for 2 big Gun dealers in SoCal in the 1980's-90's.
In all those years I could count on the fingers of one hand the numbers of used guns I bought that came in Clean.

[reddog81]

I doubt much would change if the manuals included this info. Common sense should tell a person to clean out all the crud that can be reached with a field strip and lube/oil any metal parts to both keep rust from forming and reduce wear from use. If a person can't figure that out I'm guessing they probably aren't reading the manual to begin with.

Of course most manufacturers probably get more calls from people trying to disassemble and reassemble there guns from clearing and breaking stuff than any other problem. The average consumer might be better off not disassembling their gun...

[higgins]

The sellers around here don't clean guns either, being too lazy to even run a patch down the bore of used guns. May be they're afraid it will expose a rough bore. If it does, just shoot it to dirty it up again and you're back where you started. If it's clean it has more sales appeal. I just don't get it.

[shaune509]

Most products nowadays have very poor paperwork, they don't show a parts sheet for household appliances or even most yard tools because they do not want you to repair your self only there
$60+/hr service techs, if it is fixable. But they all have 4 or more languages even for items sold only in the USA. And if they have a online site it s impossible to find the correct info for what you need. Enter PN, no such item found type of responses.
Shaune509