350 Legend and Cast Boolits

[Michael J. Spangler]

Hitec does not stand up as well as powder coat does to speed. And you just saw that. Put a check on it and stop trying to get around basic cast shooting practices.

I’ll get rid of the rifle before I play with checks.

This is the first I’ve heard of hi-tek not handling anything as good as powder coating. Other than maybe not having the color variations.

This is just an attempt to find a cast friend cartridge and load for an AR so it doesn’t sit neglected all the time. My levers get used every week. The AR is lucky to see a range trip a year and it will stay that way if it has to get gas checks.

I’m sure I can find a 200 grain plain base that will handle 1700 FPS in that 1:16 twist without issues. Next step load some with checks and some hard alloy. In the name of science. Then I can determine if it’s a keeper or not.

[P Flados]

I am another that would get rid of a gun before going to checks.

I ran the Lee 200 with ASBB HF red coating and no checks through my 357AR, and all of my 357 Maximum guns. They shot good in the maximums and shot OK in the AR with manual single feeding. Alloy was range lead water dropped to around 10 bhn.

The Lee 200s did not feed in the AR from the mag worth a darn. The edge of the Meplat was typically catching pretty bad.

The bad feeding was what pushed me into making my own mold. When I first started with my plain base 180 and 200 NLGs, I felt that the customs shot just a little better than the Lee (but they fed a whole lot better). Eventually I worked up a just over 2000 fps load with the custom 200 that is pretty reliable at 2 MOA.

Attachment 263683

Attachment 263680

The 180 / 200 loaner mold is back home gathering dust and is available.

[Michael J. Spangler]

I am another that would get rid of a gun before going to checks.

I ran the Lee 200 with ASBB HF red coating and no checks through my 357AR, and all of my 357 Maximum guns. They shot good in the maximums and shot OK in the AR with manual single feeding. Alloy was range lead water dropped to around 10 bhn.

The Lee 200s did not feed in the AR from the mag worth a darn. The edge of the Meplat was typically catching pretty bad.

The bad feeding was what pushed me into making my own mold. When I first started with my plain base 180 and 200 NLGs, I felt that the customs shot just a little better than the Lee (but they fed a whole lot better). Eventually I worked up a just over 2000 fps load with the custom 200 that is pretty reliable at 2 MOA.

Attachment 263683

Attachment 263680

The 180 / 200 loaner mold is back home gathering dust and is available.

Nice! What alloy?

[P Flados]

Nice! What alloy?

For the last few years pretty much all my boolits are either range lead (gathered after IHMSA matches at a local private range), or range lead + misc stuff blended to get around 10 bhn water dropped.

My most recent acquisition of lead was a 400# purchase of 6 bhn to 7 bhn boat keel lead. I blended some of it trying to get the hardness up, but I am quickly running out of harder stuff. My source of range lead is either on hold or gone (not sure at the moment).

[mehavey]

I’ll get rid of the rifle before I play with checks....The AR is lucky to see
a range trip a year and it will stay that way if it has to get gas checks.

Gosh....

I’m sure I can find a 200 grain plain base that will handle 1700 FPS

Good luck.

(what other high-velocity/relatively short-barrel rifles are you loading plain base?)

[Michael J. Spangler]

Gosh....

Good luck.

(what other high-velocity/relatively short-barrel rifles are you loading plain base?)

357 Magnum. Max loads of 2400 (I’ve used H110 too) I have no issues hitting the 10” steel at 300 if I do my part.
This 350 Legend is similar and I don’t think I could hit the that 10” steel reliably at 25 yards.

I know they’re not exactly the same but I think they’re close enough to work something out.

[mehavey]

Let us know.....
I'll be very interested in a successful high-speed (1,900-ish) plain base.

[Michael J. Spangler]

Let us know.....
I'll be very interested in a successful high-speed (1,900-ish) plain base.

I’m not looking for 1900 really. Those loads were faster than what the book had listed. I’m looking to get an honest 1700 with a 200. Basically not too far off from velocity of a 357 with a little higher weight bullet.
I’m hoping I can get there. With the slower twist I can hopefully be under that ugly velocity (rpm) threshold.

[mehavey]

You're going to be hard pressed to exceed the 120,000 RPM threshhold
See http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...=1#post4816659
(1:16 twist)
Both are two (out of three) of my standards in the 350L.
The faster Lee is 90,000 RPM.
Both print ~inch & a quarter

[Michael J. Spangler]

You're going to be hard pressed to exceed the 120,000 RPM threshhold
See http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...=1#post4816659
(1:16 twist)
Both are two (out of three) of my standards in the 350L.
The faster Lee is 90,000 RPM.
Both print ~inch & a quarter

There we go. Good info.
Now let’s see what I can do with a plain base.
Did I mention I hate gas checks?

I would be happy with 4” for plinking if it meant no gas checks.

[Dapaki]

I shoot sub 2" groups at 100 yards with PB PC C358-200-RF LEE boolits with my 350L from BCA. Whats going on with your loads?

[Michael J. Spangler]

I shoot sub 2" groups at 100 yards with PB PC C358-200-RF LEE boolits with my 350L from BCA. Whats going on with your loads?

I think my alloy was too soft. Kind of like what I experience with 9mm. The neck tension sized the bullet down a little. I lost .001”
I can get a larger expander or up the hardness of the alloy. I’ll go for the latter and of it works well like it did for 9mm I’ll stick with it and consider a larger expander for the future or once I’m set up on my Dillon just use my 38 powder funnel with an XL powder die to get the extra height I need.

[Dapaki]

I am just using COWW, the PC seems to make up for many a sin, I see no difference in range lead, COWW or L#2 once powder coated.

[tomme boy]

Good luck is all I say. I tried a few plain base bullets and messed with several alloys. I had to go to a check. And the Lee bullet fed perfect in my AR. You just had to use a 350L mag. You might have to drill out your gas port to get it to cycle at a slower speed you want. Or you are going to need a lightweight BCG and a adjustable gas block to tune it in.

I will advise you to stay away from lilgun and h110 unless you want to wear your gun. 2400 will be safer or 4227. You are going to need to stick with extruded stick powders

[Michael J. Spangler]

I am just using COWW, the PC seems to make up for many a sin, I see no difference in range lead, COWW or L#2 once powder coated.

What powder and what speeds were you running?

Good luck is all I say. I tried a few plain base bullets and messed with several alloys. I had to go to a check. And the Lee bullet fed perfect in my AR. You just had to use a 350L mag. You might have to drill out your gas port to get it to cycle at a slower speed you want. Or you are going to need a lightweight BCG and a adjustable gas block to tune it in.

I will advise you to stay away from lilgun and h110 unless you want to wear your gun. 2400 will be safer or 4227. You are going to need to stick with extruded stick powders

I was thinking of running 2400 but was worried it wouldn’t get me up to speed. I’m going to try it.
I was wondering if the H110 was the issue but I had the same results with CFEBLK which runs at a much lower pressure.

I’ll load more this week and see if the check fixes it or if the harder alloy does.

[Dapaki]

...I will advise you to stay away from lilgun and h110 unless you want to wear your gun. 2400 will be safer or 4227. You are going to need to stick with extruded stick powders

You are going to have to explain this to me, H110 on the forcing cone in a revolver can be an issue but I have seen no issues with it in the 350L.

[Dapaki]

What powder and what speeds were you running?

21gr of H110 under the LEE 200gr boolit. I dont see the chrony data in my book for that load, I am shooting a bit tomorrow so I'll get the data for you then.

[Michael J. Spangler]

21gr of H110 under the LEE 200gr boolit. I dont see the chrony data in my book for that load, I am shooting a bit tomorrow so I'll get the data for you then.

Thank you.

[tomme boy]

I am running 22.3 h110 in mine with the 200 gr lee at 1965fps. 21gr will be right at 1750fps. H110 and lilgun both need a max charge to make them burn right. They both also should never be downloaded.

2400 works well if your gun has enough gas to operate the gun. You will hit pressure at 21gr if I remember right. If you have 5744 it has enough gas to make it work. At least mine did at 17 or 18 grs. This might actually be the powder you use to keep the speed at the 1700 mark or a little lower if you dont want the checks. rl7 is another good one for this

[cwlongshot]

The issues are not from it being a plain base. A PC plain base is gonna be 100% fine for ANYTHING a 350Legend can push to, velocity wise, Period. So dont fret none there. BUT bulet hardness still carrys a factor. Try harder as generally its "better" then softer. Also try slower velocities. Kinda like ya work up a jacked load to best accuracy/top velocity. With a cast its the pressure and the RPM of your particular alloy. Same dance, different tune.

I dont care for a GC but only cause its a extra step and getting More and more costly. What they can do and help with is all good.

I have two bullets that are working great for me. A Saeco 396 180g TC PB and a LEE Ranch Dog 190g GC. Both powder coated. Neither is near jacketed velocity. The 180 is pushed by 4198 and shoots 1.5 ish @ 100 @ 1500 fps. The 190g is going closer
To 1800 fps ish but the powder excapes me just now but its RE7/4227 or 5744. Accuracy is just a lil better then the 180 hovering at 1" @ 100. But same ragged hole at 50. Ruger Bolt.

CW