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Thread: Mould advice for Pedersoli 1874 Sharps.

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy
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    Mould advice for Pedersoli 1874 Sharps.

    I've got a Pedersoli 1874 Sharps "business rifle".

    I picked the rifle up almost 10 years ago and got a Lyman 457125 mould to feed it. Cast up a bunch using COWW + a little tin and linotype, pretty close to Lyman #2 and had a pretty good bullet that just kissed the .459 lube sizer die and they shoot pretty good but I'm thinking I can do better.
    My big boomers all got put away for a few years after I tore up my right shoulder (unrelated to shooting) and had to have it re-assembled. Now several years on I'm back to the casting and reloading bench for the .45-70 and I want to shoot BP exclusively with this rifle and other that a handful of Hornady Leverevolution rounds that's all that it has seen.

    Of course I'm scouring the forums here and see that I need to go with a softer alloy so I work up a batch of 20:1 (more or less), I'm dipper casting with my pot running about 750. I've been casting for close to 20 years so making a good bullet isn't an issue. My frustration comes from my Lyman mould I think. The bullets are dropping at 526 gr and the majority of bullets are +/- .5 gr of that but the darn things are running .456-.457 and are a drop in fit to fired cases meaning I can push it right on down into the case with very little pressure.
    I'd really like a mould that will drop a .459-.460 and run 525-535 gr. Partly because I've read in numerous places that the Pedersoli's do better with a slightly fatter diameter bullet and the possibility of BPCR silhouette is a serious consideration in the not too distant future.
    I'm more than ready to drop the coin for a high end mould and I'm looking hard at BACO's offerings. Either the Postell or one of the Money variants.
    Any insight on which of these or other alternatives my Pedersoli Sharps is likely to prefer?

    Thanks

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
    Bohica793's Avatar
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    Your bullets are dropping smaller due to your alloy. Less tin and antimony gives you a bullet that shrinks more. As to molds, check out Tom's catalog at Accurate Molds. http://www.accuratemolds.com. Be sure to specify your alloy when ordering and he will insure your bullets drop proper size.
    Protecting this country and it's communities isn't just the job of soldiers and police, but of every patriot who is capable.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master Dan Cash's Avatar
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    What Bohica said. I am feeding a similar Pedersolli Sharps clone which does well with .462 as cast. It thrives on harder bullets.
    To paraphrase Ronald Reagan, the trouble with many shooting experts is not that they're ignorant; its just that they know so much that isn't so.

  4. #4
    Boolit Grand Master

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    I have a Pedersoli Long range in 45-70 That's ah=has only seen black powder. I shoot several bullets in it, The lyman 457125 510 grn round nose govt, the 535 lyman postell and an old west 547 grn silhouette. All shoot very well in my rifle.
    My alloy is a simple 20-1 lead tin. and SPG or emmerts improved lube.
    I use Olde Ensford 1 1/2f powder with around .100 compression. a rem std lr primer. one .060 napa rubber fiber wad and 2 tracing paper wads. Bullets are pan lubed and shot as cast. Bullets are hand seated onto the wad stack and sized just enough to stay in case ( bullets can be turned or pulled by hand). Im slightly off the lands with over all length. I use a compression die to compress wads and powder to seating depth

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    I have a pedersoli barreled 76 Uberti - it likes fatter boolits - using reformed 348 winchester brass the case necks are a tad fat and the chamber neck is pretty neat .460 is as big as it will take - 458 sized dont shoot as good.

  6. #6
    Boolit Buddy
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    I shoot the Hoch 550 grain creedmoor nose pour mould in my C. Sharps and Pedersoli Sharps loaded exclusively with black powder. Mine come from my mould at .461 and I size them to .458. Good luck!

  7. #7
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    For the bucks, it's hard to beat a BACO iron mould by Jim for quality and performance, but that comes with about a $150+ price tag.

    I'll triple the endorsement for Tom's Accurate aluminum moulds, and I have more than a few Accurate PPB mold slicks for the .45-70's. Tom gives great quality in a custom mold for about $80 shipped.

  8. #8
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    bigted's Avatar
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    I will chime in on Tom's "accurate molds" as I have prolly 15 or more from him.

    I also purchased a Baco mold configured as the old government mold only throwing a .460 inch boolit.
    WHEN ALL IS SAID AND DONE...MORE WILL BE SAID THEN DONE

  9. #9
    Boolit Master Lead pot's Avatar
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    I wish Tom would tool up for the ellipticals. I have several of his moulds brass and iron and they are top quality.

    You mentioned starting Silhouettes someday. This would make a great bullet for that game. It's light and it's a well established profile.
    It will not make pit safety weight for the NRA long range target rifle match but it would be a great bullet for silhouette and the gong shoots.
    I have a Pedersoli 74 and the .458-.459 bullets shoot just fine in it.
    You can't go wrong with this https://www.buffaloarms.com/459-487-...ld-jim459487p4 if your a GG shooter.
    The fellow that designed this bullet for Jim placed in the top 15 and 5th place in the senior class at the Quigley this year using it.
    Kurt

  10. #10
    Boolit Buddy
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    Thanks for the input guys.
    I'm going to load up and shoot some of what I've got cast from my 457125 and see what they do then make a decision on a new mould.

  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy
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    I have the Pedersoli Sharps Silhouette Standard in 45-70 which slugs out at .448 X .458. My best bullet if from an NOE 461-535 mold that drops at .462 and 545 gr. with my alloy. I also have an old Lyman 457125 that drops them at .460 and 535 gr. Both are pan lubed and sized with a Lee push thru to .460 and shoot quite well.

  12. #12
    Boolit Buddy
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    I may not be in as bad a shape as I think, maybe.
    I was able to do some shooting this morning at my 50 yard practice range. (I know shooting a 1874 Sharps at 50 yards is practically sacrilege but it's the best I can do for the moment, "somebody" let my 100 yard range get overgrown with willow trees )

    I'm still kind of new to shooting this style but I was able to print a few decent groups with my "undersized" boolits. Best 5 shot group was just under 1/2" for 4 rounds with the 5th being a called flinch that landed 7" left, a hornet buzzed me. A couple that printed right at 1/2" and a few that ran to 3/4", while not super they do show some potential and I'm cautiously, encouraged.
    The load was 70gr Goex OE under at .030 veggie wad and compressed to seat the 457125 to the top of the 2nd band for an OAL case length of 2.890" in full length sized WW cases with CCI 200 primers. I used a blow tube between shots and would run a dry patch after every 5th round, never had any trouble chambering a round.
    I ran the loads over my chrono and the avg was 1280 but I had some pretty good spread between hi and lo so I'll need to work on my loading technique some.
    My bench is pretty good for shorter rifles and carbines but I need to really work on my technique with this thing and get out on at least a 100 yard range to know better.
    I still think I'll end up with a different mould but this one isn't quite trash, I'll adjust my alloy a little and keep working with it for the moment.

    Thanks.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
    Bohica793's Avatar
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    If you are using black powder and a soft alloy, undersized boolits will bump up at ignition and tend to shoot well.
    Protecting this country and it's communities isn't just the job of soldiers and police, but of every patriot who is capable.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    You could simply Beagle the mold and pick up a couple thou that should give you a good as cast diameter to pan lube. I'd try that before investing big bucks in another mold. GF

  15. #15
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bohica793 View Post
    If you are using black powder and a soft alloy, undersized boolits will bump up at ignition and tend to shoot well.
    I'm thinking that is pretty much what was happening. I'm finding out this BPCR stuff is more different than casting and reloading for smokeless than I thought it would be, some of us are hard headed and have to figure it out a little for ourselves .
    My early experiences with casting and shooting undersized boolits has left me a little gun shy but on the bright side I do know how to clean a badly leaded bore. Not something I had to do today though.

  16. #16
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Fox View Post
    You could simply Beagle the mold and pick up a couple thou that should give you a good as cast diameter to pan lube. I'd try that before investing big bucks in another mold. GF
    I'm planning on giving that a try next time I hit the casting bench but can you really have too many moulds?

  17. #17
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    With my Ped long range rifle ... as memory serves ... my technique for my accuracy load was to cast pretty soft, AND load the Lyman 457125 out far enough that the boolit actually engraved the rifling just upon closing the breech. I believe I loaded em to just 1/16th or so long so the breech block would shove em into the rifling. When and if I needed to extract one before shooting, they would leave the boolit hanging in the rifling. The top grease groove was out of the case so my SPG lubed boolit needed protecting from the loading bench to the breech against dust n grime I did not desire to be introduced in my barrel.
    WHEN ALL IS SAID AND DONE...MORE WILL BE SAID THEN DONE

  18. #18
    Boolit Buddy
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    The best loads I've managed so far with the 457125 have the first lube groove exposed.
    I've got to cast up another batch and load some more and decide what direction I need to try.
    I had used full length sized cases, I think I'll try a light neck sizing and a light taper crimp next batch.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master
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    I use a bullet cast in a Brooks mold I got off of ebay. It casts .460 to .461 and I shoot them at 1100 fps. I use smokeless for excellent accuracy in a Pedersoli Billy Dixon and a Browning Highwall BPCR model.
    EDG

  20. #20
    Boolit Buddy
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    +1plug for Old West 540gr Silhouette mould. Bernie at Old West manufacures some outstanding brass moulds.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check