Lyman data 38 Spl with 4.0 grs Bullseye?

[Hi-Speed]

Lyman cast data for both 155 gr swc and 158 gr rnl shows 4.0 grs Bullseye within reloading parameters.

I used 4.0 grs behind Speer 158 gr lswc years ago and found it to be an accurate load in 4 inch service revolvers (S&W Mod 10 and Mod 15). Velocity, as I recall, was just shy of 900fps.

I have a 38 Spl +P rated J frame mod 637. Would this be an acceptable load for this revolver? I have Bullseye in my inventory. Some manuals as Speer lists max of 3.9 grs BE.

I believe 4.0 grs BE and 158 gr SWC is a favorite of Mr Harris for 38 Spl +P.

I’ve used PP, AA5 and Unique, but like the economics and accuracy of BE.

[Char-Gar]

4.0/BE is .5 grains over max. for the 38 Special. I am not into loading over max for the 38 Special. If I want more omphffff, I use a 357 Mag.

[rhemcla]

I load 3.2 grs BE with a 160 RNFP for my S&W mod 60. Accurate and very pleasant to shoot in the snubby.

Sent from my MHA-L29 using Tapatalk

[Hi-Speed]

It’s within Lyman, but it should work well in my SP101 2 inch. By the way, my favorite load for the SP101 is 6.0 grs Unique and 158 gr SWC in 357 Mag cases, CCI 500 primers. Velocity approx 900 FPS (approximates current day 38 Spl +P FBI loads +/- from 4 inch revolver). Load I carry when hiking in the high desert.

[tazman]

The only bullet that Lyman lists 4.0 grains of Bullseye with is the 358156. All the other 158 grain boolits are listed as 3.6 grains for standard loads. I am referencing the Lyman 49th manual.
The Alliant web site shows 3.9 as max for a 38 special +P load with a 158 grain lead boolit.
I don't remember reading and could not find any reference by Ed Harris to using 4.0 grains of Bullseye with a 158 grain boolit. If you have such a reference, please post a link.
In any 357 mag chambered revolver, that load should be quite safe. I don't think I would use it in a J frame S&W on anything like a regular basis unless that gun is a 357 magnum. It would wear the gun quickly and would be uncomfortable to shoot in a gun that light.
If you wish to use it in your 38 special revolvers, that is your privilege but I can't recommend it. I think it pushes a bit beyond the limits for small frame 38 special revolvers.

[Walks]

I've used 3.5grs of Bullseye under a Lyman#358477 off and on for quite a while. But that bullet weighs only 154grs as I cast it. I tend to stick to lighter Bullseye Loads. A 154-160gr SWC over 3.0grs of Bullseye.

But I prefer Unique for most plinking loads.

I've used a Lyman#358429 170gr SWC over 6.5grs in .357Mag cases for a loong time.
It was My Dad's favorite load in His Python.
I use it in My NM Blackhawk and Security-Six 6". It seems a bit much for the 4" M19, for extended use. But fine for a Colt Trooper.

Dropped down to 5.5grs in a .38Spl Case for a Colt Official Police or S&W Heavy-Duty.

Unique works in anything that takes 4.0grs or more. I had a bit of problem using a lighter load when using it in the RCBS Little Dandy. To this day I don't know if it was me or the powder or the PM.

[Petrol & Powder]

Hi-speed, I checked one of my older manuals and that that load is within the range of standard velocity 38 Special (albeit getting close to the upper limit). I wouldn't see that older data as an endorsement of that load, just tossing that out there for reference.

In your SP101 that might be a fine load but I think that 4.0 grains of BE behind a 158 gr LSWC is getting a little warm for an Airweight Subnose, even one rated for +P.

Current Alliant data shows 3.5 grains of Bullseye as max for standard pressure loads with a 158 gr LSWC and 3.9 grains max for +P loads.

In your first post you reference 3.9 grains as the max in some Speer manuals, so I think you've already answered your own question.

[Hickory]

4.0/BE is .5 grains over max. for the 38 Special. I am not into loading over max for the 38 Special. If I want more omphffff, I use a 357 Mag.

This has been my thinking for nearly 50 years.
Plus 10 to you Char-Gar and anyone else who thinks this way.
Your guns will last longer.

[Hi-Speed]

The only bullet that Lyman lists 4.0 grains of Bullseye with is the 358156. All the other 158 grain boolits are listed as 3.6 grains for standard loads. I am referencing the Lyman 49th manual.
The Alliant web site shows 3.9 as max for a 38 special +P load with a 158 grain lead boolit.
I don't remember reading and could not find any reference by Ed Harris to using 4.0 grains of Bullseye with a 158 grain boolit. If you have such a reference, please post a link.
In any 357 mag chambered revolver, that load should be quite safe. I don't think I would use it in a J frame S&W on anything like a regular basis unless that gun is a 357 magnum. It would wear the gun quickly and would be uncomfortable to shoot in a gun that light.
If you wish to use it in your 38 special revolvers, that is your privilege but I can't recommend it. I think it pushes a bit beyond the limits for small frame 38 special revolvers.

Here is link Ed Harris’s 38 Spl +P 158 gr 4.0 grs BE:
https://www.grantcunningham.com/2011...ng-the-38-357/

[Hi-Speed]

I've used a Lyman#358429 170gr SWC over 6.5grs in .357Mag cases for a loong time.
It was My Dad's favorite load in His Python.
I use it in My NM Blackhawk and Security-Six 6". It seems a bit much for the 4" M19, for extended use. But fine for a Colt Trooper.

Dropped down to 5.5grs in a .38Spl Case for a Colt Official Police or S&W Heavy-Duty.

Unique works in anything that takes 4.0grs or more. I had a bit of problem using a lighter load when using it in the RCBS Little Dandy. To this day I don't know if it was me or the powder or the PM.

Little Dandy using rotors below #12 with Unique require a little tapping of the powder measure for consistent drops. I don’t have my Little Dandy in a stand, I hold it. With my 5.2 grs Unique 158 gr LSWC 38 Spl +P loading using #10 rotor, I lightly tap the bottom of the spout three times on hard surface to settle the powder before throwing it...measures a consistent 5.2 grs. With the larger cavities #12 and up, no tapping required. My #12 throws a consistent 6.0 grs Unique all day long.

[tazman]

Thanks for posting. I found where Ed mentioned the 4.0 grain load in the article. In the same sentence, he said to only use it in sturdy revolvers.
The 637 has an aluminum frame. Even though it is rated at +P, I would not recommend that load beyond occasional use.
Most small frame revolvers were never supposed to be used with heavy loads for long periods of time. A diet of +P would wear it out very quickly.

[Hi-Speed]

The only bullet that Lyman lists 4.0 grains of Bullseye with is the 358156. All the other 158 grain boolits are listed as 3.6 grains for standard loads. I am referencing the Lyman 49th manual.
The Alliant web site shows 3.9 as max for a 38 special +P load with a 158 grain lead boolit.
I don't remember reading and could not find any reference by Ed Harris to using 4.0 grains of Bullseye with a 158 grain boolit. If you have such a reference, please post a link.
In any 357 mag chambered revolver, that load should be quite safe. I don't think I would use it in a J frame S&W on anything like a regular basis unless that gun is a 357 magnum. It would wear the gun quickly and would be uncomfortable to shoot in a gun that light.
If you wish to use it in your 38 special revolvers, that is your privilege but I can't recommend it. I think it pushes a bit beyond the limits for small frame 38 special revolvers.

My Lyman Cast Bullet manual (latest), shows 4.1 grs BE (+P) with 358311, 160 gr seated 1.550.

[Hi-Speed]

I’ll split the difference and go 3.7 grs BE which is within Speer’s 158 gr LSWC 38 Spl +P load data. I like to get velocity a bit above 700 FPS in 1 7/8 inch barrel which I believe I’ll get with 3.7 grs BE in +P rated j frame. Have to get out to the range once this Northern Nevada heat spell quits and chronograph them stayed tuned.

[tazman]

Good luck. I hope it works out for you.
I will watch this thread and see what your results are.

[Forrest r]

FWIW:

I tested 4.4gr of bullseye using both the lyman 358156 hp and the mihec 640 158gr hp in a 2" bbl'd charter arms undercover.
38spl p+ 358156 hp ='d 822fps
38spl p+ mihec 640 ='d 802fps

Did the same bullets using 5.5gr of unique
38spl p+ 358156 hp ='d 847fps
38spl p+ mihec ='d 838fps

BE-86 is a powder worth looking at if your looking for lower p+ pressures than unique/bullseye while still maintaining the same velocities as unique.

[Hi-Speed]

Thank you Forrest r

[Larry Gibson]

I use 4 gr Bullseye under a 150 gr 358477. It runs right at 16,000 psi.

[35remington]

Around 3.6 grains Bullseye gets 710 fps average with the 158 grain 358311 RN (excellent bullet) from my 1 7/8 Smith 638.

[Walks]

Hi-Speed,

Thanks for the tip. I hold the lil'D in my hand and move it back and forth over an old Flambeau Twin-60 case block. I tap the rotor hard as I fill the rotor and empty it.

I've done it this for a long time. Haven't tripped taking it out to the garage backdoor to inspect the powder levels in ages.

[rintinglen]

I use 4 gr Bullseye under a 150 gr 358477. It runs right at 16,000 psi.

I loaded and shot thousands of these, from a variety of S&W and Colt Revolvers. COAL 1.47" very accurate. I had an Official police that just loved these.