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Thread: Two species of humanity

  1. #61
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowwolfe View Post
    ... So, did every person on this earth who died before Christianity was a belief go to hell since they knew nothing of a god they must accept?
    I doubt it but that's way above my pay grade. I really don't know, nor does anyone else and I think you know it so why do you even ask? And it's a specious "pot stirring" question, not worth a discussion anyway. All that really matters is that each of us has to decide where we stand, not where anyone else in human history has stood.

  2. #62
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    Two species of humanity

    Think I read somewhere recently that the number of atheists in America are neck-and-neck with the number of Christians...about 25 percent each.
    Nope, not even close! Check this Pew Research poll out:
    https://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/
    Last edited by dangitgriff; 09-10-2019 at 09:06 PM.

  3. #63
    Boolit Grand Master Char-Gar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    Char and Thunder, et al, isn't it interesting that those who aren't believers try so hard to convince us we're mental cases even tho they have no interest in us at all.

    I often wonder what drives them, what do they hope to accomplish? If we are "wrong" then we lose nothing and have lived happier lives than they. But, if they are wrong ....

    Seems our self styled intellectuals have convinced themselves we are wrong and we can't possibly know anything they don't know so they won't listen! Instead, they have chosen to believe "scientists" who are equally ignorant of spiritual things rather than seeing what is before them while insisting we can't possibly know or have experienced things of which they know nothing at all. And, in their massive ignorance of all things spiritual, they have the gall to presume themselves to be the most intelligent; that's weird!

    Being proud of one's ignorance really isn't very scientific is it?
    What drives them is an easy question to answer. All folks who resist Faith, do so for one reason; They don't want a moral supreme being that holds them accountable for their actions and lives in general. They want be their own gods, and determind good and evil for themselves, thereby being accountable only to themselves. Where have you heard that before? (hint, try Genesis 1) In order to do this, they must find ways to dismiss those who believe otherwise. There are many ways they do this, but claiming the intellectual high ground over those ignorant and superstitious religionists, is probably the most common.

    Despite their claims to superior intellect, they really are a very transparent and rather simple bunch of folks. Nothing much complex about them. I have been dealing with and observing them for 50+ years and their standard talking points are repeated over and over and over. That is why these guys are so easy to spot. They are as plain as rat poop in the sugar bowl, as the old saying goes.

    It is a waste of time to argue, discuss and try to convince them of the reality of God and His son Jesus. It is best to just identify them and go around them and proceed down the trail. If life drives them to their knees and destroys their self reliance, they might be open to rethinking the whole issue. Absent that, they have little chance of being nothing more that fuel for the fires of hell. A sad assessment indeed, but that is the way it is.
    Last edited by Char-Gar; 09-10-2019 at 10:22 PM.
    Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowwolfe View Post
    I have no desire to convince anyone they are mental cases. I thought my question was sincere and valid so I'll repeat it and add to it.


    I believe in evolution. If evolution is true then man existed before Christianity was a solid belief. I often hear Christians state you can't get to heaven unless you accept god.

    So, did every person on this earth who died before Christianity was a belief go to hell since they knew nothing of a god they must accept?
    Did you happen to read post #52? The answer you claim to seek is there. How About a paraphrased version?

    Romans
    18-23 But Godís angry displeasure erupts as acts of human mistrust and wrongdoing and lying accumulate, as people try to put a shroud over truth. But the basic reality of God is plain enough. Open your eyes and there it is! By taking a long and thoughtful look at what God has created, people have always been able to see what their eyes as such canít see: eternal power, for instance, and the mystery of his divine being. So nobody has a good excuse. What happened was this: People knew God perfectly well, but when they didnít treat him like God, refusing to worship him, they trivialized themselves into silliness and confusion so that there was neither sense nor direction left in their lives. They pretended to know it all, but were illiterate regarding life. They traded the glory of God who holds the whole world in his hands for cheap figurines you can buy at any roadside stand.

    24-25 So God said, in effect, ďIf thatís what you want, thatís what you get.Ē It wasnít long before they were living in a pigpen, smeared with filth, filthy inside and out. And all this because they traded the true God for a fake god, and worshiped the god they made instead of the God who made themóthe God we bless, the God who blesses us. Oh, yes!

    26-27 Worse followed. Refusing to know God, they soon didnít know how to be human eitherówomen didnít know how to be women, men didnít know how to be men. Sexually confused, they abused and defiled one another, women with women, men with menóall lust, no love. And then they paid for it, oh, how they paid for itóemptied of God and love, godless and loveless wretches.

    28-32 Since they didnít bother to acknowledge God, God quit bothering them and let them run loose. And then all hell broke loose: rampant evil, grabbing and grasping, vicious backstabbing. They made life hell on earth with their envy, wanton killing, bickering, and cheating. Look at them: mean-spirited, venomous, fork-tongued God-bashers. Bullies, swaggerers, insufferable windbags! They keep inventing new ways of wrecking lives. They ditch their parents when they get in the way. Stupid, slimy, cruel, cold-blooded. And itís not as if they donít know better. They know perfectly well theyíre spitting in Godís face. And they donít careóworse, they hand out prizes to those who do the worst things best!

    As always you are free to believe what you wish.
    Last edited by Thundarstick; 09-10-2019 at 10:58 PM.

  5. #65
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    Despite their claims to superior intellect, they really are a very transparent and rather simple bunch of folks. Nothing much complex about them. I have been dealing with and observing them for 50+ years and their standard talking points are repeated over and over and over. That is why these guys are so easy to spot. They are as plain as rat poop in the sugar bowl, as the old saying goes.
    Pretty much what I was thinking. Back at ya...

  6. #66
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    As far as animals in heaven, there is a good likelihood there will be animals there. There is a verse in Psalms that goes something like this: God will preserve the beast and man
    I don"t think present animals have souls and will be resurected.
    Animals were present in the Garden of Eden and probably will be present in the world to come.

  7. #67
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    Interesting banter. Can anyone prove their point? Is there a God? If so, prove it. Is there no Supreme creator? If so prove that. I don't have the answer nor have I found anyone than that can positively prove their point. Oh, and don't bother trying to prove anything without proof of references

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by rbuck351 View Post
    Interesting banter. Can anyone prove their point? Is there a God? If so, prove it. Is there no Supreme creator? If so prove that. I don't have the answer nor have I found anyone than that can positively prove their point. Oh, and don't bother trying to prove anything without proof of references
    Agreed. I place a lot of faith in my own ignorance. By that i mean i know there is much i dont know.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by dangitgriff View Post
    Think I read somewhere recently that the number of atheists in America are neck-and-neck with the number of Christians...about 25 percent each.
    Nope, not even close! Check this Pew Research poll out:
    https://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/
    To me that shows they are rather close. For every Catholic, there is an "unbeliever". They are popular and also your target audience, why the condescension?

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowwolfe View Post
    I have no desire to convince anyone they are mental cases. I thought my question was sincere and valid so I'll repeat it and add to it.


    I believe in evolution. If evolution is true then man existed before Christianity was a solid belief. I often hear Christians state you can't get to heaven unless you accept god.

    So, did every person on this earth who died before Christianity was a belief go to hell since they knew nothing of a god they must accept?
    To be fair, your belief in evolution as an origin to life requires as much faith as the Biblical creation story. Evolution undoubtably exists as a scientific mechanism, just like gravity. Neither are good explanations for the origin of life.

  11. #71
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    Do some folks think being "Catholic" is synonymous with "Christian" now?

  12. #72
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    Yup, the good ole original question. "Did God really say....?"
    Look twice, shoot once.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    Do some folks think being "Catholic" is synonymous with "Christian" now?
    Ah yes the familiar infighting... You must always find a way to feel superior, after all!

    And good job completely ignoring the point. You should be actively targeting the unbelievers, “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick”

    But that would be work. And require you to slum it with those who you feel are beneath you. Is Christ himself a good enough example for you, or do you know better than him as well?

    Whitewashed tombs indeed.

  14. #74
    Boolit Grand Master Char-Gar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    Do some folks think being "Catholic" is synonymous with "Christian" now?

    Well if depends on whether you are talking at Catholic (Roman Catholic) or catholic (universal). All Christians are part of the catholic church, but only some of them are part of the Catholic church.

    BTW: I have no quarrel with any branch of the Christian tree. Lots of hairs to split, but I try and avoid that.
    Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

  15. #75
    Boolit Grand Master Char-Gar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nekshot View Post
    Yup, the good ole original question. "Did God really say....?"
    The Creation story is Genesis 1 tells that "God said" and "God called", so yes God really does say. Now, what He says and to whom He says it, can be a matter of difference, discussion and at times argumentation.
    Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1hole View Post
    Do some folks think being "Catholic" is synonymous with "Christian" now?
    Now?
    Yes, but not just now.
    I have always felt that way.

    Cheesh!, of course Catholics are Christian.
    Why wouldn't they be?

    The Bible (mainly the New Testament) is their core belief.
    Jesus is the Messiah, Savior.
    They mimic the Last Supper with communion of bread and wine like Jesus instructed.

    Out of curiosity, does your Sunday service do that?

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by nekshot View Post
    Yup, the good ole original question. "Did God really say....?"
    I should have been more detailed. When satan came to eve and asked concerning Gods command of the tree of knowledge this was the original question. No need for man to question God's details of how to live until satan as a serpent posed this question to eve. The question came as "Has God indeed said, You shall not eat of every tree in the garden but this one? This question demands an answer and the answer only has two options; one God did not mean what He said, Or He did mean it. The fruit to those who disregard the correct answer is obvious thru out the generations of man. For me, I choose He did say it and I willingly embrace His provision to live on His side of the question!
    Look twice, shoot once.

  18. #78
    Boolit Master semtav's Avatar
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    Regardless of your beliefs, it is really hard, while sitting on a hilltop enjoying a lush Green valley below while thinking with the most incredible computer imaginable, having gotten there using the most sophisticated machine imaginable, to think it was all an accident???

    Sent from my E6910 using Tapatalk
    Last edited by semtav; 09-11-2019 at 03:30 PM.

  19. #79
    Boolit Grand Master Char-Gar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by semtav View Post
    Regardless of your beliefs, it is really hard, while sitting on a hilltop enjoying a lush Green valley below while thinking with the most incredible computer imaginable, having gotten there using the most sophisticated machine imaginable, and think it was all an accident???

    Sent from my E6910 using Tapatalk
    Like most wise guy teenagers I rejected the notion of God. However in 1960 I entered college and in Biology studied the Scientific Theory of Classification. I saw how orderly all of creation was and certainly not random. It was then I accepted the idea that there was a God who creates, as the vast and complex world was to well ordered to have been accident. So, one might say I discovered God through science and not in spite of science.
    Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

  20. #80
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    Chaos Theory: Order out of chaos.
    Thatíll be 5 cents, please!

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