More Slug Madness! Mossberg 695 & Accurate 73-470S

[Ranch Dog]

First shots downrange from the Mossberg 695!







I thought I had taken pictures of the firearm and 100-yard target but didn't. The 100-yard shooting was outstanding, <2.5 MOA. I'm going to try to do some 50-yard shooting this morning while recording velocities. That depends if hogs are in the hog trap or not.

[Ranch Dog]

Here are the 50 and 100-yard targets. When I finished getting the scope sighted at 25-yards, I only had four rounds left. I shot two at 50-yards, in that they looked good, I went ahead and shot the last two at 100-yards. By the way, I finally quit fooling around and bought a 12Ga laser bore sighter.

[longbow]

Wow! That's a lot of wad column! However, if it works... which it seems to do.

Have you noticed any less "BOOM" and recoil using the card and felt wads with no plastic gas seal? As I mentioned after you posted your wad slug results using just the shotcup and card wads, I tried the same thing several years ago but found I got severe gas cutting of the plastic shotcups and seemingly poor powder burn. My guess is that there was too much leakage past the nitro card and waxed card wads so the Blue Dot wouldn't build enough pressure for good burn. Regardless, it didn't work for me.

I have a bit of old timey load data from pre plastic gas seal era and powder charges are higher to make up for leakage.

I wonder if the extra length of wad column for 3" especially with that short slug helps with sealing.

I also wonder if the large 0.733" bore in my single shot smoothbore results in not enough compression on the wads to seal? What is your groove diameter?

Regardless, you seem to have this working for you in at least two instances. Good going Ranch Dog!

I have to get an order into BPI Canada and get a bunch of stuff so I'm going to order 12 ga. nitro card wads, waxed card wads and felt wads and give this another go! My Slugster has a tighter bore so I'll use that.

That is a nice looking little slug!

Did you chrono velocities?

Keep up the good work!

Longbow

[Markopolo]

that is some valid wondering LB.. i too am wondering!!! really nice though RD!!!!

[bikerbeans]

RD,

Is your slug OD greater than the barrel groove diameter? I was thinking the nitro card wouldn't be a good gas seal but if the slug is sealing the bore then no problem. Sure can't complain about the results.

BB

[longbow]

BB... good point! In this case yes, the slug could well be doing a bunch of, if not all, the sealing. RD also had good results using a wad slug in shotcup, with cushion leg and gas seal cut off, over a similar all card wad column. It worked well for Ranch Dog. When I tried basically the same thing a few years ago results were not at all impressive. Gas leakage was obvious and shredded the shotcups.

I plan on stealing Ranch Dog's good ideas and giving them a try in my smoothbores.

Hah! Still got to get to installing the rifled choke tube as well! I got distracted again. Seems to be an ongoing theme lately.

Glad to see Ranch Dog forging ahead and winning!

Longbow

[jmort]

There is an art
Building a proper wad column
Super cool

[Ranch Dog]

Hey guys, I corrected the text on the first image of the components; I had labeled it a 50mm. It is 21mm.

I've just come down the hill from the range; I'm beat up and hot, but happy!

A couple of comments

This slug gun wants to be held. The best accuracy is shot by just holding on to the beast, saddled up tight into the shoulder without the life vest I use. Yeah, its a beating!

I shot a couple of sessions today. The hits are walking to the right with each shot as the barrel heats up. I hadn't thought about free-floating the barrel as I did with the Marlin 512. I might take a nap and then get to work on it. I'm toying with whether I want to do that right now or not. The first two shots are in there, but then it goes south. I want to hog hunt tonight, and it will only be one shot. Yea or nea? I might shoot one shot this afternoon and if it goes were it was sent, I probably take it out.

In this image, shot at 100 yards, the shots are 1 through 4, all moving to the right of the last shot. I did not shoot the fifth shot as I figured it would leave the backing. Shots was a minute or less apart. The barrel was very hot. No doubt the stock needs to be relieved.

[Ranch Dog]

The groove diameter of the barrel is .731". The slugs, coated, are .737. In the last 24 hours, I've shot about 30 rounds, and there has been no leading.

Yes, the shots are much quieter than using plastic pressure wads.

I'm not using any compression other than that offered by forming the star-crimp. I use the BPI HandyRam to seat the components.



Someone is bound to ask; no, not interested in roll crimping. I've been there and have the t-shirt. With my two other slug guns, a star crimp always wins the MOA comparison, and the hull is immediately reloadable without conditioning. The 73-470S shot very well in my Marlin 512, in that rifle both crimps were compared, and the star won.

The following might address some questions concerning the nitro card. It serves two purposes for me. Primarily it keeps the components "squared up" in the hull. I firmly believe that if the component stack isn't squared to each other in the hull, the "bullet" won't be when it leaves the hull. The image below is a great example. The nitro card did not go down square on the powder.



Looking down in the hull, you will notice the nitro card out of alignment, but you will not see it with the softer waxed cards. At this point, it is easy to release the nitro card with a lead point of a pencil and start the hull over from scratch. Waxed cards are a witch to get out of the hull. I have three or four thickness of nitro cards, and they will also be used for the slight changes in volume different powders will bring. Everything that I'm working with; the Lee slug with the tail-less Lightning pressure wad in the Western Field 170, the STI Sabot in the Marlin 512, and the Accurate bullet in the 695 will be shot with Blue Dot, Longshot, and Steel. I will try the bullet again in the Marlin and the Western Field, but I'm not going back to the Lee in a rifled barrel. The 695 will see the STI sabot and Hammerhead as well.

[dsh1106]

Which laser bore sighter did you get?

[Ranch Dog]

Which laser bore sighter did you get?

A cheap one on eBay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/312474008690

I have a spot on the back of my barn wall (25 yards from the front) with a bullseye marked and then inch references above it. A cheap universal laser with collets has worked well for me with all my other firearms.

I want to take a cold barrel test shot but still must wait. It is 100º outside. There are some thunderstorms to the south that might cool it down a bit. I probably should pull the stock, ought to have time to get it all back together.

[Hogtamer]

I'm with you on the fold crimps. Loads that I had pressure tested show less consistency on my roll crimps than star crimped, even though the roll crimps looked and felt "perfect." Also the clear hulls are a huge plus. Nothing like eyeballing the finished load and being able to observe the actual fit of the various components. I disagree about the hard card over powder vs. a good plastic seal like the x12x, especially in the generous internals of the Cheddite hulls. I have both the 3/8 and 1/2" versions of the wads you are using and 1/8 hard cards if needed. Also the terrific clear frangible plastic os cards that BPI sells. And yes, you are beat up launching that big lead. Don't discount the flinch factor unless you're a 250 lb. young stud with a 50" chest!

[Markopolo]

flinch??? mine is more of a permant tick..

[Ranch Dog]

I'm live from a tower blind in South Texas! Not with the 695 though. When I was looking at the fit of the stock, I noticed that the scope was slipping a bit. Decided not to shoot it, get the work completed, and then hit it again.

I got showered up to head out, my wife looked at me and said "what happened to your shoulder?" I replied, "slug gun."

I'm in the blind with one of my favorite bolt guns, a Savage 10FCM scout chambered in 7.62x39.

Beautiful evening, thunderstorms on the complete horizon. Shady and cooling because of it. South Texas is a funny place. Here it is August, but it sounds like November or December. I've already heard three centerfire shots, a mile or so away and different directions. All sounded like they connected. Being this is Saturday night, this will continue throughout the night into the morning. A CF shot every 20 to 30 minutes.

Just had a nice young 8 walk out below the tower!

[Hogtamer]

That dimple behind the shoulder is an old bowhunter's eye magnet!

[Ranch Dog]

Still out here, hogs haven't showed... bastages! I will give it another hour. Seen a number of very large bucks after dark.

[Markopolo]

go get em michael.. patience is almost always rewarded.. just hang in there! but bu now its 9:45 there.. not sure when shooting light ends there.. must be dark by now

[Cap'n Morgan]

Michael, your load needs an X12X seal badly! The "wad ash" in your rifling picture is unburnt powder residue. My experience with Blue Dot is mostly with heavy shot loads, and I believe BD works best with payloads from 700 grains and upwards. You'll get more uniform velocity (and higher speed & pressure) using a dedicated over-powder seal so remember to reduce the load a bit...

[Ranch Dog]

go get em michael.. patience is almost always rewarded.. just hang in there! but bu now its 9:45 there.. not sure when shooting light ends there.. must be dark by now

It's dark by 8:00 now, you can hunt around the clock here. I stayed until 10, no hogs, and there was a line of thunderstorms push up on my position. On camera, this group of pigs shows up immediately at sundown or 2:30 to 4:30 in the morning.

Michael, your load needs an X12X seal badly! The "wad ash" in your rifling picture is unburnt powder residue. My experience with Blue Dot is mostly with heavy shot loads, and I believe BD works best with payloads from 700 grains and upwards. You'll get more uniform velocity (and higher speed & pressure) using a dedicated over-powder seal so remember to reduce the load a bit...

Cap'n, when I first looked down the barrel, I thought that it was unburnt powder. I placed a plastic bag over the muzzle and ports and used a light charge of compressed air to collect a sample. I've seen a lot of unburnt powder in my life, and this is not powder. When you touch a flake with the tip of a dampened toothpick, it dissolves. Any unburnt powder will not do that.

I do have the X12X seals, and every other 12Ga gas seal that BPI offers. I can tell you that it takes more pressure to seat the waxed cards than it does that seal which pretty much drops down into the Cheddite hull. What surprised me is that there is enough resistance with the waxed cards that the wad punches on my presses will cause the cards to start to fold back. The bottom of the waxed card will become a bit conical, and the edges on the top side of the card will begin to push up around the punch. That's why I went to the HandyRam and didn't worry about adding compression. The stack of cards is a very tight fit. I did notice that the Lee instructions state that the wad punch is to be used only with plastic wads.

[725]

Great thread. Wish I had more time to tinker with the shotgun. I already have my hunting load but this stuff always interests me.