re-sizing loaded ammoes

[fastdadio]

Here's one for the collective. A tale of two pistols. My current method for loading .357's is to cast a Lee 140 gr pb, powder coat it and run it through my Lee sizer. They come out at .3595. Then load I them up into full length resized cases with a mild roll crimp into the first groove. This gives me a COL of =.1.559" This ammo chambers and shoots well in my S&W mod19, but is too tight to chamber in my Ruger Speed Six. So, I've been re-sizing them for the Ruger. After I size them, they mic at .375 at the neck. As a reference, I mic'ed a factory Win and it was exactly the same at .375.
You folks ever size loaded ammoe? Is it safe? I suspect the Ruger has tight chambers and a call to Doug may be in order.

[Sig556r]

Just once when I did resize some 308s years back using a Redding body die since the loaded cartridge weren't feeding in my Rem700 though feeds well in my AR-10.
Didn't try that again when I shifted from Lee to Redding dies...

[Bazoo]

I've sized loaded 357/38 rounds before, but only to iron out the occasional bulge from crimping a case that was longer than the batch. I've sized them all the way but normally I just kiss them enough to get the bulge out. Those few I sized completely didn't offer any problems and they didn't cause undue leading to build up as I fired regular rounds after them.

I'd suggest pulling a couple of the bullets to see what they are sizing down to. You'll be able to get away with it if you aren't sizing down past groove diameter. I bet you'll get some leading, maybe only lightly though.

[Petander]

Try it. Then pull some bullets from those resized cartridges,see if they come out easy.

Resizing most probably gives you less neck tension than you want because the brass springs back but the boolit stays in the new diameter.

I have tried it and this has been the case,in my case. Very hard boolit and very little sizing might work better.

EDIT: Bazoo was faster

[RED BEAR]

You can do it but realize it might under size your bullets. Did this with some 32 acp to remove bulge in case action functioned fine but accuracy went to pot.

[stubshaft]

Sounds like the boolits are too big for the Ruger.

[fastdadio]

You can do it but realize it might under size your bullets.

I failed to mention that I resized them in the Lee boolit sizer die and not the RCBS reloading case sizer die. This brought the case dia at the neck to exactly factory spec as compared to a Win factory .357 loaded case.
I do see how this could loosed boolit friction though. Hasn't been a problem so far.

[georgerkahn]

I did this once, ever nervous both in doing it, as well as shooting. A close, most reliable, reloading friend "got stuck" after loading 400 10mm Auto rounds. After "no bites" to his posted sale items, he offered them to me at "one dollar less than his receipted orders of components." Unable to turn down such a deal, I bought them -- to find they did not chamber in my handgun in that caliber. I put a thin coat of Imperial wax on each as I s-l-o-w-l-y ran each cartridge through the (Dillon 550b) sizing die, and then taper crimp die -- and the cases so done did in fact chamber. I am sure this was NOT the safest of things to do... maybe even a tad on the foolish side. As an after-note, of the lot two cases did not fire -- bad primer? -- but all the rest, at range, worked swell.

[Outpost75]

The Lee Factory Crimp Die or the Redding Profile Crimper are the correct dies for the job, to reduce overall cartridge dimensions to within SAAMI specifications while sizing the bullet gently by compression inside the case, no more than necessary.

[fastdadio]

Sounds like the boolits are too big for the Ruger.

Kind of what I think. They do work well in the S&W as loaded. No leading either. Also I should mention these are light loads. TightGroup at about 900fps.

[DougGuy]

I don't know of any Ruger cylinder with throats big enough to plunk a .3595" boolit without resizing throats. The chamber dimension at the case mouth, just behind the chamfer should be .381" and I have seen cylinders with .379" dimensions have problems chambering a round loaded with a .358" boolit. If your brass is averaging .011" wall thickness, .358" + .022" = .0380" and if you loaded a .359" into the same case now you have .381" across the case neck which would then leave you no wiggle room at all for a less than perfectly round, concentric, and uniformly sized boolit.

I have two finishing reamers and I think they both finish right at .381" which is SAAMI spec.

I had one request for .360" throats, in a Ruger Blackhawk, but the only way you would get a .360" boolit in that cylinder is to load a .358" soft enough that it bumps up on firing. You wouldn't get a loaded round with a .360" to even plunk.

[fastdadio]

I don't know of any Ruger cylinder with throats big enough to plunk a .3595" boolit without resizing throats. The chamber dimension at the case mouth, just behind the chamfer should be .381" and I have seen cylinders with .379" dimensions have problems chambering a round loaded with a .358" boolit. If your brass is averaging .011" wall thickness, .358" + .022" = .0380" and if you loaded a .359" into the same case now you have .381" across the case neck which would then leave you no wiggle room at all for a less than perfectly round, concentric, and uniformly sized boolit.

I have two finishing reamers and I think they both finish right at .381" which is SAAMI spec.

I had one request for .360" throats, in a Ruger Blackhawk, but the only way you would get a .360" boolit in that cylinder is to load a .358" soft enough that it bumps up on firing. You wouldn't get a loaded round with a .360" to even plunk.

Hi Doug, I was hoping you would drop in. Thanks for chiming in. As you might notice, I did not post the 'as loaded' case neck size. I did mic them but then wrote the size down wrong, and then proceeded to resize the whole batch. Oops. If I had to guess at how I mixed up the numbers, I'd say they mic. at .3852. Regardless, your math above is close enough. I don't have the proper tool to gauge the chamber mouth ID. I did stick my dial stem caliper inside, but the readings I get simply do not make sense. I can say though, that my 'as loaded' COL is 1.559 and is too tight, whereas, a factory Win. 180gr Black Talon, with a COL of 1.572" and a case neck dia. of .375, drops right in. And again, after resizing mine to .375 case neck, they work fine also.
So what is your opinion of how to proceed? I think I would like to send you the cylinder with a couple of my boolits and have you give it some love.

[DougGuy]

Factory ammo they can get away with whatever they want to make the finished size because for one, they want it to fit in EVERY gun chambered for that caliber, so everything is of course on the small side. This is fine for jacketed ammo, as the majority of these are a soft lead core swaged into a gilding metal jacket which will very easily obturate to fit both cylinder throats and barrels when it is fired.

You won't get any happiness out of cast boolit loads that mic .375" at the case neck, subtract two case wall thicknesses and what do you have? That's how big the boolit is in the loaded case. We all know that the best results with cast come from filling the throats to a snug fit. If throats are a sufficient diameter we can fit the boolit to the throats. If the boolit is the sufficient diameter, we can fit the throats to a light drag fit on the boolit. Both ways work as long as throats are consistent.

I can make your throats .359" so it would get you that much room, you could use a .3585"+ .0002"~.0005" which would push an .011" thick case out to .381" and that's going to be the limiting factor on how big you can go with the boolit.

On the other hand you didn't say it was leading or shooting like buckshot from a 12ga.

[fastdadio]

Factory ammo they can get away with whatever they want to make the finished size because for one, they want it to fit in EVERY gun chambered for that caliber, so everything is of course on the small side. This is fine for jacketed ammo, as the majority of these are a soft lead core swaged into a gilding metal jacket which will very easily obturate to fit both cylinder throats and barrels when it is fired.

You won't get any happiness out of cast boolit loads that mic .375" at the case neck, subtract two case wall thicknesses and what do you have? That's how big the boolit is in the loaded case. We all know that the best results with cast come from filling the throats to a snug fit. If throats are a sufficient diameter we can fit the boolit to the throats. If the boolit is the sufficient diameter, we can fit the throats to a light drag fit on the boolit. Both ways work as long as throats are consistent.

I can make your throats .359" so it would get you that much room, you could use a .3585"+ .0002"~.0005" which would push an .011" thick case out to .381" and that's going to be the limiting factor on how big you can go with the boolit.

On the other hand you didn't say it was leading or shooting like buckshot from a 12ga.

No leading at all. They are pc'd though. In addition to the TightGroup loads @ +/-900fps, I load them with 17grs, W296 and it does good with that load. But, I'm a woods walker, I really don't shoot a lot of paper. So I can't really comment on what this is really doing to my groups.