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Thread: Loading the Lee LH 430-310 boolit.

  1. #1
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    Loading the Lee LH 430-310 boolit.

    I finally got a hold of gas checks, time to make some bear/moose/wolverine rounds. For the most part I load lots of 44 special to shoot on my Ruger Blackhawk so I'm trying to go at it carefully as I thread into the deep end of the pool.

    The closest recipe I can find is from the Hodgon reloading data for the 325 grain Bear Tooth Bullet, Remington large pistol primers, 20/22 grains of H110, 1.730 COL.

    The bullets from this mold are listed as 310 grains. They have two grooves. Loading on the first one I get an overall length of 1.790, on the second 1.705. Even the longer length fits fine on the Ruger.

    First question: I should be fine making a run of test bullets using 20 to 22 grains of H110? I plan on doing .5 grain increments to test for accuracy and signs of bad things happening.

    Second question: Should I crimp to the first or the second grove? Crimping to the first one seems to use 100% of case capacity. The second gives the powder some elbow room. Eventually I would try both ways but for starters I just want to make sure either using 100% capacity or having extra space under minimum load would be kosher.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don1357 View Post
    I would try both ways but for starters.
    Nope, don't do this. You are near top end with H110, the difference in case capacity from the two crimp grooves is enough to spike pressures dangerously high using the same published charge weight. Pay CLOSE attention to the COA listed in the load data, and stay with that.

    They make this boolit with two crimp grooves so it will fit in a S&W cylinder and also so it will cycle through a levergun crimped in the upper groove, for a shorter COA. They also change load data for the shorter COA so you will want to adhere religiously to whichever set of data you are using. You will find most data listed for the C430-310-RF will use the longer COA.

    21.5gr H110 under that boolit with the longer COA is about max in a large frame Ruger. I use that same boolit (which goes 320gr here lubed and checked) cast in 50/50+2% with soft lube over 17.0gr 2400 for 1180-1200fps couldn't ask for a better big game load for the Ruger SRH or SBH in 44 Magnum.

    Note: Any time you want to use data from one boolit that is close in weight, find the measurement from crimp to base and use this to compare, not the COA. You will want to stay as close as possible to the same case capacity so you don't increase load density by using a boolit that sits farther down in the case than the one you compared it to in finding load data.
    Last edited by DougGuy; 06-18-2019 at 11:29 AM.
    Got a .22 .30 .32 .357 .38 .40 .41 .44 .45 .480 or .500 S&W cylinder that needs throat reaming? 9mm, 10mm/40S&W, 45 ACP pistol barrel that won't "plunk" your handloads? Shoot me a PM! Also on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Cylinderhone-756429174391912/

  3. #3
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    Doug is correct. It is seating depth ("the measurement from crimp to base") that is the critical dimension, not COA/OAL.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by DougGuy View Post
    Nope, don't do this. You are near top end with H110, the difference in case capacity from the two crimp grooves is enough to spike pressures dangerously high using the same published charge weight. Pay CLOSE attention to the COA listed in the load data, and stay with that.
    Well this was the problem I had: I haven't found official load data specific for this boolit and H110. Lot's of people seem to be happy with this boolit and 21.5 grains of H110 but the closest thing I found to a published recipe was that Bear Tooth Bullet data on the Hodgon website.

    I'll try it on the bottom crimp grove for a 1.790 C.O.A.L., large pistol primers and 20~22 grains of H110.

  5. #5
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    I use 21.5 gr of W296 with this boolit with a Federal F150 primer. This is a stout 44 Magnum load, and you will still need to work it up carefully. I seat and crimp to the bottom groove. I'd start at 20 grains and work up from there. Here is an older thread on this boolit. If you use the google search function on the site (right below your profile, top right) there are numerous threads for this particular boolit.

    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...s-Lee-C430-310

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don1357 View Post
    Well this was the problem I had: I haven't found official load data specific for this boolit and H110. Lot's of people seem to be happy with this boolit and 21.5 grains of H110 but the closest thing I found to a published recipe was that Bear Tooth Bullet data on the Hodgon website.

    I'll try it on the bottom crimp grove for a 1.790 C.O.A.L., large pistol primers and 20~22 grains of H110.
    I'm sorry i guess my post might be a little confusing. First I suggested to pay close attention to the COA and stick with that, this statement meant to make sure you stay in the bottom crimp groove and not seat it deeper without re doing the powder charge. Then I suggested when extrapolating load data with a published load close to your boolit weight, I suggest to pay close attention to where the base of the boolit sits in the case, i.e. crimp to boolit base.

    I had not considered the fact that load data for this exact boolit may not be easy to find, if you can find it at all.

    The seating depth is the important one. You can take data that is close enough, and be safe as long as you are seating so there is no drastic change in case volume below the boolit.

    I think I used data for a 300gr Hornady XTP jacketed hollowpoint bullet. Then I also read threads in this forum where there are a LOT of users of this same boolit, it's quite popular, and my data seemed to be comparable with that of others.

    BTW, H110 and W296 are the same powder, made in the same plant, labeled H110 for Hodgdon, and W296 for Winchester.
    Got a .22 .30 .32 .357 .38 .40 .41 .44 .45 .480 or .500 S&W cylinder that needs throat reaming? 9mm, 10mm/40S&W, 45 ACP pistol barrel that won't "plunk" your handloads? Shoot me a PM! Also on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Cylinderhone-756429174391912/

  7. #7
    Boolit Master RED BEAR's Avatar
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    I really like h110 in my 44 .but be careful start at or near lowest load listed and work up . Never lower than listed loads ether . Its a great powder but it can really bite the careless.
    By the way i never knew that h110 w296 were the same. You learn something new all the time.

  8. #8
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    I've never had the accuracy I wanted with Bullets heavier then 270grs. Tried the Lee 44-310 with 4227, 2400 and 296. Didn't get better then the Saeco#432 265gr FPGC, in fact it was a full third less accurate in my Scoped SRH 7 1/2". Same for both SBH's, S&W 29 and Colt Anaconda. But the Anaconda was junk anyway. Dumped it on some poor dude that Had to have it.
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  9. #9
    Boolit Master Bazoo's Avatar
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    From The Lyman cast bullet handbook 4th edition,
    44 Rem Magnum
    Lee C430-310-RF
    1.710" OAL
    H110 17.5 - 19.5

    Bazoo

  10. #10
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    I use 21.0 grn of H110 with that bullet PCed loaded to the TOP groove( nearest the nose of the Boolits) with a medium crimp it shoots great out of my 44s

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bazoo View Post
    From The Lyman cast bullet handbook 4th edition,
    44 Rem Magnum
    Lee C430-310-RF
    1.710" OAL
    H110 17.5 - 19.5

    Bazoo
    That looks like the rifle load, crimped to the second grove (hence the 1.710" OAL and lower powder load). Does the book has a load for the first crimp?

    Quote Originally Posted by WinchesterM1 View Post
    I use 21.0 grn of H110 with that bullet PCed loaded to the TOP groove( nearest the nose of the Boolits) with a medium crimp it shoots great out of my 44s
    And this is what I was told not to do on the very first response. I'm finding some anecdotal evidence saying that it is ok if H110 is slightly compressed but the key word on that sentence is "anecdotal".

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don1357 View Post
    That looks like the rifle load, crimped to the second grove (hence the 1.710" OAL and lower powder load). Does the book has a load for the first crimp?



    And this is what I was told not to do on the very first response. I'm finding some anecdotal evidence saying that it is ok if H110 is slightly compressed but the key word on that sentence is "anecdotal".
    I said not to do that meaning don't just seat it in the top groove over the same powder charge used for the lower groove. It's fine to seat it in the top groove, *IF* you take into consideration the lesser case volume and lower the powder charge accordingly. I just didn't want you to "experiment" with that top groove and the same charge used for the longer COA.

    21.0gr may be pretty good for the shorter COA, but that's only half grain lower than what many use for the longer COA.
    Got a .22 .30 .32 .357 .38 .40 .41 .44 .45 .480 or .500 S&W cylinder that needs throat reaming? 9mm, 10mm/40S&W, 45 ACP pistol barrel that won't "plunk" your handloads? Shoot me a PM! Also on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Cylinderhone-756429174391912/

  13. #13
    Boolit Master stubert's Avatar
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    I am loading that bullet for a Ruger Red Hawk, 20.8 grains of 296, 50/50 moly lube, seated to 1.71. I get 1.5" groups at 50 yds. if I do my part. (with a scope)

  14. #14
    Boolit Master Bazoo's Avatar
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    Don, that is listed in the pistol data and is the only OAL listed. In the rifle data the Lee 430-310 is not listed.

  15. #15
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    Yes, it is safe to compress H110 a little bit.
    Heavily compressed charges can actually make it burn slower.

  16. #16
    Boolit Buddy Rainier's Avatar
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    FWIW - The Lee 430-310 ends up at 315 grains checked and PC’d for me. I use that boolit with 21 grains of IMR 4227 seated in the bottom crimp groove for use in my RedHawk. It ended up being a very accurate load for me, in my gun, with that said I’d start a couple of grains lower and work up.
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  17. #17
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    I tested with 21.5 grains of H110 crimped at the first groove. With gas check and lube the boolits were around 308 grains. The kick was actually a lot more mellow than I expected and the empty brass dropped right off the cylinder. I have shot Buffalo Bore 305 grain bullets and with those I was having a lot more kick and extraction issues.

    I'm going to test with 22 grains of powder as the max and slowly creep the crimping toward the second groove and watch for pressure issues. To be clear I have no need to crimp to the second groove but it would still be a learning experience to see how the powder reacts.

    After that I'll start working my way down the powder testing for accuracy with different alloys; currently I'm using water quenched WW+5% tin.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check