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Thread: burnt patches?

  1. #1

    burnt patches?

    Would someone please post pictures of properly spent 50 caliber patches. My patches are freyed and have holes in them..

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Kurty View Post
    Would someone please post pictures of properly spent 50 caliber patches. My patches are freyed and have holes in them..
    Dont have a picture handy but the body of the patch should be sound enough that you be able to use it again - any hole or tear at all is costing accuracy. If they frayed around the edges maybe they too small?

    A thing to check is patch size
    - too small and the ball can get skewey as you ram it and the patch not completely covering the side of the ball against the rifling-
    - too big and the excess material at the front of the ball messes things up - cut a patch on the muzzle, then pull it, that is the best way to get the right size for a patch
    for round cut patches - inch and a half is ideal for 50cal - inch and three quarters for 54 cal. Smaller you can make it work but have no margin for error setting the patch and ball straight and ramming true. I started my 54 with too small patches and got really frustrated - one or two stray shots (three inches out of the group at 100yds) in every string of ten - took ages and a lot of powder before I realised what was up - I cut one patch on the muzzle for a look see and that question was answered quick.
    What material do you use ? If pillow ticking is burning - try drill, its about the same thickness but tougher - if all else fails put a wad on the powder then yr patched ball .
    I have a 54 I used to shoot big loads in and I used a dry calico patch on the powder then the lubed patched ball over that - It worked, but that dry patch was a fire hazard on the range.

  3. #3
    Boolit Buddy arcticap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Kurty View Post
    Would someone please post pictures of properly spent 50 caliber patches. My patches are freyed and have holes in them..
    This page has a photo of burned vs. unburned patches [shown below].--->>> https://www.castbulletassoc.org/foru...quare-patches/

    Note that the main differences between the patches were the type of powder being loaded and the lube.
    Most folks say that the shape of the patch shouldn't matter.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by arcticap; 06-11-2019 at 10:38 AM.

  4. #4
    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	243383The 4 on the top are from yesterday. Left to right first 3 were shot with 75 grains homemade catalpa charcoal.4th one willow charcoal same 75 grains all weighed and 1fg. Bottom 3 are what i could find today 100 grains 1fg. willow. Todays speeds. All of which grouped 3.5 inches at 75 yards. Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Dirty Kurty; 06-16-2019 at 06:34 AM.

  5. #5
    Yesterday i had flyers. Today they all grouped.. Ill take that all day with homemade powder. 3f willow charcoal 3% dextrin pressed and corned. next powders will have no binders and............Wait for it "Alder Buckthorn" charcoal. 100 grains. Not worried about the patches right now.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by arcticap View Post
    This page has a photo of burned vs. unburned patches [shown below].--->>> https://www.castbulletassoc.org/foru...quare-patches/

    Note that the main differences between the patches were the type of powder being loaded and the lube.
    Most folks say that the shape of the patch shouldn't matter.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Thank you Arcticap!

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Kurty View Post
    Thank you Arcticap!
    Worry about the patches!

    Notice the burnt patches used bore butter (I detest that stuff) you didnt say what lube you are using ? try some moose milk (cutting oil and water 1:5) and your patches damp when you load --- if they still burn use an overpowder wad of some sort

  8. #8
    Boolit Buddy
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    Indian Joe,what kind/brand of cutting oil do you use and where do yuo buy it?

  9. #9
    Boolit Man TheOutlawKid's Avatar
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    Shortlegs i believe hes talking about balistol. Its good stuff...but ive now switched to Fluid Film which is made fron lanolin, not as a cutting oil but as an all in one lube and preserver/rust preventer.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheOutlawKid View Post
    Shortlegs i believe hes talking about balistol. Its good stuff...but ive now switched to Fluid Film which is made fron lanolin, not as a cutting oil but as an all in one lube and preserver/rust preventer.
    everyone raves about Ballistol ---I ve never seen the stuff - I use soluble cutting oil, same stuff as I use in the recirculate pump system on my lathe and mill - I think the drum says mobil - could be 20 years old . I think any soluble cutting oil would do ok.

  11. #11
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    patches

    and yes, this is with bore butter. your patches could be shredding............ being cut by sharp rifling. Or poor lube application.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  12. #12
    Boolit Man TheOutlawKid's Avatar
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    Indian joe...im not one who raves about it. Its ok...but just ok in my book. Others have great results...and it works but its not the hardest working. The cutting oil your using is probably alot better than balistol.

  13. #13
    Boolit Buddy arcticap's Avatar
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    One popular soluble cutting and grinding oil is NAPA 7651525 --->>> https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/WLD7651525

    This has been mentioned on the Shilo Rifle Forum, and other forums over the years. --->>> https://shilohrifle.com/forums/viewt...14724&start=15

    NAPA Auto Parts used to sell the same NAPA cutting oil in quarts, but I can only find another brand available in quarts at NAPA online which doesn't seem to have the same ingredients.
    Not all soluble cutting and grinding oils are the same.
    One poster on Shilo mentions mixing it 1 part distilled water to 4 parts oil for a milky solution.
    Last edited by arcticap; 06-12-2019 at 10:24 AM.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheOutlawKid View Post
    Indian joe...im not one who raves about it. Its ok...but just ok in my book. Others have great results...and it works but its not the hardest working. The cutting oil your using is probably alot better than balistol.
    I'll tone that down a bit lot of guys talk about it (quite a bit) - not knockin ballistol at all I just never encountered it - and didnt yet feel the need to go search for it - I stumbled on something that works - dont lets waste good shootin time fixin what aint broke ....... also I am cheapskate and kinda cynical - always shied away from anything expensive in a small container on the basis the same stuff proly came from industry in a big container at a lot less price - that theory dont always work

  15. #15
    Boolit Buddy
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    About a month ago I bought NAPA cutting oil, got the one pint size. Think it was about $12. Wasn't in stock so they ordered it for me, only took two days to get it.

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    I would try working up a load with commercial BP, to give yourself a baseline to work with your homemade powder. If you are using store bought thin muslin patches, I don't think they are worth a ****. Always start with a pillow ticking for a standard patch, and fit the ball to that. That should cure the problem, along with a proper lube like Moose Milk.
    The solid soft lead bullet is undoubtably the best and most satisfactory expanding bullet that has ever been designed. It invariably mushrooms perfectly, and never breaks up. With the metal base that is essential for velocities of 2000 f.s. and upwards to protect the naked base, these metal-based soft lead bullets are splendid.
    John Taylor - "African Rifles and Cartridges"

    Forget everything you know about loading jacketed bullets. This is a whole new ball game!


  17. #17
    Boolit Buddy arcticap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rich/WIS View Post
    About a month ago I bought NAPA cutting oil, got the one pint size. Think it was about $12. Wasn't in stock so they ordered it for me, only took two days to get it.
    You're right, thanks.
    I found the pint size by adding NAPA to the search name:--->>> https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/WLD7...pa+cutting+oil

    Part #: WLD 7651526 - NAPA Soluble Cutting And Grinding Oil - 16 ozs.
    Last edited by arcticap; 06-12-2019 at 02:05 PM.

  18. #18
    [QUOTE=waksupi;4666150]I would try working up a load with commercial BP, to give yourself a baseline to work with your homemade powder. If you are using store bought thin muslin patches, I don't think they are worth a ****. Always start with a pillow ticking for a standard patch, and fit the ball to that. That should cure the problem, along with a proper lube like Moose Milk.[/QUOTEGreat advice and thank you...Round my region NAPA stands for Never Any Parts Available!

  19. #19
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    Dirty, the other cause of torn patches is a rough bore. Somethng to check, anyway.
    Wayne the Shrink

    There is no 'right' that requires me to work for you or you to work for me!

  20. #20
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    Pillow ticking or tough linen patches. Beeswax - deer or mutton tallow - grape seed or peanut oil. Adjust oil according to season for proper hardness of lube. Burnt patches is mostly a function of what material for patch. Cotton or linen will hardly ever burn. Possibly shred if rough bore or sharp rifling but not burn. If you want to see black powder charges burn go to real traditional wadding like hornet nest material or dried mullein leaves and heavy charges under buck -n- ball or shot loads, shouldering material and fire everywhere. Ask how I know. 10ga
    10 gauge: as per Robert Ruark, "use enough gun"

    MOLON LABE

    "I have a list, and am prepared for widespread civil disorder!" 10 ga

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check