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Thread: Trying to get a TC Hawken to shoot RB

  1. #21
    Boolit Buddy
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    use a .495 RB before hacking your barrel and try 70-80 grains 3f black powder not a substitute. run a spit patch down barrel after every shot. ive owned over a dozen TCs and they all shoot great. i run a a 495 ball and a oxyoke prelubed patch and it drills. if you are not shooting off a bench and bags you will never know what the gun is capable of.

  2. #22
    Boolit Master
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    I have 2 Omegas by TC, and neither will not shoot a powerbelt bullet worth a hoot. Any other bullet/sabot or maxi ball will group into 1" or less at 100yds. I had two customers who wanted their Omega, and Impact to shoot the Powerbelts, with the same problems I had. I conviced them both to let me cut and recrown the barrels where the rifling starts, and both rifles shoot Powerbelts into a ragged hole for 3 shots at 100yds. That being said, I have had tow TC Hawkens with QLA's that shot roundballs fine, with .495 and a .015 linen patch that I lubed, but not nearly as accurate as those without the QLA. Just my findings on about 12 rifles over the years.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by koger View Post
    I have 2 Omegas by TC, and neither will not shoot a powerbelt bullet worth a hoot. Any other bullet/sabot or maxi ball will group into 1" or less at 100yds. I had two customers who wanted their Omega, and Impact to shoot the Powerbelts, with the same problems I had. I conviced them both to let me cut and recrown the barrels where the rifling starts, and both rifles shoot Powerbelts into a ragged hole for 3 shots at 100yds. That being said, I have had tow TC Hawkens with QLA's that shot roundballs fine, with .495 and a .015 linen patch that I lubed, but not nearly as accurate as those without the QLA. Just my findings on about 12 rifles over the years.
    I counterbored a Marcheno sharps ages ago (it was set up properly in a four jaw and done right) - it shot ok before but used to lead like crazy on a couple of tiny rust marks at the muzle, previous owner had it in storage too long.............anyway about 5/8th inch didnt cure the leading, but spread my bench groups from 2 inch to 4 inch at 100yards. Something to do with the exit gases around the boolit base in the counterbored bit I reckoned. And I would bet it be worse with a sabot than a solid bore size slug .

    All of this was because I was bein lazy and didnt want to recut the front sight dovetail - so I hacksawed a bit over two inches off it, recrowned it, recut the sight dovetail with a triangle file ............all good.

  4. #24
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    Buzzard II's Avatar
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    Cut off the QLA, recrown the barrel, and be done with it. That, or sell it and buy a new GM barrel. TOTW has them with RB twist. Good luck.
    Bob
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  5. #25
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    My first T/C muzzle loader wouldn't hit a barn if I was inside of it. I sent the whole thing back to T/C and they sent me another. I changed the sights on it to some of the fixed sights that they had and could put three shots into a Skoal can @ 75 yards. I never killed anything but tree rats with it, but they didn't have a chance. I was using 2f as the paperwork suggested, but 3f did a bit better, and Pyrodex P did the best.
    Last edited by Tom W.; 06-03-2019 at 11:03 PM.
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  6. #26
    Boolit Master bedbugbilly's Avatar
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    Maybe a candidate to send to Bob Hoyt for a re-bore?

  7. #27
    Boolit Master northmn's Avatar
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    My biggest problem with round ball accuracy came from trying Black powder substitutes like 777 or Pyrodex. I have a rifle I used in matches that would only pattern that stuff at 100 yards and tightened back up again using GOEX. It is a 50 cal. Been trying ot use the other "stuff" up in shotgun cartridges.

    DEP

  8. #28
    Boolit Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    My problem child QLA was a .54 New Englander.
    Now it's relined and shoots soft cast 45-70 molds very well.

    With the QLA when it was tearing patches and would make you hammer a plain based boolit to get it in...
    The dadgum counterbore was flat bottomed with a sharp edge. Goofy.
    So I called TC and got it right from the guys in the shop, yeah that's the way it was designed!

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Good Cheer View Post
    My problem child QLA was a .54 New Englander.
    Now it's relined and shoots soft cast 45-70 molds very well.

    With the QLA when it was tearing patches and would make you hammer a plain based boolit to get it in...
    The dadgum counterbore was flat bottomed with a sharp edge. Goofy.
    So I called TC and got it right from the guys in the shop, yeah that's the way it was designed!
    Stoopid!!!!! (design)

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Good Cheer View Post
    My problem child QLA was a .54 New Englander.
    Now it's relined and shoots soft cast 45-70 molds very well.

    With the QLA when it was tearing patches and would make you hammer a plain based boolit to get it in...
    The dadgum counterbore was flat bottomed with a sharp edge. Goofy.
    So I called TC and got it right from the guys in the shop, yeah that's the way it was designed!
    WOW, my 36 cal QLA is surely not "flat bottomed with a sharp edge."
    As I said before, mine loads and shoots great ...apparently I got the only good one?
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonB_in_Glencoe View Post
    WOW, my 36 cal QLA is surely not "flat bottomed with a sharp edge."
    As I said before, mine loads and shoots great ...apparently I got the only good one?
    Yeah that should be just a gentle cone? that takes about half the rifling (lands) off - done by a perfectionist machinist it works good - anything less than perfection takes away from accuracy (some or a lot depending)

  12. #32
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    I'm with bedbugbilly. Send it off to Hoyt and get the barrel that will shoot the boo lit of your choice. Want to shoot conicals, get a twist custom for that weight / caliber. Want to shoot round balls, get that set up. Lots of the in-betweener's shoot both ball and boolit quite well, but one that is purpose made for your choice of boolit is wonderful. Not that expensive either.

  13. #33
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    Just a passing thought.....



    Years ago Butler Creek made some poly patches. The first ones were double ended and I used them for target shooting, putting a bit of lube under the ball and filling the bottom with lube. They shot wonderfully. When hunting I just put a dab of lube under the ball. Later on they changed the design so the bottom was flat and the top was cupped, they shot well but I liked the old design better. The only reason for the dab of lube was to help keep the ball stuck in the patch. At least that's what I thought.

    If you can find them, if they are still available, you might want to give them a try.
    Tom
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  14. #34
    Boolit Master brewer12345's Avatar
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    Fwiw, I was playing with prb loads last weekend with my hawken using black mz, 490 balls and 015 patches. Groups were ok at 50 yards, but nothing to write home about. I tried using an over powder lubed wad, and it was like waving a magic wand. Groups got tiny and stayed that way even with higher powder charges.
    "If you see me running something has gone poorly, and you should probably run too." - any beekeeper

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by brewer12345 View Post
    Fwiw, I was playing with prb loads last weekend with my hawken using black mz, 490 balls and 015 patches. Groups were ok at 50 yards, but nothing to write home about. I tried using an over powder lubed wad, and it was like waving a magic wand. Groups got tiny and stayed that way even with higher powder charges.
    what over powder wad were you using?

  16. #36
    Boolit Master
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    Experiment with wads ,Lubed /dry /cards (most all will work) Ed

  17. #37
    Boolit Master brewer12345's Avatar
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    I use the ox yoke pre lubed ones sized to the bore (so use the ones they sell for 50 in your 50).
    "If you see me running something has gone poorly, and you should probably run too." - any beekeeper

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by arcticap View Post
    If all else fails and as a last resort, I would consider cutting the QLA part of the barrel off and having it re-crowned.
    Many of these barrels shot crappy as is and were cured by cutting off the uneeded QLA and recrowning.

  19. #39
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    My fix was in the ball,what I had cast as .490 turned out to be .4895 to .485, then tried Hornady swayed and found the keep there size better then my cast did pure lead does shrink with age. Just a thought that might help before you start cutting the Rifle barrel.
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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check