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Thread: Why are the only good Muslims, moderate Muslims?

  1. #81
    Boolit Buddy Snow ninja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Jaque Janaviac View Post
    So if you want to know if a belief system is good or not, just examine its extremists and their lives will tell you where that belief system will lead you.

    Who are your extremists?
    Does this work with the Westboro Baptist Church??
    Do the best you can, with what you've got, where you're at. -Theodore Roosevelt

  2. #82
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snow ninja View Post
    Does this work with the Westboro Baptist Church??
    Say what? Do you really want us to believe that, at least in your own eyes, Westboro is Christian? If so, you really do need some new glasses!

    No one need have watched the reports on Westboro very closely, or for very long, to know Christians are the strongest critics of everything they say and do. But, in spite of our progressives best efforts to stop it, America is still a (mostly) free country so if it fits anyone's weird political agenda to say Westboro is "Christian", have at it.

  3. #83
    Boolit Master
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    People here have sometimes accused me of Attacking Christians. I have much respect for people I think are True Christians and have attacked some of the beliefs of persons claiming to be Christians but who act and speak of things that I think are wrong and sometimes even evil and against the preaching of Jesus. While I am uncertain if Jesus is the Christ, I am sure he was a very wise and devoted person who's consul should be followed.

    The Westboro Baptists are not true Christians and they spread a message of evil.

    Tim
    Words are weapons sharper than knives - INXS

    The pen is mightier than the sword - Edward Bulwer-Lytton

    The tongue is mightier than the blade - Euripides

  4. #84
    Boolit Grand Master



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    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/islamis...fjNPwo18bxLSOQ

    Islamist extremism caused 84,000 deaths worldwide in 2017, new report says
    2nd Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. - "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by Snow ninja View Post
    Does this work with the Westboro Baptist Church??
    Yes it does. You can judge the beliefs of Westboro Baptist based on their extremists.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by dtknowles View Post
    As long as Protestants practice adherence to the fundamentals of Christianity there is little to no chance of peace between them and any non-believers. Unless Christians abandon their faith there is going to be no change and no change means constant war with the rest of the planet with extermination of one side or the other the end result. When their place in eternity is on the line they will never compromise.

    Tim
    Interesting. If you consider this statement, it is untrue. Christianity has a way of even making war a tad more humane. Consider the plight of POWs in Geneva compact nations vs. Noncompact nations.

  7. #87
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Jaque Janaviac View Post
    Interesting. If you consider this statement, it is untrue. Christianity has a way of even making war a tad more humane. Consider the plight of POWs in Geneva compact nations vs. Noncompact nations.
    Well,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...va_Conventions

    Does not seem to be strictly Christians.

    Tim
    Words are weapons sharper than knives - INXS

    The pen is mightier than the sword - Edward Bulwer-Lytton

    The tongue is mightier than the blade - Euripides

  8. #88
    Boolit Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by dtknowles View Post
    So what to do about it. The constitution prohibits discrimination based on Religion or Politics.

    Tim
    Discrimination does not have a place in survival, one gets killed or kills to stay alive. Not hard for clear thinkers to figure out.
    Political correctness is a national suicide pact.

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    only to God and my own conscience.

  9. #89
    Boolit Grand Master



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    Quote Originally Posted by dtknowles View Post
    So what to do about it. The constitution prohibits discrimination based on Religion or Politics.

    Tim
    Not correct

    https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclope...filiation.html

    "Can an employer fire or discriminate against an employee based on political beliefs? You may be surprised to learn that, for many employees, the answer is yes. Federal law does not protect private employees from discrimination based on their politics. However, some states do protect employees from certain types of political discrimination. And, an employer may not use an employee’s politics as a pretext for discrimination based on a protected trait, like race or religion."
    2nd Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. - "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

  10. #90
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    To answer the original question posted.

    In political terms, moderate muslims are those who contribute to democratic foundations. Extremist muslims are those who take money from democratic foundations and supporters.

    But in military parlance, a moderate muslim MAKES the IEDs and BOMB VESTS in an attempt to avoid having to be an Extremist who WEARS the bomb vest

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by dtknowles View Post
    Well,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...va_Conventions

    Does not seem to be strictly Christians.

    Tim
    It originated from Christianity. The first convention was all Christian nations. The Red Cross started it. It wasn't until later that other faiths began to say "me too" - and now we have Red Cross/Red Crescent.

  12. #92
    Boolit Master
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    Moderate vs. radical Muslim is often interpreted to be the same as moderate vs. fundamental Christianity; that's by no means true. Those who cling to that delusion are closing their minds to their defenders while blindly opening their tolerant bosoms to a bloody religion of vipers. Allowed to reach the determined Islamic end, efforts to be sweet to the followers of a murderous sixth century Allah will eventually get everyone killed.

    The word "Islam" means those religionists who believe the teachings of Mohommud (sp?) as it's explained in their supposed sacred book, the "Koran"; those who follow are "Muslims", i.e., those who submit to Islamic teaching. Fundamental to Islam's teaching is a belief that Muslims will eventually take over all the peoples of the world, either by conviction, fear or death; if they do not believe every word of the Koran then they don't believe Islam and are therefore subject to merciless murder themselves, by any means or back-stabbing deceptions necessary. In plain English, Muslims are book taught from their mother's breasts to hate others with a deadly intensity and to be sly and dishonest in bloody pursuit of their religion's long term goals.

    So, with that understanding, we have "moderate" vs. radical Muslims but everyone should KNOW that BOTH have the same final end before them. The applied difference at this moment is the so-called radicals seek to kill us as quickly as possible so their world will be at "peace." The moderates disagree only in the timing; moderates don't think the time to kill all others has yet come. But none of us should be fooled, even their moderates fully believe Allah's time for the murder of all others will surely come and, when it does, even the "moderates" expect to participate.

    I see little in the moderate's timing difference to make the non-muslim world feel comfortable.

    It is Jewish-Christian to live in peace and allow others the freedom to live as they wish. Those who see no deadly difference between Christians and ANYONE else are blinded by their own "hate". We hate no one, we kill no one, we defend others even when we strongly disagree with them and we strongly reject anyone who teaches or does harm to anyone, especially in the name of Christ. And, happily, very few do.

  13. #93
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    If anyone is really interested, I think this article may be able to explain the differences between, "Islam" & "Islamism".

    http://www.danielpipes.org/documents/366.pdf

    http://www.danielpipes.org/366/islam...h-and-ideology

    I am still going with the thinking that Mohammedanism(Islam/Islamism) is a political ideology that is disguised as a religion.
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  14. #94
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    https://thefederalist.com/2017/01/06...Wnwm8.facebook

    Christians Need To Stop Being So Naive About Muslim Immigration
    Many Christians have been lulled into a childish view of the world and think that deep down Muslims are not too different from them.


    By Wendy Wilson
    January 6, 2017

    Soon after the November attack at Ohio State University, we learned the Somali Muslim perpetrator had been welcomed to the United States as a refugee by Catholic Charities of Dallas. This bit of news caught my attention because years ago I worked there for a brief time.
    In the early 1990s after graduating from college, I served there for a year as part of a volunteer stipend program, helping immigrants caught here illegally prepare their cases for immigration court. My roommates worked on the refugee resettlement side, helping newly arrived families with refugee status.

    I’ve continued to be fascinated with immigration and looked for ways to be helpful. It’s what drew me to teaching English to immigrant students. But my perspective widened and concerns grew as I learned more about our porous borders and problems throughout the West with assimilation, and as I witnessed the growing influence of a warped multiculturalism that convinces many to quash any uneasiness about newcomers, no matter how reasonable. In voicing my concerns, I’ve been slammed by other Christians who’ve called me ignorant and uncaring.
    Although I worked for Catholic Charities, I’m a lifelong Protestant. I was raised Lutheran and for many years now have attended conservative Presbyterian churches. Multiculturalism long ago began to muscle its way into mainline Protestant churches but is now running amok in conservative churches, too, with many Christians fearful of being called a bigot for criticizing other traditions and beliefs.
    While those in mainline churches tout diversity in a way that differs little from those outside the church, more devout Christians have adopted multiculturalism as a way to better evangelize. Emotion and sentiment have taken over reason, leaving people without the resources to sufficiently analyze threats to our culture and safety, and in some cases, even a diminished interest in doing so. The more pious shame others for their concerns, saying sacrifice and saving souls should come way before worries about ensuring America’s survival as a strong nation.
    Many Evangelicals Don’t Seem to Get It
    Trump did well among evangelicals in winning the presidency. Many conservative Christians cited Supreme Court picks as the top reason they were voting for him despite his personal moral failings. It’s far from clear that Christians en masse would fully support proposals to seriously restrict Muslim immigration, especially once they face the wrath of activists and journalists more determined than ever to smear them as racists. Also, there’s a strong movement among intellectual evangelicals to embrace Muslim immigration.

    In December 2015, more than 100 evangelical leaders met at Wheaton College to discuss how Christians should respond to the migrant crisis that began early that year. They released a statement that gave only passing mention to security concerns while focusing primarily on telling Christians not to be fearful.
    “We will not be motivated by fear but by love for God and others…We cannot allow voices of fear to dominate,” the statement read. But rational fear is a healthy thing. It serves to protect, and in protecting, shows love. The Bible has plenty of examples of God’s people taking measures to protect their communities. There’s no reason to fear every single Muslim we meet, but in looking at the bigger picture, there are perfectly valid reasons to fear the violence and political and cultural change a growing Muslim population can bring.
    Some of my devout Christian friends insist we shouldn’t speak out much about atrocities Muslims have committed because if we do, Muslims won’t be open to hearing the gospel from us. Neither, they say, should we voice too many criticisms about religious differences that might upset them. But how can there be any hope of having a functioning multicultural society if there are taboos against criticizing traditions that aren’t your own? This misguided quest to be nice and welcoming creates space for the strong-armed to run over the weak, the very type of scenario you would think Christians concerned about justice would care about.
    Muslims Aren’t Just Another Denomination
    I’ve also heard Christians point to successful assimilation of immigrants in years past as proof that waves of Muslim immigration will work out just fine, too. When migrants began pouring into Europe, my friends shared stories of their ancestors arriving at Ellis Island, as if there are few differences between what happened then and what’s happening now. I recently got into a discussion with a Baptist pastor who says we shouldn’t worry since competing Protestant sects as well as Catholics were eventually accepted into the mainstream of American life.

    It’s hard for me to wrap my mind around how my educated friends and educated church leaders can’t see that differences between Islam and Christianity are profoundly greater than differences between various Christian groups. Have they not read the history of Islamic conquest? Can they not observe the differences in today’s world between countries dominated by Islam and Western countries founded on Christian and Enlightenment values? Are they not aware of the widespread problems with migrants assaulting women in Germany, one of the latest victims being the daughter of a European official, who was raped and drowned? Have they not heard about the sharia law courts Muslim immigrants have created in England and the schools where Muslim children are taught barbaric practices?
    Last year, I joined a class at my church sponsored by the Crescent Project, a Christian ministry founded to share the gospel with Muslims globally. In some respects, it’s an organization I’m happy to support. Their efforts seem sincere and helpful in prodding Christians with little previous intercultural experience to step outside their comfort zones. Yet it’s also one of those programs that leads to some Christians becoming so filled with zeal, they develop tunnel vision.
    One woman in my class said she used to be afraid when she saw a Muslim at the grocery store, but now, thanks to the class, believes it’s God’s will for Muslims to come to the United States so we can witness to them. I’ve heard this idea expressed elsewhere as well, sometimes with great enthusiasm. God is blessing us, the thinking goes, by bringing Muslims here so we don’t have to travel abroad to reach them.
    However, this turns previous concepts of missionary work on their heads. Missions used to be primarily about assuming risks for yourself and perhaps your family as you ventured into unsafe terrain. By endorsing growing rates of Muslim immigration into the United States, Christians are insisting that their neighbors here assume the risks too, all for the convenience of their evangelism programs.

    Such rosy pictures can likely be traced partly to the fact that even in many conservative churches today, pastors shy away from discussing evil and the reality that there are people in this world seeking to deceive and destroy. We’ve been marinating in a theology that focuses excessively on grace and inner peace to the exclusion of other parts of the Bible that tell us evil is always on the march.
    Both the Old and New Testaments make frequent use of words such as battle, soldier, and warfare in both the literal sense and in a metaphorical spiritual sense. But you will be hard-pressed to hear those words in sermons today. Many Christians have been lulled into a childish view of the world and think that deep down everyone is not too different from them. But history and the contemporary world should show us that fundamentalist Islam is radically different from the beliefs of Christians and other Americans. If we don’t fully wake up to this reality, we will pay a heavier price for our delusions than we already have.
    Wendy Wilson is a teacher and writer in Nashville. She has a master’s degree in intercultural studies from Union University in Jackson, Tennessee, and has been a member of churches affiliated with the Presbyterian Church in America (PCA).
    2nd Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. - "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

  15. #95
    Boolit Buddy
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    All this last tome is true! Most of our main line church's ( denominations ) want to be all inclusive ( anything goes ). They have feet of clay and cannot stand for what the Bible says! Most parishioners are scared to stand for fear of being called out for what they believe. If a person will not stand for what they belief of what value are they? As for me I will stand for Christ !!!!

  16. #96
    Boolit Bub Txcowboy52's Avatar
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    I agree!

  17. #97
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nicholst55 View Post
    I'll take you up on that, eventually. I should be in the Baltimore area this winter for a couple of weeks.
    Please be aware that I am of the school which preaches that there are fundamental differences between the Carlisle School of Cultural Diversity, Political Correctness and Beltway Success, vs. the Leavenworth School of Advanced Infantry Studies geared towards ruthlessly killing all who hate Western Society and Therefore Deserve It. My being of the latter group. Slay them all for our Lord will recognise his own.

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  18. #98
    Boolit Grand Master
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    What Outpost 75 said, in toto. Islam in all of its forms is a death cult. A Manson Family, written large. There are faster and slower variants, but their ultimate goals are the same.
    I don't paint bullets. I like Black Rifle Coffee. Sacred cows are always fair game. California is to the United States what Syria is to Russia and North Korea is to China/South Korea/Japan--a Hermit Kingdom detached from the real world and led by delusional maniacs, an economic and social basket case sustained by "foreign" aid so as to not lose military bases.

  19. #99
    Boolit Buddy

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    Outpost75 is spot on in his assessment of islam. While my study is nowhere near the depth or breadth of his observations, i would argue that islam is not a religion. It is a political ideology complete wth a political heirarchy, tax code, system of laws and punishment, and establishes the descendants of a genocidal pedophile as the sole heads of state. Some have called it stateless when in fact it seeks the entire world as its state. Free governments should act accordingly.

    Iniustus lex est non lex
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    "I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!" Barry Goldwater
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  20. #100
    Boolit Buddy
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    I was essentially PNG'd from a rather left leaning Sunday School class in a United Methodist Church that we used to attend over this. They were doing a "study on Islam" and after several Sundays of biting my tongue while hearing their PC version of Islam, I was pinged upon by the class leader for my comments. I've worked counter terror Islamic investigations during my LE career, including the 9/11 attacks and spent two years in Iraq immersed in that culture as a Dept of State Police Trainer. I had lots more experience and education on this than they did and I professionally summarized the intents and goals of Islam wherever they may be in action. I explained their down in the dirt attitudes towards women, Christians, Jews and anybody not like them. I explained the concept of al Taquiya, in which lying, dissimulation and manipulation of truth and their intent is required to further Islam. There was more, but by the time I was through, I'd dumped a nasty turd in their PC punchbowl by my discussion and by my sincere warning for them to not play with the Islamic rattlesnake. All of this, combined with a leftist pastor who actually burned a candle of mourning for an active shooter suspect caused us to move on to another congregation.
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