Lee .44 M Factory Crimp Die issues

[Rattlesnake Charlie]

Never had a problem using my Hornady titanium nitride dies in .44 mag, including the roll crimp regardless of case brand. I like a roll crimp on revolver cartridges.

[onelight]

FWIW:I check bullet diameter last night, mics out at .429 at the base. Just for snicks I took one of my prepped cases and inserted it into the FCD. Slips through the carbide ring all the way up to the crimp shoulder. So nothing still makes any sense. I have a few Hornady XTPs left with cannelure; I might try loading a dummy round and crimping with the FCD to see how it works on a cannelured bullet. If it works fine, I'll probably just use the FCD for bullets with a cannelure and continue roll crimping for plated bullets.
However, it still doesn't answer the question as to WHY this die doesn't work as advertised, especially since a number of you seem to be using it with plated bullets and have no issues.

If crimping the XTPs crushes the case, well...then I will consider it a defective die and sent it back to Lee.

It certainly does not to hurt to check it on an XTP but that die should work with plated cast unless several thousandths oversized or jacketed.
What does it do if you back off the crimp adjustment no crimp and run a round in and out of the die. You should wind up with a bullet tight in the case with no flare left and no crimp.
This should eliminate the floating crimper as part of the problem.
If it is good at this point run the case all the way back in the die and screw down the crimper till you feel it hit the case back the case out and screw the crimper down in small increments checking for crimp between each adjustment if the bullet crimp grove is shallow you can’t crimp much.
You might also adjust the crimp on the bullet seating die to remove most of the flare to make sure It enters the factory crimp die as it should .
If it won’t adjust for your bullets send it back it ain’t workin , maybe they will send you a regular roll crimp die.

[MT Chambers]

Totally unnecessary die, roll or taper crimp in separate operation from bullet seating, and don't fall for all the hype.

[onelight]

Here is a cutaway picture from the Lee catalog that shows the design of the factory crimp die , same die for 44 Russian 44spec. and 44 mag. It you can adjust for crimp on 44 Russian , you could probably with the crimp drastically over adjusted for 44 mag push most if not all of the bullet in a mag case through the crimp.

If the crimping part of the die floats lose in the die and became seized in the wrong spot it could do the same.

[Taterhead]

Does the bullet spin freely before crimping? If it does, the crimp die cannot fix poor neck tension. Either the expander shank is too large vis-a-vis the bullet diameter or the sizer is not small enough.

If the bullet seats snugly, then it is getting messed up in the crimping operation.

I did not notice if it is a collet style FCD or the Carbide FCD. Two very different tools with confusingly similar names. If the carbide variety: as stated earlier, the carbide post sizing ring can wreck neck tension by swaging the bullet. As can excessive crimp, as evidenced by the bulged cases. The latter is true of most any crimping die.

As an owner of a couple of carbide FCDs, I see no advantage whatsoever in that tool, except that the finger adjustment is nice. I see the post sizing ring more as a bug than a feature.

[Captain*Kirk]

Does the bullet spin freely before crimping? If it does, the crimp die cannot fix poor neck tension. Either the expander shank is too large vis-a-vis the bullet diameter or the sizer is not small enough.

In a word, no.

I did not notice if it is a collet style FCD or the Carbide FCD. Two very different tools with confusingly similar names. If the carbide variety: as stated earlier, the carbide post sizing ring can wreck neck tension by swaging the bullet. As can excessive crimp, as evidenced by the bulged cases. The latter is true of most any crimping die.

It's the carbide FCD. In fact, I was rather disappointed when I got it, as I was expecting a collet-type FCD like all my rifle dies are...which, BTW, make a very nice and secure crimp.

As an owner of a couple of carbide FCDs, I see no advantage whatsoever in that tool, except that the finger adjustment is nice. I see the post sizing ring more as a bug than a feature.

I would tend to agree with you. Since 90% of my .44 mag shooting is at the range using reduced powder charges and plated bullets, I've pretty much decided the standard roll crimp is completely satisfactory and the FCD offers no improvement as it too, is apparently a roll crimp die. It *might* serve a better purpose when loading 240gr JHP (Hornady XTP's; with a cannelure) but for now, I've pretty much determined I'll stick with the standard RC die rather than risk destroying any more cases than I already have by trying to utilize the Lee FCD, which as you say, is mostly useless in this instance.

[onelight]

This thread has me curious , I was getting ready to order another set of 38/357 dies so I ordered the Lee 4 die set that comes with the factory crimp die . I prefer to crimp separate from seating , and for revolvers have always just roll crimped. I think I can entertain myself and try the factory crimp with cast , plated and jacketed pull the bullets and see how the measurements compare to bullet diameters before and after loading.
I have seen reports here that they size carefully set up cast bullets to small but have not seen any reports on plated or jacketed.

[Captain*Kirk]

Good luck, hope you have better results than I did!

[Carrier]

Good luck, hope you have better results than I did!

Are you going to send it back to Lee? Really would like to know what the issue is. I use the FCD for all my revolvers calibers and have never seen this.

[onelight]

Good luck, hope you have better results than I did!

Thanks , don’t know that I will like it , just curious , I have never had one for revolvers cause I did not see how it would improve anything for me and some of my cast I use diameters larger than standard Jacketed bullets .

[Captain*Kirk]

Are you going to send it back to Lee? Really would like to know what the issue is. I use the FCD for all my revolvers calibers and have never seen this.

Not unless I have an issue with it on cannelured bullets. I really don't need the FCD for plated bullets I guess, the standard RC is working fine. The die was only $18.00...it will cost me half that to send it back to Lee. Not worth the time, effort or $$

[TheDoctor]

What will probably do you well is a Lee collet crimp die.

[Captain*Kirk]

What will probably do you well is a Lee collet crimp die.

That's what I thought I was getting when I ordered it. However, the collet die is NOT available in carbide, so that would mean lubing the cartridges before crimping.

[Moleman-]

That's what I thought I was getting when I ordered it. However, the collet die is NOT available in carbide, so that would mean lubing the cartridges before crimping.

Why would you lube cases to crimp them?

[mdi]

When I was new to reloading I wanted to see how much my die was crimping. I ran an empty sized, flared case through the crimp die to see how much the case mouth was being formed. I could see where I was, sorta a "starting point"...

I really don't care what dies an experienced reloader uses, but I do object to telling a new reloader that they should hide their mistakes with a Lee FCD for handgun cartridges. I normally suggest they find out what is causing their problems (chambering and bulging) and fix it. Most of the time it's just a matter of die adjustment. I tried an FCD for handgun ammo, and it now resides in a landfill somewhere in So. Oregon. In 35+ years of reloading revolver and semi-auto ammo I have never had to size a cartridge after it was crimped. When I had a problem, I found out why it was happening, and fixed it...

[mdi]

That's what I thought I was getting when I ordered it. However, the collet die is NOT available in carbide, so that would mean lubing the cartridges before crimping.

Nope, no lube needed...

[Moleman-]

I bought a .357 one to try out as an option for a semiauto as it was supposed to have a taper crimp...but it's basically a modified roll crimp. I tried it on a few rounds and took a cerro cast of the "taper crimp" section to confirm that. Then it was put on a shelf. Might use the die body to hold an expander stem for case forming but won't use it for it's intended purpose and I won't be buying any more. Like MDI I think it's a band aid for improperly set up dies.

[onelight]

I bought a .357 one to try out as an option for a semiauto as it was supposed to have a taper crimp...but it's basically a modified roll crimp. I tried it on a few rounds and took a cerro cast of the "taper crimp" section to confirm that. Then it was put on a shelf. Might use the die body to hold an expander stem for case forming but won't use it for it's intended purpose and I won't be buying any more. Like MDI I think it's a band aid for improperly set up dies.

I just got a 38/357 set but have not used it yet. One of my shooting buddies said that the revolver dies will taper crimp and with more adjustment roll crimp. I don’t know how much he knows about reloading but he is a really good shot.

[Moleman-]

Onelight, the taper crimp they make is very abrupt. Take a look at post 10 and compare a standard Lee 357 die I got around 1990, the cfcd from a year ago or so and the Lyman taper crimp die.

[onelight]

Nice castings.
I can’t tell from the picture does it actually put a taper crimp before you get to the roll crimp or just the roll crimp ?
Thanks