To turret or not to turret?

[KCcactus]

I use a Lee Auto Breech Lock Pro. It replaced a Lee 3 hole turret that I used for more than 30 years. One completed round per cycle of the lever is really nice.

[bmortell]

I use turret for when i load 38's in decent numbers. I have a turret on my left single stage on my right. I have the size and bell in the turret and seater in the single. I grab a case to the left press pull size, rotate, pull bell, go to the right press prime, case to powder dropper in the middle, look at the charge while i grab a projectile and seat in the right, drop it in container.

I dont know if thats normal but its what i do

I get a bullet every 25 seconds roughly, certainly not as fast as other things but this is the fastest way i figured out where i can physically feel each primer go in and feel it flat on the way to next step, also look at each powder, seat in a solid single stage.

So it gives me the same "insurances" i get doin single stage only

[Green Frog]

First, I would need to know what kind of ammo (rifle or pistol class) and what level of accuracy (Bullseye or Run-and-Gun) you are talking about. With the volume you describe, I assume you are talking about either IPSC or similar "combat" style pistol events where OK accuracy is good enough... ORRR... you may be loading for an AR-type semi-auto rifle or carbine, again probably not for F-class long range accuracy.

If for a pistol for IPSC etc, I would unlimber my Dillon 650 and keep everything clean, lubed and well adjusted to give high volume, reasonably good ammo. For the AR duties as described, a turret press would be my choice, probably the Lyman All American that currently stays set up for 327 Fed Mag (don't ask, it's illogical!)

Sooooo, I need more info to vote intelligently, but based on the limited info available I'd go with the turret press as a happy medium. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Froggie

[RED BEAR]

I have thought about getting a turret press from time to time. But have stuck with my lee classic single stage its over 40 years old and going strong. I weigh every charge so not sure about a turret. Between the wife and i we use between 500 , 1000 rounds a week usually. All loaded on that old lee. I don't work anymore so i have all the time in the world to load up. Since i have more time than money i will just stay with my lee a while longer.

[David2011]

I use a Dillon 650 for USPSA and a 550 for most other handgun rounds and fun rounds for my Garand. Low volume pistol like .44 Mag and most rifle loads are loaded on single stage presses.

[dverna]

My choice is what works for me. I have two single stage presses, two 550’s and two 1050’s. Each has a place.

I see no application for a turret press in my reloading needs. Might be a good choice for someone with lots of spare time or who does not reload a lot. And that is the question....what is “a lot”?

A lot of .308’s is 50 rounds for me.....a lot of .223’s is 500....a lot of pistol ammo is 2000.... Loaded at one sitting. YMMV.

IMHO, the turret press is for 200 rounds at a sitting....something I do not need.

[Three44s]

I could not vote either as I have and use examples of each category as well.

A big shout out for the LCT. I did retire it from my accuracy rifle work however as I saw the turret tipping a small amount on sizing and seating operations. I was leery about bullet alignment and found a compound leverage Redding single stage (Boss I believe). My RCBS Jr was getting a little worn after 35 years in the linkage.

I also have and use a LNL progressive.

I think for handgun loading the LCT would work for the OP though.

Three44s

[44Blam]

My ammo requirement went up a bit when I started shooting local steel matches. Now I'm starting to get into the IDPA type matches. So, each one of these takes 70-100 rounds and I'm doing 3 or 4 a month at this point... AND I still go out to the range and plink maybe a couple times a month.

I think the most time consuming thing I do when reloading is I weigh each charge on a beam scale. But I figure if I'm reloading ammunition that is specific to my firearms, so I want it to be the load that I found to be accurate.

So, I'm wondering if going to a turret is really going to help...

Anyway, I timed myself loading some 44 mag and it took a little over 2 hours to load 100 from primed brass. I loaded them with my Lee hand press at my dining table and was listening to TV and wasn't really in a hurry.

[M-Tecs]

I load almost everything on my progressives. For 600 to 1,000 yard ammo I do weigh the powder charges for dropping on the progressive. I have tested weighting verse non-weighting out too 600 yards and I just does not make a difference in my 10 shot groups until I get to past 300 yards.

Basically the same technique I use. http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/...den-shows-how/

[JBinMN]

My ammo requirement went up a bit when I started shooting local steel matches. Now I'm starting to get into the IDPA type matches. So, each one of these takes 70-100 rounds and I'm doing 3 or 4 a month at this point... AND I still go out to the range and plink maybe a couple times a month.

I think the most time consuming thing I do when reloading is I weigh each charge on a beam scale. But I figure if I'm reloading ammunition that is specific to my firearms, so I want it to be the load that I found to be accurate.

So, I'm wondering if going to a turret is really going to help...

Anyway, I timed myself loading some 44 mag and it took a little over 2 hours to load 100 from primed brass. I loaded them with my Lee hand press at my dining table and was listening to TV and wasn't really in a hurry.

I was not going to comment on this topic, but I am happy to see it has not devolved into a "this press" vs "this press" vs "this press" P-ing contest topic. I also did not participate in the poll, as I do not currently use a progressive. I also weigh each & every charge thrown, throw powder from a separate measure not attached to the press, as well as I use a "Go-NoGO" check each & every round as it is put into the box. Sometimes, about every 5-10 rounds I do an OAL check.
That said, I offer the following...

My time averages from 60/75 - 100 rounds per hour for handgun calibers on a LCT using the indexing rod. That is going from cleaned & tumbled case to completed round, priming included "on press". I have developed a "system" for each step & once I established that system, the only thing that may slow me down is having to make some adjustment as I go due to my discovering something that I do not like. Example being some lube build up on the seating die stem, making my OAL change slightly & I have to deal with that issue, or whether or not I have to adjust powder throws for some reason or trickle in due to powder type in the measure, etc.. Other than my deciding to stop & take a break, that is how my system works & suits me just fine for the needs I have.


I do my .380ACP on a separate Lyman Truline Jr. turret which I turn by hand, but mostly just like a SS press doing batches in "steps" rather than turning for each round over & over. I also have another Lyman turret, a Spar -T, but have not decided just what caliber to dedicate it to yet. I am thinking .357mag or 44 mag.

For rifle, I use SS presses, either a RCBS R3 or a Lee O-press ( I don't remember the name of it, but it is an older one.)

I also have a convertible up or down Lee C- press for doing odd separate things that help out like testing lead hardness, removing/installing rifle primers, sizing, etc.

I also use a Lee hand press for range duty.

I mentioned them all because while you are looking at the time used which I addressed in the first part of the post, I also wanted to have you be able to consider that adding a press to your line up of any kind can be an asset to your reloading, as well as a possible time saver. So, consider that if you do get a turret, that is is just one more in your "line up" to use when you wish to use it, rather than as just having a single dedicated progressive or turret press & your SS as a "back up".

You can compare the times mentioned above that I use with the extra steps I take, and compare it to the ones who are achieving 100-150+ per hour on their turrets. No one of us is doing anything wrong, just different. I would like to gain some speed, but I do not wish to give up any of my personal "checks" I perform on each round. ( Yes, I am "that" picky & concerned for safety, but that is another story... )

Anyway, I just wanted to offer a bit different viewpoint to add to your decision making process.

Lastly, I am thinking that you are likely going to want to jump to a progressive to do what you want, considering your description of your shooting & some of your lifestyle, "family/kids etc."... You can go with a auto indexing turret first & keep the cost down & progress to a progressive in the future if it seems more necessary to keep up & either keep the turret & just get another press, or sell the turret/ gift it away, etc.. If you jump to progressive, then you will likely fulfill your needs for a time until you decide you want to add another caliber & depending on which progressive you have chosen, may have to either get a turret, or another progressive if the progressive press you start with is a single caliber type.

You can likely tell that I chose "my" path, by going with turret from single stage & now I will next have to decide if I want to get into a progressive, but I do not shoot in regular competitions, so as of yet the need "for me" is not there.

You, on the other hand, have a "different path" than mine, so your needs will be different as well.

G'Luck! on whatever you decide! I hope I helped ya out like the others...

[dtknowles]

Going from a single stage to a turret won't buy you much time. If you want to load in volume you need a progressive. The benefit I see with a turret press is you don't have to change dies as often. I keep a couple sets of rifle dies setup in my turret press. I load my 9mm and 357 mag. in a lee progressive. Swapping die sets in the progressive is quick and easy if you don't change bullets or load.

Tim

[cat-mechanic]

I didn't see a turret as a benefit to me over a single stage. I thought the concept seemed beneficial and you might gain some increase in speed. But overall, I believe you would be best served by a progressive.

For me, I went with a Dillon 550.

[Gtrubicon]

Don’t dismiss a turret press, I have lots of press’s, including a Dillon 650, once you find your system a turret press is in a whole different league than a single stage, very consistent product.

[44Blam]

I was not going to comment on this topic, but I am happy to see it has not devolved into a "this press" vs "this press" vs "this press" P-ing contest topic. I also did not participate in the poll, as I do not currently use a progressive. I also weigh each & every charge thrown, throw powder from a separate measure not attached to the press, as well as I use a "Go-NoGO" check each & every round as it is put into the box. Sometimes, about every 5-10 rounds I do an OAL check.
That said, I offer the following...

My time averages from 60/75 - 100 rounds per hour for handgun calibers on a LCT using the indexing rod. That is going from cleaned & tumbled case to completed round, priming included "on press". I have developed a "system" for each step & once I established that system, the only thing that may slow me down is having to make some adjustment as I go due to my discovering something that I do not like. Example being some lube build up on the seating die stem, making my OAL change slightly & I have to deal with that issue, or whether or not I have to adjust powder throws for some reason or trickle in due to powder type in the measure, etc.. Other than my deciding to stop & take a break, that is how my system works & suits me just fine for the needs I have.


I do my .380ACP on a separate Lyman Truline Jr. turret which I turn by hand, but mostly just like a SS press doing batches in "steps" rather than turning for each round over & over. I also have another Lyman turret, a Spar -T, but have not decided just what caliber to dedicate it to yet. I am thinking .357mag or 44 mag.

For rifle, I use SS presses, either a RCBS R3 or a Lee O-press ( I don't remember the name of it, but it is an older one.)

I also have a convertible up or down Lee C- press for doing odd separate things that help out like testing lead hardness, removing/installing rifle primers, sizing, etc.

I also use a Lee hand press for range duty.

I mentioned them all because while you are looking at the time used which I addressed in the first part of the post, I also wanted to have you be able to consider that adding a press to your line up of any kind can be an asset to your reloading, as well as a possible time saver. So, consider that if you do get a turret, that is is just one more in your "line up" to use when you wish to use it, rather than as just having a single dedicated progressive or turret press & your SS as a "back up".

You can compare the times mentioned above that I use with the extra steps I take, and compare it to the ones who are achieving 100-150+ per hour on their turrets. No one of us is doing anything wrong, just different. I would like to gain some speed, but I do not wish to give up any of my personal "checks" I perform on each round. ( Yes, I am "that" picky & concerned for safety, but that is another story... )

Anyway, I just wanted to offer a bit different viewpoint to add to your decision making process.

Lastly, I am thinking that you are likely going to want to jump to a progressive to do what you want, considering your description of your shooting & some of your lifestyle, "family/kids etc."... You can go with a auto indexing turret first & keep the cost down & progress to a progressive in the future if it seems more necessary to keep up & either keep the turret & just get another press, or sell the turret/ gift it away, etc.. If you jump to progressive, then you will likely fulfill your needs for a time until you decide you want to add another caliber & depending on which progressive you have chosen, may have to either get a turret, or another progressive if the progressive press you start with is a single caliber type.

You can likely tell that I chose "my" path, by going with turret from single stage & now I will next have to decide if I want to get into a progressive, but I do not shoot in regular competitions, so as of yet the need "for me" is not there.

You, on the other hand, have a "different path" than mine, so your needs will be different as well.

G'Luck! on whatever you decide! I hope I helped ya out like the others...

This is why I really like this message board. There is so much knowledge here and people really like to talk about what they do and most of it is from experience and / or learning from others.

Thanks!

[bullseye67]

Good evening,

This is a topic I really like to discuss with our club members. It is kind of like religion and politics......seems every one has an opinion and they are right!!

As a dedicated Bullseye League shooter, shooting about 20K rounds a year in 32 S&W Long and 5-6K in 45ACP. I have and use all types of presses.

I have a dedicated Progressive(LEE LOADMASTER) for loading 32’s on. Runs absolutely flawless and my reloads consistently score better than several of the factory brands I have tried. I don’t switch caliber on it. I had it dedicated to 38’s when I used a Model 52 and a K-14. 45ACP I load on a LCT. Works as slick as can be. Obviously slower than a progressive but way faster than a SS. I also have turrets set op with dies for, 32, 9mm, 38, 357, 44 special and Magnum and 45 Colt. I also have the AutoDrum powder measure and a bunch of drums all set for the loads I use in each caliber. I can load 200 45ACP and remove the powder measure empty the powder and switch the drum to the 9mm and fill with the right powder. Install the 9mm turret, small primer arm and start loading however many I need in about 5 minutes.

I also have the Turrets set up for 223, 308, 30-06 and 303 British. I shoot all cast boolits and with the 4 hole turret. I can load as a SS or as a turret. With most of my old military rifles I have worked out a load that gets as good of accuracy as the rifles can deliver. We shoot a lot of 50 and 100 yard off hand at bowling pins and round 8” plates. So the ability to load up 500 308 or 303 sometimes both in a couple of evenings makes LCT an awful handy machine.

I also use a SS and an Arbor press to load long range Ammo for rifles like 260 Rem, 6.5x 47Lapua and 6mmBR Ext. I have tried to load rounds on the Turret press but I can’t get the same results as I can with batch loading with SS and bullet seating with an Arbor press. It also takes 2 of us working at different stages to get 50-60 rounds an hour. Mostly slowed down by using a AND scale with auto drop and auto trickler. But most of those rounds are 1/2MOA or better all the way to 1000 yards.

To sum it up, I would get a LCT as my first press and get good at making the best possible Ammo I could for a single caliber. Then branch out to other styles of presses and reloading. You may find that a LCT might do 99% of what you need. Several of the league members load only with 2 presses. One progressive or turret set up for their high volume load and a turret or SS for the lower round count.

The best part of what we do is choice!!!

Make a choice and if you aren’t happy choose again. Just like ice cream....there’s no bad choice only different flavors of GOOD!!!

[Spector]

[QUOTE=Three44s;4619810]I could not vote either as I have and use examples of each category as well.

A big shout out for the LCT. I did retire it from my accuracy rifle work however as I saw the turret tipping a small amount on sizing and seating
__________________________________________________ ________________

I understand your concern. Since the Lee turrets are fully supported what l chose to do was to simply hold the turret against it's top limit.

I think l used a long 5/16" bolt and cut the head off so it was the same lenght as the square shaft that advances the turret. I screwed a square nut on it. It causes the turret press to function as a single stage without having to buy a single stage. I put a spring above the square nut that bears against the turret forcing it against it's upper limit. You can finger rotate the bolt which will advance the nut further into the square recess in the bottom of the turret increasing the upward pressure on the turret. You can eliminate all of the tipping of the turret using this method.

A large portion of the round bolt is unthreaded so it does not wear on the nylon piece that normally advances the turret. I would imagine you could just screw a 2nd square nut on the standard Lee part and lock it into place in line with the lower nut. Both nuts will fit into the square recess n the turret now. File or grind the top nut until the turret will just drop into place and rotate without binding.

That will absolutely minimise the tipping of the turret when operating it as an automatic indexing turret press. Use the round bolt and turn it until the nut and spring are holding the turret tight in it's uppermost limit when you want zero tipping using it as a single stage press without having to purchass a 2nd press.

Mike

[Three44s]

Mike,

Thanks for that tip!

A friend and fellow member assured me he checked his run out of his loaded ammo and watched the turret and the runout was fine and that in fact the turret rises to the top of the press head on each stroke. I still have my doubts.

A good example was a few minutes ago I just finished loading some 223 for one of my bolt guns for coyotes. I seated the jacketed bullets using a Hornady New Dimension seater die. I use a technique I learned many years ago from Rick Jameson who wrote a handloading column in Shooting Times.

The technique involves just barely starting the bullet, rotating the cartridge approximately 120 to 180 degrees and just barely seating the bullet ever so slightly deeper, and rotating again and pushing the bullet “home” to it’s desired seating depth.

I feel the New Dimension seater with it’s sliding bullet guide gives me an advantage over other traditional seating dies and yet I can measure less run out with my loaded ammo by adding the Jameson technique.

Here is where I depart from my friend’s assertion about the Lee Classic Turret leveling off during bullet seating.

I find that the Jameson technique works far better as the bullet is seated ever so shallow in the mouth of the case. The deeper it is already seated, the harder it is to affect the misalignment. Now it is logical that the greater the force of the ram acting on the turret, the more reliably the turret will level off.

But it is at relatively light force levels that a bullet begins to enter the case mouth. Especially with a boat tail as I was loading tonight.

By the time the force level rises to the point the turret will be uniformly seated at the top of it’s raceway, the bullet misalignment will be “baked in” to the just seated round.

That is why your system is interesting because it works around the above problem.

Thank you much!

Three44s

[Three44s]

44Blam,

I load my share of 44 Mag as well but I learned to live with thrown charges early on.

I do not know what you are loading for powders but I suggest you think about adapting to thrown charges to a greater degree. I know you are being safety and acccuracy conscious but the right charge level or switching powders in some instances will get you to a better place.

Here is what I do:

I load and shoot several power levels in the 44 Mag. Powders that throw less accurately are either loaded at more modest levels or are shelved and not used.

A good example is Unique .... it is a grand powder but is a pity to throw. A lot of manuals suggest loading into the 10 gr range pushing a 250 gr boolit. Now a small error with a thrown charge of Unique will get you into the red zone from there. What I do is use Unique the way Skeeter Skelton did. I load it at 8.5 gr and even with a powder measure swing of a few tenths there is no way I can get in trouble. If I want more power than the Skelton load produces, I switch powders.

My powder I switch to is HS-6 and there are few powders that will meter better. I use the Hodgdon’s #26 manual load range for 250 gr lead of 10-12 grs. and settled on 11.8 gr for my magnum revolvers.

This gives me a very accurate load that is authoritative on the front end but mannerly on the back end and beats Unique at this power level without the risk of an overcharge such as Unique presents when you push it.

For my 2400 loading I load mostly at 20.0 gr and find throwing there to be reasonable as well. If I want more juice I would likely weight the charges above that.

Now full house and addressing H110/WW296. These powders are like HS-6 in that they throw very well. I could see angst but weighting at intervals should suffice. I uses the business end of an unsharpened (new) pencil to measure a block ful of freshly charged cases waiting to have boolits seated.

Measure the powder level on a couple of properly charged cases and take a sharp pocket knife and make a shallow scoring mark around the wood of the pencil at the mouth of the case.

This pencil becomes your “dip stick” for that load.

Sorry for the thread hijack!

Three44s

[Moleman-]

I've owned all three press types and currently have one of each. If one were to go, once again I'd get rid of the turret press and keep my single stage and progressive presses. Even without a case feeder or bullet feeder you'll be easily able to hit 400-500 rnds an hour and likely more if you prep everything well or get the case and/or bullet feeders. I also 2nd using powders that will meter well enough through your measure (within a tenth or if a larger case on up to two tenths of a grain) so that you don't have to trickle.

[Domino300]

I hate screwing dies in and out. Have 2 LCT's and a rockchucker in a box somewhere. With 19 four hole turrets set up with dies ready to go. I don't shoot competition, so just reload whenn I need to. My usage is to resize/decap and bell for handgun cases, and tumble them, hand prime or press prime later, and powder charge with a RCBS Chargemaster , then seat and crimp. It fits for me.