Swiss K11 and 96/11

[abunaitoo]

Took them out this weekend to try some reloads.
Had problems with chambering in the K11, but not the 96/11.
I always thought they used the same cases.

[uscra112]

I don't know K11s, but it's been known for quite a while that die sets made for the '96 rifles overwork K31 brass. The older chamber being marginally smaller, apparently. Some one else will doubtless know more. I finally got a Redding set that's right for my K31s, and stopped thinking about it.

https://forums.gunboards.com/showthr...Reloading-Dies

There's also an issue with throats. The K31 has a pretty short one, (again - K11 I don't know) so if you were seating out for the 1896 you might have been running into that.

[abunaitoo]

At first I thought the boolet was seated out to far, but it was holding up in the case.
I tried a fired case from the 96/11 in the K11 and it wouldn't chamber.
I know the 1889 case was different from the others, and the K31 has a short lead.
I'm almost sure the cases were full length sized.
Odd.

[mwells72774]

I’ve run across that before as well. I used a lightly modified shell holder and got the same case to work in both rifles

[WehrmannsGeweher]

The chambers are different.
Hornady makes correct die sets for each.
NOE has a specific boolet to address the K31 throat.
180 gr, the plain base works great for me.



As shown here the RCBS dies are for the earlier chamber not the K31

[abunaitoo]

All I have are the Lee dies.
Cases are Graf.
I'll have to try and resize them again.

[uscra112]

Obviously, try a sized but empty case.

I was using a tapered bullet from an Eagan mould. Worked very well, I think because mine has some throat wear.

[WehrmannsGeweher]

The Lee dies will work but they oversize the brass if you FL size. Lee is now making a collet die which makes sense.

[uscra112]

Somebody somewhere pointed out that you have to body size at least a little, because the straight pull action hasn't got the power to fully close the bolt on a case that's a tight fit. Like semi-autos. I'm thinking that, if you use the collet die, you ought to "plunk test" every case like the 1911 reloaders do, although not for the same reason.

[abunaitoo]

Probably will have to full size.
Cases are used in three different rifles.
1911, 96/11, K11.
Also have Vetterli, 1889, K31, but those have different loads.
I'm almost sure I only neck sized for the last three.
Must go back and try again.
Even cases fired in the 96/11, didn't chamber in the K11.

[WehrmannsGeweher]

FL resizing for quality straight pulls and semi autos is a myth born of sloppy M-1 chambers. I use neck sizing dies in my Swiss rifles and Bennlli R1s. Precision rifles with clean ammo work just fine. Even my ARs run happily w/o FL sizing if your gas system is properly set up.

Cases are segregated by rifles just as done with any rifle regardless of action type.

[uscra112]

FL resizing for quality straight pulls and semi autos is a myth born of sloppy M-1 chambers. I use neck sizing dies in my Swiss rifles and Bennlli R1s. Precision rifles with clean ammo work just fine. Even my ARs run happily w/o FL sizing if your gas system is properly set up.

Cases are segregated by rifles just as done with any rifle regardless of action type.

That, maybe, and trainloads of .30-30 Winchesters. Not that I have any first-hand knowledge, I'm not a Winchester fanboi, but FL sizing .30-30 for leverguns has been a thing since as far back as my collection of American Rifleman goes, which is to say the 1920s. I even have a set of .30-30 smallbase dies.

I've read often enough that .303 Enfields are also chambered large, to allow for dirty ammo, supposedly.

[WehrmannsGeweher]

Have you tried segregating your 30-30 brass by rifle ? Tried "reasonable" loads ? Tried not FL sizing ? Is your headspace correct ?

I've owned a 64, 2 94s, a 336 and a 99 in 30-30, none ever required FL sizing when stoked with CB loads or J bullet suggested loads until after 5 reloads. Even then I just did it before uniforming, trimming, annealing and chamfering to start on a clean slate.

As for SMLEs and Ross 303s both benefit greatly by neck sizing. P-14s have tighter chambers.