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Thread: 44 special vs 45ACP

  1. #1
    Boolit Grand Master tazman's Avatar
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    44 special vs 45ACP

    I have been sitting here thinking and wondering about something and came up with a question I haven't seen asked on this site. It may not interest everyone but here goes.

    44 Special vs 45 ACP
    Both fired in revolvers with the same length barrel. Both suitably accurate and using as close to the same weight boolits/bullets as possible. Both using standard pressure loadings, no +P.
    Using the revolvers gives each cartridge the ability to use identical bullet/boolit types and nose configurations so we won't be comparing apples and oranges.
    I am thinking in terms of normal/nominal projectile weights, not heavy for caliber even though I know that is a possibility with this setup.

    Would one of them be significantly better for hunting/self defense than the other or are they so close as to be nearly indistinguishable?


    I haven't done anything with a 44 special since the mid 1990s and can't remember much about the cartridge other than I liked it.

  2. #2
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    Without doing research, and looking at a bunch of minor details or hair splitting-- they are rather similar.

    The main difference was the .44 with it's rim was made and evolved for revolvers.

    The .45ACP came along for automatics, and was sort of adapted to fit in revolvers.

    For hunting, I'd think whichever one was faster for the boolit weights would do a little better,
    even if it wasn't enough to notice. I'm a big 1911 guy, but I do like the idea of a rim more
    than headspacing on the case mouth.
    Last edited by Winger Ed.; 03-24-2019 at 12:16 AM.
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  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    I have two of the Charter Arms .44s, one original 3" blue in excellent condition and a more recent stainless with the shrouded 2.5" barrel. The trigger pull on the latter is better. I have looked at trying to find one of the newer ones in .45 acp with its unusual extractor, but I think I will stay with the .44s since the HKS speed loaders and the Quick Strips are so easy to use. I have model 625s to work with the .45 and moon clips. I doubt that a 240-250 grain SWC or RNFP of either caliber delivered to a critical area would show much difference in terminal ballistics.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master

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    Although I perfer the 44 special as a revolver cartridge because it has a rim, I think the 45 acp might have an edge in the ability to be a better stopper because of its larger diameter. Provided both are loaded a factory velocities.
    However, the 44 special can be loaded at higher velocities and pressures then the 45 acp.
    Make mine 44 special.
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  5. #5
    Boolit Master

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    "Standard pressure" for a .44 Special, given the cartridge's age and black powder origins is a bit of a wiggly topic, but assuming a decent modern gun, it is certainly capable of duplicating .45 ACP. Pretty much a wash, really.

    I'd be looking at it from a logistics point of view: Are you also feeding a lot of 1911's? Do you regard moon clips as a royal PITA? How do you feel about Auto Rim brass? Are you looking to download in a .44 Magnum? What molds are you already sitting on?
    WWJMBD?

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    DOR RED BEAR's Avatar
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    As i see it there is very little difference in the two calibers . When used in a hunting or self defense situation i seriously doubt that any difference can be found. The 44 spec was never a black powder cartridge it came out in 1907 as a smokeless powder cartridge. The 45acp was developed in 1905 so almost the exact same time period. The original loadings gave the edge to the 45acp but current loadings are so close that it is pretty much a moot point.

  7. #7
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    Why should you be forced to standard pressure loads in .44SPL ? Use a good SWC or FP over a good charge of 2400 or 4227 in a Modern Made Gun and you have a cartridge/load that will take down most NORTH AMERICAN Game.

    Why limit yourself if you don't have to.
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  8. #8
    Boolit Grand Master tazman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walks View Post
    Why should you be forced to standard pressure loads in .44SPL ? Use a good SWC or FP over a good charge of 2400 or 4227 in a Modern Made Gun and you have a cartridge/load that will take down most NORTH AMERICAN Game.

    Why limit yourself if you don't have to.

    I don't currently, own a 44 of any stripe. Experience has taught me that my wrists cannot handle the recoil of high pressure 44 loads(arthritis).
    Also, for personal reasons, I will not load a low pressure cartridge beyond what it is designed to do no matter the gun I will be shooting it in.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master knifemaker's Avatar
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    https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/sel...llistic-tests/

    Go to the above link and check out the tests done on the 45ACP pay close attention to the bottom Winchester loads that had good penetration and expanded to almost a full inch in dia. I doubt you will get a FACTORY 44 SPEC. LOAD to do that due to the lower velocity that round is loaded too by the factory. Most of the loads in the links were shot in short barrel guns that are common concealed carry guns.
    Now if you hand load similar RNFP bullets or SWC type bullets in both calibers, they will be so close in performance for human self defense use that you should not see any difference in performance. Most improvements on revolver-pistol bullets have been made on the calibers that are typical calibers used for self defense. 44 spec. is not one of them. Also a lot of bullets you buy for reloading 44 caliber are geared to the higher velocity you get out of a 44 mag and come up short on expansion in the lower velocity 44 spec. On you tube, there is a test of the 44 special using cast penta style hollow points using very soft lead with 2% tin that preformed very well on expansion in the gel block. The standard round shaped hollow point were a failure on expansion loaded the same as the Penta style cast lead bullet. The alloy was 97% soft lead with 2% tin and powder coated to prevent leading in the barrel. A charter arms bulldog was the revolver used in the tests.
    Before I retired from law enforcement, I was a firearms instructor and for the past 20 years have tried to stay current on bullet performance in self defense shootings. There has been some big strides made in the past 5-6 years that have influenced many law enforcement departments on what ammo they supply their officers.

  10. #10
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    Cartridges are basically a wash, in terms of comparison. For me the choice was logistical. I don't own anything chambered in 45 ACP. However, I do have firearms chambered in 44 Magnum/44 Special. Therefore, I already had the dies, moulds and appropriate powder.

    Winelover

  11. #11
    Boolit Master
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    It seems to me with similar cast boolits not much difference score 45 to 43 if you want to use store bought j bullets 45 has much bigger selection designed to work at the velocities you get in this comparison

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
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    Did a lot of shooting in the 1980s with the .44 Special before switching over to .41 Magnum. The .44 is really all one needs in terms of hunting/target/self-defense as it can be loaded to a level to take care of any kind of business. Also the specialty companies have loads that can be used in any modern revolver.

    Have owned several .45 ACP revolvers over the years. Couple of 25-2s, Mountain Guns, 625s and a Taurus Tracker. Didn't have any for a while but recently got back a gun I traded off 10 years ago and always kinda regretted...a S&W 625-7 Performance Center...one of the more accurate Smiths I have ever owned.

    Since the S&W revolvers will run any kind of .45 ACP ammo, standard and +P, plus Auto Rim, it makes them a pretty versatile gun. From what I have read many shooters also use the .45 Super in their guns with no ill effects.

    The moon clips aren't too bad to deal with if you get a loading and de-mooning tool.

    Shot some .45 AR from the 625-7 and a 1917 the other day. 7.0 grains of Unique behind:
    MeHic 205 HP
    MeHic 215 Solid
    Lyman/Keith 245 grain
    Standard 255 SWC

    No pressure signs in any of the loads, cases dropped right out and all very accurate.

    If I was just going to have one revolver that had to do everything it would be a S&W Mountain Gun in .45 ACP simply because of the variety of ammo available...

    Bob

  13. #13
    Boolit Grand Master
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    If the bullets are the same construction and weight, then look at the velocities. There is your answer.

    Good points made about availability of factory bullets and that the .44 Spl bullets may be more aimed at the Magnum. But for cast, it boils down to velocity.
    Don Verna


  14. #14
    DOR RED BEAR's Avatar
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    I also will not overload any cartridge. Got myself in trouble when younger and dumber doing this. There are some pretty stout 44spec loads out there. I would be more than comfortable using ether gun. If one floats your boat more than another then go with it. Tazman i know what you mean arthritis ain't no joke.

  15. #15
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    I have a S&W Model 22-4, a Thunder Ranch revolver with a 4" light weight barrel. Action is smooth and slick. It is a .45ACP/AR and shoot it with confidence that it will handle any 2 legged thing that might threaten my health. 230 grain hollow points hit with authority. It lays within 2 feet of me at night on the nightstand. Anyone who break into my house(God forbid) is own his own. Oh by the way, a tomahawk lies even closer between the mattress and the bed frame side rails(last ditch weapon but effective). I would feel just as comfortable with a .44 Special or even a .44-40. I also have a Model 13 and a Colt Detective Special I can call on. My wife has her Model 15 laying within 2 feet of her also. Also within 4 feet of me is a Remington 870 with a 19" barrel, the best defense gun you can have inside a house. My .02 anyway, james

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    I am with Red Bear if I want hot 44 special loads I put them together in 44 mag cases so no chance of them winding up in the wrong gun same with 38/357 the gun choice in this thread would drive the what’s best for me. I do like the smith mod.69 for this power range for an all purpose gun.
    Sorry don’t mean to hijack.

  17. #17
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    Comes down to action type preferred.
    Plenty of loads around 950fps with lead in 2 to 240ish weight range.
    Pick your platform and play.
    .44 would be more versatile but am thinking about picking brass up again myself.
    That was reason I got out of autos some years ago but the bullseye bug has bit me
    lately.

  18. #18
    Boolit Master Drm50's Avatar
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    I have S&W revolvers in 24-29 and 25-2/ 25-5. I don't shoot hot loads and only cast boolits in any of my S&Ws.
    These cartridges loaded to 750-850fps with original weight bullets would preform very close to the same. The 29 down loaded to 44sp doesn't do as well for accuracy as the 24. I find this true when down loading the 41mg for
    S&W 57 too.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master
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    I also agree in that there is no differences between the two cartridges. The two are almost identical in performance. The 44 special was derived from the 44 Russian and it was popular as a target caliber for many years. The 45 ACP sort of supplanted it as a target caliber in the later years. That was mainly due to the availability of ammunition for it at the time.

  20. #20
    Boolit Master Thumbcocker's Avatar
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    A little research will show that there were in fact .44 special cartridges loaded with black powder. If we are talking handloads at standard pressures Power pistol will let you push a 250 grain boolit at 900-950 fps out of a revolver. I spent much time and effort trying to get convertible Ruger .45's to shoot well with .45 colt. The ACP cylinder always shot better but my current flat top .44 specials shoot rings around any ,45 Ruger I ever had. I have a Smith model of 1898 that is just plain nts on accuracy and shoots as well as the .44 specials. In my experience, with current powders and shooting at standard pressures the .44 special would win.
    Paper targets aren't your friends. They won't lie for you and they don't care if your feelings get hurt.

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BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
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