12 Gauge from hell

[Bigbore.729]

No not clays haha. I use that as my starting powder. I'm using Retumbo this time around. Previous load was US869.

[Bigbore.729]

And yes they are 209M primers

[Bigbore.729]

Man, every time I go to test fire it pours... supposed to have a slight chance of rain today but now it changed to thunderstorms all day... bleh

[Bigbore.729]

https://youtu.be/bOZUovYpcWc

1801 FPS 4437 ft-lbs at the muzzle and 130 lbs of recoil. First shouder fired test just gave me a dull headache, this was a little more violent. My head has the same dull pain, but this time I felt more slap on my shoulder. Not bad, no bruising or anything like that but I noticed it on this firing.

[Bigbore.729]

Would definitely not want to shoot this with a stock recoil pad. Load was 200gr of retumbo and 4 gr of clays

[Bigbore.729]

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MOZerYDms-o

12 gauge from hell vs watermelon. Didn't get a center shot but still impressive nonetheless

[Three44s]

Despite the arrows I will surely gather for this post, I suggest that the OP secure a firearm of exponentially greater strength for this endeavor.

In my opinion any break open action simply is not up to the task you have chosen with this cartridge. I am relieved that your HR has not let go yet but would not count on it not to in the near future.

Beyond the firearm strength issue, I caution you about the extreme recoil you are subjecting yourself to. Quite frankly, you need a muzzle break as well as any other recoil suppressant feature you can conjure up to go along to supplement it.

Be safe and best regards

Three44s

[megasupermagnum]

Despite the arrows I will surely gather for this post, I suggest that the OP secure a firearm of exponentially greater strength for this endeavor.

In my opinion any break open action simply is not up to the task you have chosen with this cartridge. I am relieved that your HR has not let go yet but would not count on it not to in the near future.

Beyond the firearm strength issue, I caution you about the extreme recoil you are subjecting yourself to. Quite frankly, you need a muzzle break as well as any other recoil suppressant feature you can conjure up to go along to supplement it.

Be safe and best regards

Three44s

While he is flirting with the upper limits of the H&R, this design has been tested by Ed Hubel to withstand 20,000 PSI without issue. Blowing up the barrel is not going to be the issue, however, frame stretch can be.

That flinch on the other hand, that's a long road to recovery from such a load.

[Three44s]

H&R shotgun frame vs rifle frame, I thought I read that the frames sold as shotguns were not as strong.

Three44s

[megasupermagnum]

H&R 1871 made two frame, the SB1 and SB2. The SB1 was your basic shotgun, pistol calibers, even up to 30-30 Winchester levels. The SB2 was almost identical, except it received more heat treatments to strengthen it for the increased bolt thrust of stronger cartridges.

Technically the Ultra Slug Hunter is neither of those, as it is physically bigger to accommodate the larger diameter barrels. It is only used on the USH and 10 gauge shotguns. It is built to the same strength specifications as the SB2, and can withstand the same pressures.

[oldred]

The SB2 was almost identical, except it received more heat treatments to strengthen it for the increased bolt thrust of stronger cartridges.

It's way more than just heat treatment as the SB1 was basically a malleable iron casting (quite strong however) while the SB2 is a steel alloy.

[megasupermagnum]

It's way more than just heat treatment as the SB1 was basically a malleable iron casting (quite strong however) while the SB2 is a steel alloy.

Both are made of cast steel alloy. The cast iron SB1 is a myth.

[oldred]

No it's not a myth they are mallable iron, I tested this once by grinding on one which is an easy and absolute way of determining an iron casting vs a steel casting, there is no mistaking the difference in the sparks produced. There are no "extra heat treatments" that can magically make a SB1 casting into a SB2 version and it simply doesn't work that way, while there certainly is a difference in heat treating it's due to the difference in the metal alloy used since different metals require different heat treat procedures. Besides there's nothing at all wrong with a mallable iron shotgun receiver since a mallable iron casting is as strong as most mild steels. This is the same type of material used for parts requiring extra strength such as some truck I-beam axles for example and it is not to be confused with the more common and much weaker grey iron that comes to mind when most folks hear "cast iron". A mallable iron casting can be some reasonably strong stuff but not in the same league as 8620 or 4140 alloy steels, for example, which are commonly used in modern receivers.

[megasupermagnum]

Being as H&R is long gone, I guess we will never know for sure.

It doesn't matter anyway, as the Ultra slug hunter is built on a larger SB2 frame.

[oldred]

Being as H&R is long gone, I guess we will never know for sure.

Yes we DO know for sure!

Not only is it common knowledge but as I said I actually saw it for myself, about three years ago a buddy damaged the ends of the threads of the stock tang screw hole in the receiver of a H&R shotgun he had been working on. Due to the damaged threads at the start of the hole the bolt would not start correctly so I simply took a grinder and lightly ground a few thousandths off of the top of the bolt hole to remove the bad threads and square up the end of the hole so the screw would start correctly. I already knew the receiver was an iron casting and it came as no surprise that the sparks produced by the grinder confirmed this, there is no mistaking those short bursting sparks when grinding on an iron casting! Anyone who is the least bit familiar with metals can easily tell the difference between iron castings and steel! Besides as I already said it's common knowledge and has been for many years.

[Bigbore.729]

Sb1 frames are definitely iron. I know this from grind tests and it is 100% iron. The SB2 and ultra slug and 10 gauge receivers are some sort of steel

[oldred]

10 gauge receivers are some sort of steel

That's interesting, in the past I have owned two of the 36" barrel versions of the H&R 10 ga. and have sorely missed them, still kicking myself for letting them go! I didn't know what the 10 ga. receivers were cast from, never thought about it one way or the other back then, but learning they were steel just makes me even more ticked off for letting them get away!

[Bigbore.729]

I have one I dubbed thumper. I cut and tapered the barrel down to 20". They are getting hard to find now for a reasonable price.

[Bigbore.729]

https://youtu.be/lihRfD9jqfE

My grandpa and uncle got their first taste of the 12 gauge from hell. No chrono readings as it was raining and they wanted to shoot it, but they were definitely above 1500 fps from the way it felt. Have 2 more cartridges with the same load to test.

[oldred]

Call me crazy but even at 158 lbs and over 70 years old I would love to take a chance with shooting that thing! I have always had a fascination with big bores with heavy loads but as of now I just stay content with my pipsqueak (compared to that thing!) 45-90s.