.45-70 at Two Miles: The Sandy Hook Tests of 1879

[EDG]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/843705/posts

[woodbutcher]

Have read this report before.Still most interesting.Thanks for posting.
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo

[Hossfly]

Wow a lot happens in 20 secs. Even the earth rotates from under that boolit. That’s just amazing that any thing could be hit at that distance.

[rfd]

interesting reading, of sorts. none of that has any reality relevance for me and my bpcr/tr shooting or guns.

[John in PA]

Extremely interesting to see the lengths (pun intended!) that the Ordnance Department went to in experimenting with the .45-70 to find best bullet design.

This quote from the article "These tests were made at the request of the Chief of Ordnance. His interest had been aroused by reports of long range infantry fire, up to 1½ miles, during the1877-78 Turko-Russian War. " was provoked by the following event. The Turks used calculated long-range fire from their Peabody-Martinis, chambered for the .45 Turkish cartridge, to hold the Russians and Romanians out of Plevna for over 5 months, despite overwhelming numbers of enemy soldiers. That, coupled with murderous fire at short range from Model 1866 Winchesters, makes this story quite a tale!

(Note: Corrected my original dead link below. Militaryrifles.com, for many years the best informational website on military blackpowder cartridge rifles of the world, seems to be out, or on the fritz. I pulled it from a web archiving service. If there's info you want to save from the site, I'd suggest copying and pasting while you still can!)

https://web.archive.org/web/20180813...evnaDelay.html

[EDG]

The report does indicate that the rifling twist used was sufficient to keep the bullets hitting points first.
In spite of this information though, some shooters still claim that they do not have the proper twist to stabilize their bullets for best accuracy at a mere 1000 yards.

[indian joe]

The report does indicate that the rifling twist used was sufficient to keep the bullets hitting points first.
In spite of this information though, some shooters still claim that they do not have the proper twist to stabilize their bullets for best accuracy at a mere 1000 yards.

It is possible those "some shooters" you take aim at know their business ....the 525 grain military roundnose is a very stable piece of lead but there are a swag of pointy nose boolits that will eat it for trajectory -and I did read some stuff about angle of re-entry that make the GG roundnose out of a 45/70 a dodgy proposition at 1000 yards (safety wise in the target zone - as in lob shots coming in on too steep of an angle - dont know for sure but it makes sense based on my experience at home shooting at 600 and 700 yards)

[rfd]

The report does indicate that the rifling twist used was sufficient to keep the bullets hitting points first.
In spite of this information though, some shooters still claim that they do not have the proper twist to stabilize their bullets for best accuracy at a mere 1000 yards.

what indian joe said - bullets hitting a real long range target face with their nose is one thing, bullets hitting dead center of that target consistently is totally another matter.

[R.FO]

I had read some info on this a few years back, I'll look for it and post if I find it

[EDG]

It is also possible that blaming a twist calculator is just an excuse for the lack of real testing on the shooter's part. How many decades are they going to beat around the bush so to speak? The so called hot shots are only a few test barrels from proving their theory or proving they are just not the shooters they think they are.
Some shooters readily admit that they do their load testing at matches. Shooters continually jack around with bullets and other features of their loads confusing the results with extra variables. Pick out a text on "Designed Experiments" if you want to know how to research a process logically. But don't blame a twist calculator for your own lack of research. The twist calculator is not responsible for picking your bullets, barrels and powder charges.

It is possible those "some shooters" you take aim at know their business ....the 525 grain military roundnose is a very stable piece of lead but there are a swag of pointy nose boolits that will eat it for trajectory -and I did read some stuff about angle of re-entry that make the GG roundnose out of a 45/70 a dodgy proposition at 1000 yards (safety wise in the target zone - as in lob shots coming in on too steep of an angle - dont know for sure but it makes sense based on my experience at home shooting at 600 and 700 yards)

[WehrmannsGeweher]

Sandy Hook - ironic

[indian joe]

It is also possible that blaming a twist calculator is just an excuse for the lack of real testing on the shooter's part. How many decades are they going to beat around the bush so to speak? The so called hot shots are only a few test barrels from proving their theory or proving they are just not the shooters they think they are.
Some shooters readily admit that they do their load testing at matches. Shooters continually jack around with bullets and other features of their loads confusing the results with extra variables. Pick out a text on "Designed Experiments" if you want to know how to research a process logically. But don't blame a twist calculator for your own lack of research. The twist calculator is not responsible for picking your bullets, barrels and powder charges.

Looks like youre hell bent on arguing this with someone - I'll pass - thanks all the same