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Thread: Question on John 3:3

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    Question on John 3:3

    Jesus told Nicodemus that a man must be born from above ( or again; as the greek word can be translated either way) in order for the person to see the kingdom of God. Is a person unable to see spiritual matters and therefore blind to what seems so obvious to those of us who are believers? It seems so plain to me that all abortion is murder and that those who engage in it will stand before the Living God and give account for their actions; yet millions see it as no big deal.
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    Boolit Master tinhorn97062's Avatar
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    Yes.

    2Cor 4:4

    But every single person has had the law of God written on their heart- our conscience- (Rom 2:14-15) and we know right from wrong. After continually yielding to “wrong”, we eventually become calloused and blind. Enter the Scripture from 2 Cor 4 above.
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  3. #3
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmitty View Post
    Jesus told Nicodemus that a man must be born from above ( or again; as the greek word can be translated either way) in order for the person to see the kingdom of God. Is a person unable to see spiritual matters and therefore blind to what seems so obvious to those of us who are believers? It seems so plain to me that all abortion is murder and that those who engage in it will stand before the Living God and give account for their actions; yet millions see it as no big deal.
    A case could be made for karma (law of cause and effect) and reincarnation from that passage.
    There are other Bible passages that also tend to support it.

    We are accountable for our actions and do not get to "heaven" until we clear the slate of our misdoings.
    Rebirth (reincarnation) gives us the vehicle for being accountable and changing our ways, etc. "...Be ye perfect..."
    "...You reap what you sow..."
    "...Live by the sword, die by the sword..."

  4. #4
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    In the immediate context of "You must be born again", Nicodemus had missed the fact that Jesus was more than just a Rabbi. This was not an inability to know right from wrong. I assume Nicodemus knew right from wrong as THE teacher of Israel. Nicodemus was also well aware of the coming Messiah. But after coming face to face with Jesus, he could not recognize him as the Messiah nor could he recognize the work of God accomplished through John the Baptist and Jesus.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rizzo View Post
    A case could be made for karma (law of cause and effect) and reincarnation from that passage.
    There are other Bible passages that also tend to support it.
    People get reincarnation from that? Perhaps some do but only if they are determined to find support for it because that's certainly not the context in which John 3:3 is given.

    We are accountable for our actions and do not get to "heaven" until we clear the slate of our misdoings.
    Our most common spiritual error is the false idea that man might be able to earn salvation by good deeds; that's just not so! IF any man could possibly "clear (his) slate" by personal effort there was no valid reason for Jesus to sacrifice his own (physical) life. But, we can't do that so He cleaned the slates of those of those who accept and trust Him for our unearned gift of eternal heaven.

    Rebirth (reincarnation) gives us the vehicle for being accountable and changing our ways, etc. "...
    To be spiritually "born again" means reincarnation and accountability? That interpretation could only be true IF we could remember our prior lives and thereby avoid our previous errors; we can't do that.

    Be ye perfect for I am perfect.
    None of us are or ever can be perfect. But, when we are eternally judged, Jesus' own perfect life and record will be imputed to us and that is as perfect as we're ever going to get. In fact, that promise is exactly what the New Testament Gospel (i.e., good news) is about!

    "...Live by the sword, die by the sword..."
    That verse has long been misused to claim that "real Christians" cannot rightly defend the lives of themselves, their families, homes and countries. Read the O.T. records of how fighting back against lethal threats was not only acceptable for His people but much of it was God ordained so that interpretation is obvious nonsense.
    Last edited by 1hole; 03-20-2019 at 02:16 PM.

  6. #6
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    Nicodemus, as one of the leading teachers (Rabbis) of Israel, knew the law forward and backward and was adept in arguing the law. His whole life was based on keeping the law. Paul was the same, a Pharisee of the Pharisees - and read Romans Ch 7 to read his coming to the realization that he was unable to not sin.

    Nicodemus was coming to this same conclusion at the moment as he faced Jesus - he saw the law, his whole life, as hopeless and inadequate.

    This is the context of the verse - read it with this understanding. There is no hint or assumption of reincarnation - that was never on the table.
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  7. #7
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    From the OP as it would pertain to abortion and non believers not seeing what is obvious to believers. I think Phll Robertson has it right. He often explains it as the Lord turning them over to reprobate mind.
    This excerpt is from the Washington Times Jan 29 2019

    He cited Romans 1:28 — how those who fail to “retain God” in their minds will, as a consequence, be given “over to a reprobate mind,” as the Scripture reads. His point? As the people go, so goes the culture; as the culture goes, so go the political systems.
    “Once the electorate goes depraved,” Robertson said, “that begets government officials who are depraved. … If humans do not bow to God, they will fix it so you bow to them.”
    Voila. Enter Big Government. Enter nanny-state governance.
    Enter New York Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and all the socialist do-gooders who promise much — but only by force and control, only by selling an entitlement line to the masses.
    “Unless people begin to understand that nobody owes them anything, this big government thing [will stay],” he warned. “If and until we don’t put God back in schools, I’m afraid it’s going to keep spinning out of control.”
    So Robertson, in 11 brief book chapters, offers a way out of what he describes as the lies that have shrouded Americans’ eyes for far too long. And the time for truth is now, he said. The 11th hour has come.
    “We’ve been on this no-God thing about 60 years,” he said.
    Translation: It’s going to be a tough slog to bring this country back to moral governance, as envisioned by founders, as set forth in the founding documents. It’s going to be a challenge to bring back the bright to America’s light on that hill. But it’s far from impossible, he said.
    “I’m just one man looking at the world through spiritual laws,” Robertson said. “But it’s really not rocket science. It’s about loving God and loving one another.”
    The Golden Rule. Good stuff.

  8. #8
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    Kind of an Ah-Ha moment for ol Nick. As in "All my life I have been understanding it wrong". No reincarnation involved.
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  9. #9
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    In Romans chapter 1 ,there is a progression of the unbeliever. He starts out knowing that through nature there must be a God. Through denying God existance and turning completely away from God then they are turned over to a reprobate mind. With a reprobate mind they can no longer discern spiritual correctness. Then anything is possible. Any political position to them is reasonable.
    The Bible says without the sheading of blood there is no remission (of sin). For our sins to be forgiven we must acknowledge and believe that Jesus' blood was the remission of our sins. If we truly believe then it brings about a change in our actions and belief.
    So abortion to believers is an obvious taking the life of the unborn but to the reprobate mind it is the choice of the mother.

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