reloading 44-40

[robg]

Its no harder to load than any other cartridge ,use pistol primers .

[Baltimoreed]

The actual reloading is no different than a straight walled case except for the thinness of the brass and attention to seating the bullet straight. The other issue is with the shoulder location. There was no one universal dimension that the Winchester ‘dash’ cartridges firearm makers adhered to. So chamber dimension for older guns are all over the place. Kinda think there still are differences. You just need to be aware of this on the chance that the sizer die and your chamber are slightly different so as not to overwork the brass. You don’t want to set the shoulder back and then blow it out constantly. I enjoy my 38-40 Colt New Service and my 44-40 Uberti 1866 and Winchester 73 musket. An added advantage is that the thin brass will seal your chamber so no sooted up brass. Have fun.

[Savvy Jack]

OK,I'll pick up the rifle this week.I'll have to order some starline brass and cowboy dies.I always use powder coated bullets can these be used for 44-40 cases? Thanks or all the good info.

I got your email (private message) and replied but I am not sure it sent.

The 44-40 is not hard to handload as long as you follow a few simple rules.

Outpost's article can be found here:
PART I
https://curtisshawk21.wixsite.com/44...t-history-pt-1

PART II
https://curtisshawk21.wixsite.com/44...t-history-pt-2

Some of his other work can be found on the blog page here:
https://curtisshawk21.wixsite.com/44centerfire/blog

I had to revert back to my standard web address so many links I posted no longer work.

Main Page
https://curtisshawk21.wixsite.com/44centerfire

[Savvy Jack]

Here is a crude but functional video loading Trailboss and the BigLube bullet. My tang gets tungeled up a few times.



A few simple rules in order to get along with the 44-40 handloading process.

Use Starline brass. Starline is not as thin as Winchester which makes it stronger and less likely to crunch the mouth when you might seat a lead bullet a tad too deep and apply a roll crimp. Starline also fits the shell holders as CBC does not like my shell holders.

Remington brass is thicker and stronger but using .429 bullets may prevent the thicker mouth diameter to chamber in tight chambers...mostly revolver chambers.

CBC brass sucks

Stick with pistol primers like Winchester WLP's or CCI-300 primers. They fit the primer pockets with a slight recess to help prevent chain fires in the magtubs of rifles. Rifle primers work fine BUT sit flush with most cases. If the primer pocket is dirty, the primer can extrude past the base and cause a premature ignition in the rifle magtube caused bu the point of a bullet and a nice jolt.

lead bullets crimp better to prevent telescoping down into the case from the magtube spring tension of the rifle. I suggest using Oregon Trail Laser Cast bullets for now. They are a Magma type design. If you already handcast...handcast a lead bullet with a crimp groove for smokeless.

Using smokeless powder, fully resize your brass but use cowboy dies that resize for .429 bullets rather than lee that resizes even more for .427 bullets. This helps to not over work the thin case mouth.

There are only two things that can make you mad. Trying to stuff a .430 bullet into a .427 case and or seating the bullet too deep. When you roll crimp. rather than forcing the mouth into the lead like a 44 magnum or 38 special, the thin mouth is weak and will crumple. This is solved by a few things but the basic is....

First
"44-40" bullets are .427 using Lee 44-40 dies.
"44 Magnum/Special" bullets are .429-430 and need at least 44-40 RCBS "Cowboy" dies. Bellow the mouth just enough to start the bullet by hand. If you have a problem with "bulging" use a 44 mag "M" die that opens the case mouth using a "step" method. It allows the bullet to be guided in straighter.

Second
Lube your brass before resizing. If you don't it can get stuck and scratch you dies. Since I load black powder and have black powder lube, I just keep some on my press and put a little on with my fingers about every third case. IF YOU USE TOO MUCH it will collect inside the die and dent your cases.

[TaylorS]

Awesome thread I may say forget my projects this weekend and fire up the pot and pull my brass out of hiding and try again!

I picked up a Rossi 92 in 44-40 a while back and have shot up what I had found for ammo when I tried to load it I had lots of problems seating bullets since then I got the larger expander just not the time to get out there and see if it still frustrates me.


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[1Hawkeye]

Savvy thats a great tutorial. I have used rem,win,cbc, & hornady brass and agree with your opinion of cbc it just has no flex to it.

[Savvy Jack]

Thanks guys

Below is a link to Driftwood Johnson's post about crumpling the case mouth do to seating the bullet to deep while roll crimping
https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...4&postcount=18

The 44-40 Winchester cases are so thin that they expand and retract easy. If one can force a lead bullet into the case mouth, the case will expand as the bullet is seated, HOWEVER, when the bullet is seated past the base, when the lube grove passes the rim, the mouth will shrink back down into the lube grove...and when the mouth hits the driving band...rather than passing outside the diameter...the case tries to cut through, "shave" the edge but will dig in too deep and crumple the edge.

Attachment 237134

[Good Cheer]

My 44-40's were '73 carbine and '73 single action.
Used the 1970's Lee light weight round nose and their SWC HP, the Lyman #42798 and #429434 (the hefty flat round nose GC).
Great cartridge if you obey it's black powder era rules.

[Savvy Jack]

My 44-40's were '73 carbine and '73 single action.
Used the 1970's Lee light weight round nose and their SWC HP, the Lyman #42798 and #429434 (the hefty flat round nose GC).
Great cartridge if you obey it's black powder era rules.

Its a great cartridge too when using smokeless powder rules

[Savvy Jack]

My 44-40's were '73 carbine and '73 single action.
Used the 1970's Lee light weight round nose and their SWC HP, the Lyman #42798 and #429434 (the hefty flat round nose GC).
Great cartridge if you obey it's black powder era rules.

Here is a few black powder rules for ya!

40gr by volume of Swiss FFG under a Lyman 427098 dumped into original early unheadstamped 1880's semi-balloonhead brass with about a .18" compression of the powder propelled by Winchester WSPM primers from a 20" barrel. 1,373fps @ 14,285 psi

40gr by volume of Goex FFFG under a Lyman 427098 dumped into original early Western headstamped semi-balloonhead brass with about a .18" compression of the powder propelled by Winchester WLP primers from a 20" barrel. 1,356fps @ 12,648 psi

40gr by volume of Swiss FFG under a Lyman 427098 dumped into Starline brass with about a .21" compression of the powder propelled by Winchester WLP primers from a 20" barrel. 1,257fps @ 8,648 psi

4" Groups @ 100 yards

Attachment 237244

[indian joe]

Here is a few black powder rules for ya!

40gr by volume of Swiss FFG under a Lyman 427098 dumped into original early unheadstamped 1880's semi-balloonhead brass with about a .18" compression of the powder propelled by Winchester WSPM primers from a 20" barrel. 1,373fps @ 14,285 psi

40gr by volume of Goex FFFG under a Lyman 427098 dumped into original early Western headstamped semi-balloonhead brass with about a .18" compression of the powder propelled by Winchester WLP primers from a 20" barrel. 1,356fps @ 12,648 psi

40gr by volume of Swiss FFG under a Lyman 427098 dumped into Starline brass with about a .21" compression of the powder propelled by Winchester WLP primers from a 20" barrel. 1,257fps @ 8,648 psi

4" Groups @ 100 yards

Attachment 237244

There is something really interesting going on there with the semi balloon head cases - have you got a theory on what it is ?
I have some Dominion brass around here someplace and when I dig it out - intend to duplicate your experiment (the chronograph part of it - I dont have pressure gear)

[Savvy Jack]

I really don't know yet. Only things I can think of would be a different brass "metals" and or the powder wrapping around the primer as it ignites. Another consideration is the soft lead expanding creating more resistance rather than hard lead sliding. I really have no other ideas

I need to correct one thing though....all black powder tests are by Weight and compressed with a compression die.

[Reverend Al]

I've had a "love / hate" relationship with .44-40 for many years and I currently still have about 5 guns chambered in that cartridge. I love shooting old, traditional calibres in old, original guns, but the thin case mouth / crimping issues with the .44 WCF brass can give you absolute fits until you figure out that cases need to be religiously trimmed all to the same length and that you need to adjust your seating / crimping die to exactly the right setting. Then it's all golden ...

[veeman]

Lee Factory Crimp Die is your friend. I only use my 44-40's in CAS so I've never had to trim them. I find them to be very easy to load.

[Savvy Jack]

I've had a "love / hate" relationship with .44-40 for many years and I currently still have about 5 guns chambered in that cartridge. I love shooting old, traditional calibres in old, original guns, but the thin case mouth / crimping issues with the .44 WCF brass can give you absolute fits until you figure out that cases need to be religiously trimmed all to the same length and that you need to adjust your seating / crimping die to exactly the right setting. Then it's all golden ...

Nah, on cases that are mixed matched lengths, I just keep it set to crimp at 1.300". I have loaded thousands and only crumpled three cases

[Savvy Jack]

Lee Factory Crimp Die is your friend. I only use my 44-40's in CAS so I've never had to trim them. I find them to be very easy to load.

New Starline brass batches I have purchased ranged from 1.297 to 1.300. Other brass from 1.292

Other "crumples" folks have is trying to shove a .430 bullet into a .427 sized mouth. For .430s one needs Cowboy dies rather than Lee dies that resize to a larger diameter. There are roll crimp crumples and there are lead bullet shaving crumples