Help With a TC .50 cal Rifle

[Watcher]

Well back to the drawing board, you guys have given me some homework. I have had that sucker apart at least 5-6 times another go around won't hurt. I even had the breech plug out. This time I am gonna use some new ideas. I will measure from the breech plug face to the flash hole. Then put the breech plug back in and measure from end of barrel to face of breech plug. Then put in 70 gr. black powder and measure again. Then measure my ball and patch and see if somehow I am blocking the flash hole with the ball and patch. I already done every suggestion you guys have given me except that one. I even flashed my powder off on a dry board to make sure it was ok. Thanks again I will be back with my report after this further test.

[scattershot]

Ditto on the above post. Also is it possible that the previous owner forgot to put a powder charge in and just seated a round ball or maxi ball and then just decided it was too much trouble to get it out and sold it that way? I've come across individuals that accidently seated a ball first and didn't realize it until it was too late and I had to pull the patched round ball for them. May be worth running a ball puller down the barrel. Pretty easy to tell if it's hitting metal or lead.

Yep, sounds like a dry ball to me, too.

[DIRT Farmer]

TC made a scraper that fit in the breach plug to clean it out and ream and clean pipe cleaners to clean the flash tube is your friend. A shot of brake cleaner to get all of the oil out of the flash channel helps

[bedbugbilly]

#1 exactlyy what powder and what granulation powder are you using - what does the powder container say?

#2 what brand cap -how old -brand?

If you have a clergies nipple and flash channel - if your breech is clean and not but up with burnt fouling - you should go bang. What powder charge are you using? What is your loading procedure - patched ball - conical - what lube? May sound like silly questions but we have no way of knowing these things or if you are an experienced BP shooter or a beginner - am in no way saying the failure to fire is your fault but please fully describe as the suggestions given above are tried and sure and if you are getting air through the nipple - moving grass when you point muzzle to ground when you snap a cap - you should get reliable ignition. You say it doesn't't fire - are you loading and pulling charge each time? Are you just putting powder down barrel?

[OverMax]

I agree with drago9900 comment.
I once bumped into the same problem some time ago with another's CVA Flintlock. {Non-firing rifle} having breech full of Pyrodex residue. I don't use substitutes so I and He were surprised at the discovery and the amount of ash residue removed. I spade/scraped the breech as best I could and the rifle functioned immediately as it should. Although I tried to get the other feller to shoot anything Black { Groex Swiss } but the individual was reluctant to give up his shooting of Pyrodex RS.~~ Oh well.

[megasupermagnum]

Well back to the drawing board, you guys have given me some homework. I have had that sucker apart at least 5-6 times another go around won't hurt. I even had the breech plug out. This time I am gonna use some new ideas. I will measure from the breech plug face to the flash hole. Then put the breech plug back in and measure from end of barrel to face of breech plug. Then put in 70 gr. black powder and measure again. Then measure my ball and patch and see if somehow I am blocking the flash hole with the ball and patch. I already done every suggestion you guys have given me except that one. I even flashed my powder off on a dry board to make sure it was ok. Thanks again I will be back with my report after this further test.

You had the breech plug out? If you visually saw that there was nothing in the bore, ran something through the flash channel to prove it was clear, and cleared it as well as you say, then it will fire. If there is powder in the flash channel, and fire gets through your nipple, it will fire. You either have a bad/clogged nipple, bad percussion cap, or bad powder. The flash channel is in the back of the breech plug, it is not possible to block with the ball. It can only be one of the three things I mentioned.

Are we even talking about a sidelock here? We still need key details

What gun?
What Powder?
What Cap?

[waksupi]

When you put in the powder, bump the butt on the ground a couple times lightly, or slap the side of the rifle to settle the powder into the chamber. If you aren't using Holy Black, do.

[Watcher]

OK gents finally got back to old Betsy. I been busy as a one legged man in a butt kickin contest all week. See some questions I missed. I use FFg Goex black powder not the substitute. I thought about all you guys said and one of you made me think. So today I got back at it. I measured from the nipple hole to end of barrel. Made that mark on the ram rod. I put ramrod down the pipe as far as it would go and marked that on the ramrod. Got a 2 inch difference. I think the old girl has a ball stuck. 2 inches from the breech plug. I am not about to remove the breech plug. So I dumped down some solvent and removed the nipple and am letting her soak. History on gun. I bought it at an estate sale along with a tc .50 smoothbore which shoots fine and a .50 cal pistol it shoots fine. This gone since I bought it has never fired one time. When it did not fire I pulled my ball and charge changed nipples tried again, still nothing. Pulled ball and charge again cleaned it. Then started asking around my area and did what I could, funny thing is I can blow air through the nipple and get air out the barrel end. I tried gently tapping my ball puller and trying to start it, assuning its a stuck ball and it would not start. When I pulled the ball puller the thread lead was damaged. I think it has to go to the gunsmith? What do you guys think? I really do not want to remove breech plug. The solvent is dripping black out through the nipple port right now, while I scratch my head and have a coffee. Oh another question someone asked how much powder I used, Because I did not know the guns history although it looked fine, I started at 70 gr FFg Goex. But does not matter because I never got it to shoot. Thanks

[Watcher]

You had the breech plug out? If you visually saw that there was nothing in the bore, ran something through the flash channel to prove it was clear, and cleared it as well as you say, then it will fire. If there is powder in the flash channel, and fire gets through your nipple, it will fire. You either have a bad/clogged nipple, bad percussion cap, or bad powder. The flash channel is in the back of the breech plug, it is not possible to block with the ball. It can only be one of the three things I mentioned.

Are we even talking about a sidelock here? We still need key details

What gun?
What Powder?
What Cap?

Sorry I thought I mentioned it is a TC .50 Renegade percussion. I use FFg Goex, and upgrade the percussion caps to magnum as well.

[Watcher]

When you put in the powder, bump the butt on the ground a couple times lightly, or slap the side of the rifle to settle the powder into the chamber. If you aren't using Holy Black, do.

Thanks

[Watcher]

#1 exactlyy what powder and what granulation powder are you using - what does the powder container say?

#2 what brand cap -how old -brand?

If you have a clergies nipple and flash channel - if your breech is clean and not but up with burnt fouling - you should go bang. What powder charge are you using? What is your loading procedure - patched ball - conical - what lube? May sound like silly questions but we have no way of knowing these things or if you are an experienced BP shooter or a beginner - am in no way saying the failure to fire is your fault but please fully describe as the suggestions given above are tried and sure and if you are getting air through the nipple - moving grass when you point muzzle to ground when you snap a cap - you should get reliable ignition. You say it doesn't't fire - are you loading and pulling charge each time? Are you just putting powder down barrel?

OK thanks I think I answered down the thread. I used a lubed patch, .490 round ball, 70 gr of FFg Goex, I only tried it twice and pulled my ball and dumped the charge on the ground both times. I only tried it twice because I knew I had something wrong. I went and got magnum caps and a new nipple for the 2nd shot. Still did not work.

[LAGS]

If you think there is a ball stuck, and a pulling Jag wont start in the ball, have you tried to replace the Nipple with a Zerk Fitting and try to pump it out with a Greese Gun.
I had a couple of Muzzle loaders that the nipple was the same 1/4" thread as a common Zerk Fitting.
It worked.

[wildwilly501]

I'm following this thread out of curiosity if it damaged the thread on a bullet puller have to wonder what they rammed down there.Let us know and Good Luck

[Watcher]

If you think there is a ball stuck, and a pulling Jag wont start in the ball, have you tried to replace the Nipple with a Zerk Fitting and try to pump it out with a Greese Gun.
I had a couple of Muzzle loaders that the nipple was the same 1/4" thread as a common Zerk Fitting.
It worked.

Never heard tell of that, but I am game to try. As long as the zerk is the same thread.

[Watcher]

I'm following this thread out of curiosity if it damaged the thread on a bullet puller have to wonder what they rammed down there.Let us know and Good Luck

Well I bought it at a estate sale, who knows whether a charge was left in it or somebody screwed with it at the sale. Wish I had a small bore scope to take a look. But air is getting past what ever it is when I take out the nipple and blow compressed air down the nipple hole.

[megasupermagnum]

The thread is 1/4-28, a common zerk size.

[JBinMN]

Well back to the drawing board, you guys have given me some homework. I have had that sucker apart at least 5-6 times another go around won't hurt. I even had the breech plug out. This time I am gonna use some new ideas. I will measure from the breech plug face to the flash hole. Then put the breech plug back in and measure from end of barrel to face of breech plug. Then put in 70 gr. black powder and measure again. Then measure my ball and patch and see if somehow I am blocking the flash hole with the ball and patch. I already done every suggestion you guys have given me except that one. I even flashed my powder off on a dry board to make sure it was ok. Thanks again I will be back with my report after this further test.

OK gents finally got back to old Betsy. I been busy as a one legged man in a butt kickin contest all week. See some questions I missed. I use FFg Goex black powder not the substitute. I thought about all you guys said and one of you made me think. So today I got back at it. I measured from the nipple hole to end of barrel. Made that mark on the ram rod. I put ramrod down the pipe as far as it would go and marked that on the ramrod. Got a 2 inch difference. I think the old girl has a ball stuck. 2 inches from the breech plug. I am not about to remove the breech plug. So I dumped down some solvent and removed the nipple and am letting her soak. History on gun. I bought it at an estate sale along with a tc .50 smoothbore which shoots fine and a .50 cal pistol it shoots fine. This gone since I bought it has never fired one time. When it did not fire I pulled my ball and charge changed nipples tried again, still nothing. Pulled ball and charge again cleaned it. Then started asking around my area and did what I could, funny thing is I can blow air through the nipple and get air out the barrel end. I tried gently tapping my ball puller and trying to start it, assuning its a stuck ball and it would not start. When I pulled the ball puller the thread lead was damaged. I think it has to go to the gunsmith? What do you guys think? I really do not want to remove breech plug. The solvent is dripping black out through the nipple port right now, while I scratch my head and have a coffee. Oh another question someone asked how much powder I used, Because I did not know the guns history although it looked fine, I started at 70 gr FFg Goex. But does not matter because I never got it to shoot. Thanks

No skin off my ***, one way or the other, but it seems to me , that if I pulled the breech plug, as per your post #21, I would look at the bbl. from the breech end to the muzzle to see if there was anything I wanted to do while I had it out. Looking for a clear tube to the sky & making sure there was no obstruction in the bbl near the flashhole & breech end & even all the way to the muzzle, before I re installed the breech plug.
Like remove an obstruction like a seated ball, corrosion, carbon deposits, etc, or something along those lines...

Then later, as per post #28, if I decided I did not want to pull the breech plug, "Again", since I already checked it...( and would have cleared any obstruction), I would not have to go thru any other process to deal with a plugged bore, and would be working on trying to fire the firearm again with a now verified as "clear" & "unplugged" bbl..

--------------

Not my business, but something in the translation as per the above, is not working for me...

Perhaps I misunderstood.

NO matter to me, it is Your firearm...

Hope you get things all figured out. G'Luck!

[Watcher]

No skin off my ***, one way or the other, but it seems to me , that if I pulled the breech plug, as per your post #21, I would look at the bbl. from the breech end to the muzzle to see if there was anything I wanted to do while I had it out. Looking for a clear tube to the sky & making sure there was no obstruction in the bbl near the flashhole & breech end & even all the way to the muzzle, before I re installed the breech plug.
Like remove an obstruction like a seated ball, corrosion, carbon deposits, etc, or something along those lines...

Then later, as per post #28, if I decided I did not want to pull the breech plug, "Again", since I already checked it...( and would have cleared any obstruction), I would not have to go thru any other process to deal with a plugged bore, and would be working on trying to fire the firearm again with a now verified as "clear" & "unplugged" bbl..

--------------

Not my business, but something in the translation as per the above, is not working for me...

Perhaps I misunderstood.

NO matter to me, it is Your firearm...

Hope you get things all figured out. G'Luck!

I am very sorry, I was confused, I never had the breech plug out. I meant the nipple. Excuse my old addled brain at times.. I get mixed up. If I had the breech plug out I most certainly would have drove the stuck ball out. Honest to G...D I swear since I passed 70 my brain malfunctions now and then. No I don't have the equipment to remove the breech plug with out possibly wrecking something. Just me, my brain jumped a cog again.

[pietro]

.

A special breechplug wrench would be needed to remove a T/C renegade/Hawken breechplug to avoid damage to the snail.



.

[JBinMN]

I am very sorry, I was confused, I never had the breech plug out. I meant the nipple. Excuse my old addled brain at times.. I get mixed up. If I had the breech plug out I most certainly would have drove the stuck ball out. Honest to G...D I swear since I passed 70 my brain malfunctions now and then. No I don't have the equipment to remove the breech plug with out possibly wrecking something. Just me, my brain jumped a cog again.

No worries from me. I just did not understand, as you saw from my post. It was confusing and now it is clear.


Like I said, G'Luck! & I hope things work out for ya & you get to shoot the rifle and it is a enjoyable shoot!