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Thread: 1909 Argentine Mauser

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    1909 Argentine Mauser

    Would this receiver be suitable to be rebarreled to 45-70? It has been converted to 30-06.
    My mother always said I was the Flower of the Family, The Blooming Idiot

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
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    Rim is probably too large............get yourself a Siamese 98 and you re cooking with gas.All the Siam needs is a barrel,everything else is right for 45/70,even the mag.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    A good smith could build a single shot with the Argentine and a really good smith might might get one round to feed out of the magazine.
    The Siamese Mauser is the best Mauser for a .45-70 but even it needs the bolt face opened up and the feed rails made wide enough to pass the big .45-70 rim out of the front end of the magazine.

    I built a Siamese Mauser in about 1972 when the complete rifle cost me $12.
    Since then I have owned many more .45-70s and I feel it is better off in a big single shot.

    If your 1909 action is in nice condition with the hinged floor plate it will probably bring $250 to $300 and would put you a good ways toward buying a ready made .45-70.
    Otherwise you can invest in your 1909 and build a rifle in a caliber compatible with the action. It will cost a lot but they do make nice rifles.
    EDG

  4. #4
    Boolit Master

    Uncle Grinch's Avatar
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    Save that 1909 for a better use and get a Mosin Nagant for your 45-70 conversion. The Siamese Mausers are getting in short supply and prices are going up. There are some videos on the Mosin 45-70’s.
    Shoot Safe,
    Mike

    Retired Telephone Man
    NRA Endowment Member
    Marion Road Gun Club
    ( www.marionroad.com )

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    A Siamese Mauser is first choice, The Lee-Enfield has been converted, Navy Arms(?) was selling them awhile back. A P14 Enfield - maybe, Mosin-Nagant should work. Most 'standard' Mausers with 8mm/06/7mm bolt faces would not convert very well. I suppose you could build a single stack magazine, or just have a single shot. Some of the other Rimmed military rifle might work?

  6. #6
    Boolit Master


    Kraschenbirn's Avatar
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    You say 'converted to 30-06'...was it rebarreled or just rechambered and, therefore, actually a '.31-06'? Some of the rechamber jobs can be really decent shooters. An acquaintance has one with a military barrel that was 'sporterized' in the '50s or '60s...rechamber, plain-Jane civilian wood and D&T for some cheap scope bases. HXP M2 Ball, at best, would print about 4" groups @ 100 yds. I loaded some '.31-06' for him; opening up case necks using a 7.62x54 sizing die and loading bullets pulled from some junk 7.62x54. Shazam...2" groups first try out of the box. Downside: now he's changed his mind about selling it (to me!) and is looking for a source for more milsurp pull-downs.

    On the other hand, if you really want to be rid of that 'converted' Argie, drop me a PM and I might just be able to help you out.

    Bill
    "I'm not often right but I've never been wrong."

    Jimmy Buffett
    "Scarlet Begonias"

  7. #7
    PAPERPATCH MASTER


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    About 25 years or so back the 1909 Argie Mauser action (especially the DWM made) were what made custom gunsmiths mouths start watering and their hands start reaching for. The advice already given about not trying thr 45/70 conversion is sound advice.Robert

  8. #8
    Boolit Grand Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by giz189 View Post
    Would this receiver be suitable to be rebarreled to 45-70? It has been converted to 30-06.
    Suitable......no.

    Can it be done.....yes but you'd end up with all of the problems already mentioned. Additional the receiver rails and magazine would require extensive alteration which will cost more, much more, than just finding an already converted Siamese Mauser and buying it.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  9. #9
    Boolit Grand Master Texas by God's Avatar
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    I fulfilled that urge years ago by rebarreling a "drill purpose " P14 Eddystone to .450 Marlin. A little action rail work but no bolt modification needed. It worked great but was a bigger gun than needed here and some other shiny bauble took its place. Put me in line behind Kraschenbirn! 1909s - DWM or FMAP- are cream of the 98 crop IMO.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master




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    Just checked mine.....numbers matching DWM. Need to move it.
    You can miss fast & you can miss a lot, but only hits count.

  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy
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    I have a Danish Krag that was converted to 45-70. The base of the Danish round is really close to the 45-70 but I still have to turn down the rims a little. It's a bit of a pain but when I got a lathe set up to do it, I just did a bag full of brass. Mine was rebarreled with a monster barrel. It weighs a ton but it's still a lot of fun to shoot.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master


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    Another thought...if the OP really has to have a .45 bolt gun, how 'bout a .458 American? No alteration to bolt face, simple rebarrel (or rebore), minimal (if any) rework of action rails, and brass easily formed from 30-06. Use .45-70 data and load anything from Trapdoor to 'OMG, that really HURT!'.

    Once upon a time...long before I learned about shooting cast in CF rifles...I built one on a VZ24 action using a Herter's barrel but, due to the scarcity of T-Rex 'round these parts, didn't keep it for long. Four or five years ago, I ran across it again at the Indy 1500 show and it didn't look like it had been shot a lot in the 30-odd years in between.

    Bill
    "I'm not often right but I've never been wrong."

    Jimmy Buffett
    "Scarlet Begonias"

  13. #13
    Boolit Grand Master Texas by God's Avatar
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    You do have to open the bolt face to Magnum size for the .458x2 unless you rebate the rims to nominal .473". The 98 Mauser in its original chamberings is nigh perfection in a bolt action rifle IMO. I say seek out the Siamese, they are out there somewhere.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    You can make a rimless .444 using the 'standard' boltface. It headspaces on the case mouth. 30-06 cases are shortened. The 458x2" or 458 American were the original 450 Marlin using standard cut-off Magnum brass, requiring the bolt face and rails be modified as Texas by God said.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master

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    Siamese Mausers make great 45-70’s. I had mine since the early seventies. ER Shaw did the barrel and action work and Texas Armament did the parkerizing. It sports a Williams peep sight on a 20 inch barrel. I glass bedded it in a Bishop stock that was paint in black texture paint. It does a number on deer and hog.

    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/asse...5&d=1477233138
    Shoot Safe,
    Mike

    Retired Telephone Man
    NRA Endowment Member
    Marion Road Gun Club
    ( www.marionroad.com )

  16. #16
    Boolit Master


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    Sorry, I spoke in error...40-year memory lapse. Thinking back, I probably used .375 H&H Mag - cut off and straight-walled - 'cause a .375 had passed through my hands around that time and I would've had some brass left after I sold it to an Air Force Major headed for Alaska.

    Bill
    Last edited by Kraschenbirn; 02-10-2019 at 06:34 PM.
    "I'm not often right but I've never been wrong."

    Jimmy Buffett
    "Scarlet Begonias"

  17. #17
    AKA: GRMPS Conditor22's Avatar
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    It would be sacrilege to desecrate a Siamese Mauser. Plus they are worth much more than most 45/70 or 30/06

  18. #18
    Boolit Grand Master Texas by God's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conditor22 View Post
    It would be sacrilege to desecrate a Siamese Mauser. Plus they are worth much more than most 45/70 or 30/06
    I agree unless it's already desecrated or just an action. I was referring to the ER Shaw conversions or the Navy Arms rifle. I believe it was Gibbs Rifle Co that offered the Lee Enfield 45-70s and they had a favorable write up in American Rifleman.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

  19. #19
    Boolit Master

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    I agree also and not just for Siamese Mausers, but for any milsurp. We need to preserve their historical value. My 45-70 conversion was done on a parts action that I picked up from Springfield Sporters. It took a while longer to accumulate the bottom metal. It is now a useful tool and has its own value, at least to me.
    Shoot Safe,
    Mike

    Retired Telephone Man
    NRA Endowment Member
    Marion Road Gun Club
    ( www.marionroad.com )

  20. #20
    Boolit Grand Master Texas by God's Avatar
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    Uncle Grinch I think Springfield sporters Inc is where I bought mine for $18.50 back in 1977. Mine was complete but I noticed that later on all their listings said the guns came without Magazine spring or floor plate. I'll never alter another original but I will mess with those that have already been under the knife. I think most of us feel this way.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check