Ballistic Products Inc - New Sabot

[Dixie Slugs]

Attached is a picture of Ballistic Products Inc's all new sabot for reloading 12 gauge round for rifled shotgun barrels. This sabots is priced right!...not like some other over-priced ones.
Dixie started testing this sabot with hard cast .503" - 460 gr bullets t a mild 1400'/" (20" Hastings barrel). There is no reason that a higher velocity will not be attained as tests go along.
While some will want to use jacketed bullets at hyper-velocity...Dixie feels that an ideal hunting load would be a 450 grto 500 gr hard cast with plenty of Meplat Area around 1700'/" to 1800'/" tops.
Any hard cast around .930" long will stabilize in the One turn in 34" of Hasting barrels.
And..some have said that a sabot will not release hard cast...Dixie did not find that to be so! We got excellent release at 1400'/"..and good general accuracy. We did not bench shoot, but rather offhand through the chrono.
Regards, James

[45 2.1]

Very nice..........Now, how about something like that for the 20 gauge rifled barrels. Soon, I hope....................

[44man]

Thank you. I have been waiting for something like that.

[longbow]

Thanks James.

That must be very new, I was surfing around the BPI site not long ago and didn't see this.

I'm sure it will be well received by boolit casters who also load for rifled shotgun.

What mould did you use? I just took a look and most .50 cal moulds I found were larger than the 0.503" you mentioned (like 0.512").

Personally I still like bore size though. I think the Dixie Tusker is one fine looking slug. I am still working towards a slow twist barrel or choke tube for RB and/or square slugs.

Something I do think would be nice is a shotcup similar to the muzzleloader plastic ball carriers but designed for shotgun to use RB's of about 0.680" to 0.690" so just small enough to fit through most chokes (if that is a requirement) but carrying a near bore size round ball.

Similar to what missionary is doing with his 0.685" RB's but without the hassle of modifying shotcups, and also being properly sized and consistent to grab rifling.

Again, a slow twist barrel would give best performance with RB or stubby slug.

Must be a birth defect, I just like big slugs and round balls.

Longbow

[GrizzLeeBear]

ooooooh, now that has all sorts of possibillities! A 20 ga. / 45 cal. version would be awesome, too.

[GrizzLeeBear]

Would it work well with the Lee C501-440-RF?

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpag...eitemid=266944

I assume you would not need the gas check since this wad would act like a sabot. 440 grains is real close to 1 oz. Would you load it using 1 oz. shot data? Or are slug loads a different animal altogether?

[Dixie Slugs]

It might work. The perfect length cast for the sabot would be at .930" and a barrel length of .630". The .630" is the length where the tits on the sabot petals press against/lock the bullet into the sabot. There would not need the gas check, but would need some .410 ga hard card to bring the lighter bullet up to where the petals lock it. Subtract your bullet length from .930: and you would be about right for filler under the bullet in the sabot.
BPI sends out some load data for various weights when you buy the sabots. It is next to impossible at present to tell what the ideal burn rates/powder charge weights will be best......and at what velocity? I would certainly start conservative.
Regards, James

[Johnch]

I would certainly start conservative.
Regards, James

Although that might be the best course

IT TAKES ALL THE FUN OUT OF IT !!!!

As soon as I check what I need to reload 28 gau Hevi shot loads and what Steel shot I have left
I plan on ordering some to try

Watch Balistic Products
They keep sending me emails about free shipping good for a few days

But not right now

http://balisticproducts.com/
Upper left side on the home page

$9.99 for 50
Guess I can afore to try a few

John

[GrizzLeeBear]

Just ran some ballistics with the C500-440-FN. Lee shows a BC of .296. At 1500 fps it has muzzle energy of 1900 ft/lb. Sighted in 2" high at 100 yds. it is 3.5" low at 150 yds. Velocity is still over 1200 fps at 150 yds. with 1500 ft/lb. of energy.
Can probably go a fair bit faster than this, but recoil with this type of load should be relatively mild. Cast out of soft alloy like 50/50 wheelweight/pure lead it would make a dandy deer thumper.
Might have to get a slug barrel for the 870 after all.

[Dixie Slugs]

Interestig isn't it?.....James

[remy3424]

Does anyone know much about these??? What kinda set-up do you need??? Can your MEC 600JR do most, plus a roll crimp??? It still might be close to $6 a box, but that's better than $10 for Hornady slugs!! What mold would work well in these sabots??? That is where the real savings will come!!!

[yondering]

A little bit of a tangent topic here:
So, I looked at this sabot on BPI's site, then started looking at some other stuff they offer. I noticed they have unslit shot wads, both cushioned and without the cushion. I didn't realize until now that you could get wads that were unslit. I have a partial box of ammo left from some "police special 12" ammo, that consists of a thick unslit shot cup, filled with #12 shot, and epoxy over the top of the shot to hold it in place. When fired, the shot, in the cup, stays together as a slug, until impact. Quite an impressive round, when fired at wood targets, water bottles, etc. I can't think of any "sporting" use for it, except maybe hunting coyotes, but it is fun to play with. I was thinking of buying some of these unslit wads from BPI and loading some of these myself.
Being a newbie to shotshells, how does one load with an uncushioned shot cup? Do you use card/felt wads, or a separate plastic shot cushion, or what? I haven't seen load data for uncushioned wads, but maybe I just haven't looked hard enough.

[Johnch]

A
Being a newbie to shotshells, how does one load with an uncushioned shot cup? Do you use card/felt wads, or a separate plastic shot cushion, or what? I haven't seen load data for uncushioned wads, but maybe I just haven't looked hard enough.

Those wads are designed for Steel shot loads or max capisity of lead shot for turkey loads

I have a ......... lets just several K of those wads
As I load a bunch of steel shot for ducks

So normaly you would just a felt or card wad under and or over the shot to take up the excess space in the wad
But us cheap SOB's use a chunk of foam P Nut on top of the shot
Works great and I get lots of sent to me for free

So I can't help you with loads like you are interested in

But if you want to try a few
PM me your address



John

[yondering]

Those wads are designed for Steel shot loads or max capisity of lead shot for turkey loads

I have a ......... lets just several K of those wads
As I load a bunch of steel shot for ducks

So normaly you would just a felt or card wad under and or over the shot to take up the excess space in the wad
But us cheap SOB's use a chunk of foam P Nut on top of the shot
Works great and I get lots of sent to me for free

So I can't help you with loads like you are interested in

But if you want to try a few
PM me your address



John

The loads should be the same, only difference would be no slits in the wad, and a little epoxy or hot glue to seal the top, so the shot doesn't come out. Can you direct me to some load data?

If you have some extra unslit wads, I'd be interested to try a few. I'll send you a pm.
Thanks.

[snuffy]

This thread piqued my interest enough to look into loading some of the sabots. That lead into the purchase today of a rifled BBL. for my old 870. I also ordered the lee .501-440 FN mold from midway. Thanks for the heads up, James! A couple pounds of powder, a box of J-word projectiles,(.500 350 xtp), needed to load these highly specialized loads, I'm out almost $400.00! Two orders now to BPI and a trip up to harbor freight for a cheap drill press!

Take a look at this discussion over on THR.
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=399789

I'll be shooting some of those this weekend. I even took a days vacation to work up loads tomorrow. I'll post some results from that shooting session. I may even get a chance to shoot some of the 440 lead boolits!

[Dixie Slugs]

Well, I see what is happening is exactly what I was afraid would happen...pushing the envelope to that max!
BPI has to go to the top limit to compete with some stuff that is aimed at the boys in Shotgun-Only-States that are trying to make rifles out of shotguns!
Now...as far as Ole' Dixie (me) is concerned, this sabot opens all matter of doors for the everyday reloader to make up outstanding brush loads for large and/or dangerous game.
Any hard cast bullets it the 450 to 500 gr, with a meplat of 70%, at a velocity of 1600'/" to 1700'/" will handle anything that walks. Recoil is a factor that many overlook indeed! These people that push to the max...will fade away after the first brain rush! What will be left will be the regular meat hunter/reloaders that whats more smashdown!
Now lets recap:
(1) Any hard cast that is not longer than .930" will stabilize in the Hastings barrels.
(2) the tits in the petals are .630" from the base of the sabot and will grip the above bullet perfect.
(3) Any cast bullet that is at least .503" and designed as above is perfect.
(4) You do not need the clear breakable overshot wad if you use a bullet at least .930". Simply roll down onto the top of the sabot.
(5) You do not need the little plastic thing under the sabot. Use a BPI X12X over the powder and whatever hard waxed filler wad that sets the crimp index.
(6) It looks like Longshot is working best in the 460 to 500 gr bullet load.
In the 12 ga 3"....38 grs of Longshot - X12X - 3/8" hard waxed wad - sabot - 460 to 500 gr hard cast - roll crimp down on the sabot.
And....use a little common sense at to what recoil you want! Leave the top end loads for the fellows that carry the big Bowie knives and play head games by having something to impress others..."mine is bigger that yours" mindset!
What more can I say?
Regards, James

[dakotashooter2]

I smell a group buy mold for a bullet specially designed for this sabot!!!!!!!!!!!

[GrizzLeeBear]

... Recoil is a factor that many overlook indeed! These people that push to the max...will fade away after the first brain rush! What will be left will be the regular meat hunter/reloaders that whats more smashdown!

Indeed! The loads they were talking about over at THR would be torture to shoot to say the least. Like I said in my previous post, a 440 gr. boolit going 1500 - 1600 fps. would be plenty of power for whitetails out to at least 150 yds.

Would you be able load these on a regular shotgun loader with a folded crimp? I have an old Hornady shotgun press that was left in a house my sister-in-law bought. Needs cleaned up, but looks to be functional.

Also, I have 3 - 4 lb.s of Unique and 4 - 5 lb.s of Win. 540 (same as HS-6). Would these work for these type of loads?

[Dixie Slugs]

For those here that are interested, I would be happy to share the specs on the .503" - 460 gr bullet at we have ordered from Mountain Molds. The specs are based on the sabot as to the length where the tits on the petals engage tihe bullet and the length of the slug/bullet to the top of the sabot...plus the length for the one tuen in 34" rifled barrels.
Now....I supposed one could fold crimp the load? For hunting loads I would suggest new primed hulls and rolled crimp.
As for powders....we have tested two at present. One is Primex 513 that is not available to the public and the other is Longshot. I just can not justify trying to make a powder do (although it might) just because we have some on hand.
Over time there will be lots of hobbyist playing with this and that. That's all well and good, but do it within safe loading.
I also agreee that there is a balance of bullet weight - velocity - recoil that will develop a fine hunting load indeed.
We will be testing, as we do with all of our production loads, at next year's Linebaugh Seminar for penetration, bullet performance, and in the Bone Box.
I have already spoken to Todd Corder, in depth, about the future planss with this sabot and cast bullets.
Now...very few reloaders buy factory ammo! With that in mind, and my feeling toward reloaders and Cast Boolits, Dixie will publish the loading data for their sabot load.
However, do not come to us asking for jacketed bullet loads! There are other people and other forums that play around with that! We specialize in hard cast heat treat ammo for hunting deer/hogs and whatever!
Regards, James

[Blammer]

james, I would be interested in the specs for the bullet you are getting from MM.

I would happily draw the bullet with dimensions and give you the copy, for gratis, if you are interested.

Sharing of this information would be greatly appreciated my many, including me.