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Thread: Converting Pardus (Turkish Folder) 12 ga. to 357 Mag

  1. #41
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texas by God View Post
    I'm wanting to do a .41 Magnum using an Uzi .41 AE barrel rechambered and set into a Stevens 16 ga. Model 94 with those "beautiful" Tenite stocks. Maybe next year.....
    That sounds good. Where are you getting the Uzi barrels?

  2. #42
    Boolit Grand Master Texas by God's Avatar
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    Numrich has them last I looked. I called them to see if they were chrome lined like the 9mm but the lady said they weren't so they'd work.

  3. #43
    Boolit Master
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    I received my Max brass and bullets yesterday. The 180gr bullets only had one crimp groove. I was planning on seating them out and crimping on the lower groove. Guess I'll contact Hornady and see what's up.


  4. #44
    Boolit Master Jedman's Avatar
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    That is odd, they have always had 2 crimp grooves. For most powders you don't really need a crimp for a single shot. My 38 spl. Rifle that I built with the timberwolf barrel and no reamer likes cast being just slightly engraved into the rifling for best accuracy.
    The rifles I used the GBO max reamer have shot good with jacketed, plated and cast once you find the right load. GOod Luck ! I live in NW Ohio and know what the weather has been and I would not like to be working on load development right now.

    Jedman

  5. #45
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    Yep, the weather stinks down here. I was able to shoot one over the chrono Sunday before the drizzling, freezing rain started. (158gr XTP, 19gr Lil'Gun - 1938 fps)

    Good to know the GBO chamber shoots well with a variety of bullets. I'd rather not crimp. I'll post Hornady's response once I hear from them.

  6. #46
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    Here's Hornady's response, "This is not a design change. However what happens here is depending on what type of bullet press these are ran on, they may use a transfer tool to put the cannelure on which needs two for alignment and it they use a finish tool for this it can be done with a single cannelure."

    I've asked for clarification. I find it hard to believe they don't have a standard design but instead change the number of crimp grooves depending on the machine they choose to run for a batch.

  7. #47
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    Evidently, Hornady will stick whatever they want in the box. I asked Hornady, " Is your #35771 bullet supposed to have one or two crimp grooves?"

    Hornady's response , "It can have either one or two cannelures on the bullet depending on the press tooling they are using. "

    Brownells couldn't be bothered to take a close look. The rep said the picture on the box shows a bullet with one crimp groove.

  8. #48
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    Latest info is that the bullet was changed in the middle of 2018 "due to new manufacturing process change."

    That settled, I shot two over the chrono - 20 gr Lil' Gun and 158 XTP = 1996 fps. 18 gr Lil' Gun and 180 Gr XTP = 1700 fps. Everything looks fine so I'm going to load up a few and see how they shoot. If it ever gets dry and warm enough.

  9. #49
    Boolit Master
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    I went out this morning and set up a target at 60 yds.

    The 20gr Lil' Gun, 158gr XTP, 1996 fps load put four into 1.2"



    The 18gr Lil' Gun, 180gr XTP, 1700 fps load put four into .8"



    I was really pleased with how it shot the heavier bullets. My goal was to have a 125 yard deer rifle and it should be plenty accurate for that. Time now to find a good cast bullet mold.

  10. #50
    Boolit Grand Master Texas by God's Avatar
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    Looking great. Either of those loads will hunt!

  11. #51
    Boolit Master Jedman's Avatar
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    Looks good ! If you ever shoot deer with the 180 XTP you are at the upper limit of its velocity range at 1700 fps for a close range shot as they will come apart as they are really a pistol bullet.
    The 158 XTP FP is good up to 2000 fps. I am sure you know but sometimes just a small change in the powder charge could turn that .8 group into one ragged hole.

    If you find a good 200 gr. + or - cast that will shoot 1.5" or better at 100 you will have a lot of confidence using it for deer. I have found all of my 357 max rifles to shoot great with R 7 powder and 200 gr. It's a slower load and I don't think you can get enough in the case to be over pressure but it shoots great.

    Jedman

  12. #52
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    Thanks, guys.

    I figured I was pushing the velocity for both bullets. I have a 358 Win. that I loaded up with the 200gr RCBS (NOE clone) bullet at about 1850 fps. I shoot deer on crop damage permits and took a half a dozen deer one summer with that load and had no problems. I sold my mold, but still have some of those bullets. I'll load some of those next. I'm thinking about getting the Lee 2- cavity copy of that bullet and modifying the nose to make it shorter.

    I'll have to get some Reloader 7 powder. But serious load development will have to wait for warmer weather. For now I'm satisfied that this project is a success and I'll have a cheap, foldable, accurate rifle.

  13. #53
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    If I may add, my oldest son killed a young doe with a .44 caliber XTP when he was 11 or 12 using a youth muzzle loader. Bullet was in a plastic sabot and used 70 grains of Hogdon Triple Seven.

    It was the most destructive gun shot wound I ever saw and ruined a whole shoulder and a lot of the other. Worse, the deer ran probably 50 yards into the woods before falling down, I couldn't believe it, never had one run that far with a cast conical or SWC in muzzle loaders before or since. Pulled quite a few pieces of bullet jacket out of the deer, along with bone fragments etc.

    The boy made a very good shot, couldn't have asked for better, I considered it a bullet failure and I'll never use one of those XTPs on a deer again.

  14. #54
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    17gr Lil' Gun, 216gr 35-200 (NOE clone) gas checked and lubed, 1725 fps, four shots, 60 yds.


  15. #55
    Boolit Master Jedman's Avatar
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    That will do it ! Jedman

  16. #56
    Boolit Grand Master Texas by God's Avatar
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    That's great! IMI apparently makes good barrels, don't they? My H&R/ Uzi 9mm stub shoots cheap fmj into neat little short range groups.
    Gotta get that .41 AE barrel!

  17. #57
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    Yes, they do! I can't believe how easy it was to find a good load. I wish I could find one of the Timberwolf .44 Mag barrels. At $110 I think the Uzi barrel might be a little too much for me for a cheap project, but the prospect of a 41 Mag does interest me. Maybe they will have a sale.

    BTW, that $89 Pardus makes a nice smooth, tight rifle with a little deburring and polishing. You guys considering a barrel stub project should consider it.

  18. #58
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    I've been getting a little primer bulge using mag pistol primers so I tried rifle primers. I started getting misfires again so I added another shim to the hammer spring. Now the trigger pull is a little under 6 lbs. Ugh.

    I loaded a few 230 gr NOE bullets. They are powder coated, plain based, and sized to .358.



    I used 16.5 gr of Lil' Gun. I did not run them over the chrono.

    I shot three at 100 yards for a 1.4" group.



    At this point I think I've reached the limit of what this rifle will do. My original plan was to have a 357 Mag rifle and now I'm trying to make it into a 35 Rem.

    So, I'm going to back off and see if I can come up with a 180 gr cast bullet at about 1600 fps. I'll also remove a shim from the hammer spring and reduce the trigger pull by a pound.
    Last edited by KLR; 03-04-2019 at 01:56 PM.

  19. #59
    Boolit Master Moleman-'s Avatar
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    Nice job on the conversion! I've used half a dozen of the timberwolf blanks for 357 and 9mm and have been happy with them. Think I've still got 2-3 9mm that were made with them.

  20. #60
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    Thanks! The only negative with the design is that small, light hammer. I'm thinking about making a new hammer with a little more mass to it. Or maybe drilling a few holes in the current one and adding some lead.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check