Converting Pardus (Turkish Folder) 12 ga. to 357 Mag

[KLR]

I'm wanting to do a .41 Magnum using an Uzi .41 AE barrel rechambered and set into a Stevens 16 ga. Model 94 with those "beautiful" Tenite stocks. Maybe next year.....

That sounds good. Where are you getting the Uzi barrels?

[Texas by God]

Numrich has them last I looked. I called them to see if they were chrome lined like the 9mm but the lady said they weren't so they'd work.

[KLR]

I received my Max brass and bullets yesterday. The 180gr bullets only had one crimp groove. I was planning on seating them out and crimping on the lower groove. Guess I'll contact Hornady and see what's up.

[Jedman]

That is odd, they have always had 2 crimp grooves. For most powders you don't really need a crimp for a single shot. My 38 spl. Rifle that I built with the timberwolf barrel and no reamer likes cast being just slightly engraved into the rifling for best accuracy.
The rifles I used the GBO max reamer have shot good with jacketed, plated and cast once you find the right load. GOod Luck ! I live in NW Ohio and know what the weather has been and I would not like to be working on load development right now.

Jedman

[KLR]

Yep, the weather stinks down here. I was able to shoot one over the chrono Sunday before the drizzling, freezing rain started. (158gr XTP, 19gr Lil'Gun - 1938 fps)

Good to know the GBO chamber shoots well with a variety of bullets. I'd rather not crimp. I'll post Hornady's response once I hear from them.

[KLR]

Here's Hornady's response, "This is not a design change. However what happens here is depending on what type of bullet press these are ran on, they may use a transfer tool to put the cannelure on which needs two for alignment and it they use a finish tool for this it can be done with a single cannelure."

I've asked for clarification. I find it hard to believe they don't have a standard design but instead change the number of crimp grooves depending on the machine they choose to run for a batch.

[KLR]

Evidently, Hornady will stick whatever they want in the box. I asked Hornady, " Is your #35771 bullet supposed to have one or two crimp grooves?"

Hornady's response , "It can have either one or two cannelures on the bullet depending on the press tooling they are using. "

Brownells couldn't be bothered to take a close look. The rep said the picture on the box shows a bullet with one crimp groove.

[KLR]

Latest info is that the bullet was changed in the middle of 2018 "due to new manufacturing process change."

That settled, I shot two over the chrono - 20 gr Lil' Gun and 158 XTP = 1996 fps. 18 gr Lil' Gun and 180 Gr XTP = 1700 fps. Everything looks fine so I'm going to load up a few and see how they shoot. If it ever gets dry and warm enough.

[KLR]

I went out this morning and set up a target at 60 yds.

The 20gr Lil' Gun, 158gr XTP, 1996 fps load put four into 1.2"



The 18gr Lil' Gun, 180gr XTP, 1700 fps load put four into .8"



I was really pleased with how it shot the heavier bullets. My goal was to have a 125 yard deer rifle and it should be plenty accurate for that. Time now to find a good cast bullet mold.

[Texas by God]

Looking great. Either of those loads will hunt!

[Jedman]

Looks good ! If you ever shoot deer with the 180 XTP you are at the upper limit of its velocity range at 1700 fps for a close range shot as they will come apart as they are really a pistol bullet.
The 158 XTP FP is good up to 2000 fps. I am sure you know but sometimes just a small change in the powder charge could turn that .8 group into one ragged hole.

If you find a good 200 gr. + or - cast that will shoot 1.5" or better at 100 you will have a lot of confidence using it for deer. I have found all of my 357 max rifles to shoot great with R 7 powder and 200 gr. It's a slower load and I don't think you can get enough in the case to be over pressure but it shoots great.

Jedman

[KLR]

Thanks, guys.

I figured I was pushing the velocity for both bullets. I have a 358 Win. that I loaded up with the 200gr RCBS (NOE clone) bullet at about 1850 fps. I shoot deer on crop damage permits and took a half a dozen deer one summer with that load and had no problems. I sold my mold, but still have some of those bullets. I'll load some of those next. I'm thinking about getting the Lee 2- cavity copy of that bullet and modifying the nose to make it shorter.

I'll have to get some Reloader 7 powder. But serious load development will have to wait for warmer weather. For now I'm satisfied that this project is a success and I'll have a cheap, foldable, accurate rifle.

[richhodg66]

If I may add, my oldest son killed a young doe with a .44 caliber XTP when he was 11 or 12 using a youth muzzle loader. Bullet was in a plastic sabot and used 70 grains of Hogdon Triple Seven.

It was the most destructive gun shot wound I ever saw and ruined a whole shoulder and a lot of the other. Worse, the deer ran probably 50 yards into the woods before falling down, I couldn't believe it, never had one run that far with a cast conical or SWC in muzzle loaders before or since. Pulled quite a few pieces of bullet jacket out of the deer, along with bone fragments etc.

The boy made a very good shot, couldn't have asked for better, I considered it a bullet failure and I'll never use one of those XTPs on a deer again.

[KLR]

17gr Lil' Gun, 216gr 35-200 (NOE clone) gas checked and lubed, 1725 fps, four shots, 60 yds.

[Jedman]

That will do it ! Jedman

[Texas by God]

That's great! IMI apparently makes good barrels, don't they? My H&R/ Uzi 9mm stub shoots cheap fmj into neat little short range groups.
Gotta get that .41 AE barrel!

[KLR]

Yes, they do! I can't believe how easy it was to find a good load. I wish I could find one of the Timberwolf .44 Mag barrels. At $110 I think the Uzi barrel might be a little too much for me for a cheap project, but the prospect of a 41 Mag does interest me. Maybe they will have a sale.

BTW, that $89 Pardus makes a nice smooth, tight rifle with a little deburring and polishing. You guys considering a barrel stub project should consider it.

[KLR]

I've been getting a little primer bulge using mag pistol primers so I tried rifle primers. I started getting misfires again so I added another shim to the hammer spring. Now the trigger pull is a little under 6 lbs. Ugh.

I loaded a few 230 gr NOE bullets. They are powder coated, plain based, and sized to .358.



I used 16.5 gr of Lil' Gun. I did not run them over the chrono.

I shot three at 100 yards for a 1.4" group.



At this point I think I've reached the limit of what this rifle will do. My original plan was to have a 357 Mag rifle and now I'm trying to make it into a 35 Rem.

So, I'm going to back off and see if I can come up with a 180 gr cast bullet at about 1600 fps. I'll also remove a shim from the hammer spring and reduce the trigger pull by a pound.

[Moleman-]

Nice job on the conversion! I've used half a dozen of the timberwolf blanks for 357 and 9mm and have been happy with them. Think I've still got 2-3 9mm that were made with them.

[KLR]

Thanks! The only negative with the design is that small, light hammer. I'm thinking about making a new hammer with a little more mass to it. Or maybe drilling a few holes in the current one and adding some lead.